AR-10 and Cast
- Thread starter Winelover
- Start date
Winelover
North Central Arkansas
What's Rick's revolver's got to do with it? Rick has never used the NRA formula in anything. Not in a revolver, not in the m1A, not in anything. I had some, tried to give it to you but you turned it down. Gave it to Bill.
Better go back and reread my post......never accused you of using NRA 50-50......just reiterating the general statement you made about different lubes and accuracy. If you recall, before I got my Star, we we lubing bullets at your place and using your LBT Blue. When I got my Star, I began using Carnuba Red. Don't remember the LBT Blue doing significantly better then CR.
Have you tried CR in just the bottom groove?
I have never shot any LBT lube but if they are softer than CR I bet I would like them. I have about 20 sticks of CR I should send you. I won't be using them.
Those results are pretty damn good. I sure wouldn't complain about results like that.
Can Rick's M1A do that well?
Can the base of the Lab Radar be tilted to match the slope of the range?
I have never shot any LBT lube but if they are softer than CR I bet I would like them. I have about 20 sticks of CR I should send you. I won't be using them.
Those results are pretty damn good. I sure wouldn't complain about results like that.
Can Rick's M1A do that well?
Can the base of the Lab Radar be tilted to match the slope of the range?
Ian
Notorious member
Oohhh, ouch.
Ian
Notorious member
Oh, I know. Just ribbing you both, particularly because I've been giving him a hard time for a while about not shooting it. Or at least not saying anything about shooting it. I can't talk, though, I haven't shot mine in quite a while either. BUT, I did get close to what John is getting for groups before I put it away for a while.
That was in reference to this . . . where he replied to your statement that you use to use 50/50.
.
Winelover
North Central Arkansas
BTW, I never mentioned revolvers, in this thread.
However, Rick does have a 308W barreled silhouette handgun. He actually brought it over, the first time we tried out the the Lab Radar. So, at least, it's caliber appropriate.
I'm not convinced that lube flyers are the issue. Are there definitive tests? A bore scope inspection shows my barrel is exceptionally clean, after shooting cast, so I assume the CR is doing it's job.
Considering, that I don't weigh bullets, nor brass. Don't resize gas checks or use special tooling, in that regard. Don't anneal necks or even turn them for that matter. There could be a combination of reasons for a wandering bullet. And..... I won't live long enough to explore them all, with every combination of powers and charges. What I do know is, that very little changes (< 1 grain) in powder charges will double or even triple group sizes. I don't expect to reach high velocities with cast......every powder I've tried.....groups will open up fast when pushing the velocity envelope. And believe me.....I've tried a whole host of them. Results are always the same. Could be because of bullet fit, but with any autoloader, very few will feed with 100% reliability and that is the main concern.
The quest goes on........
However, Rick does have a 308W barreled silhouette handgun. He actually brought it over, the first time we tried out the the Lab Radar. So, at least, it's caliber appropriate.
I'm not convinced that lube flyers are the issue. Are there definitive tests? A bore scope inspection shows my barrel is exceptionally clean, after shooting cast, so I assume the CR is doing it's job.
Considering, that I don't weigh bullets, nor brass. Don't resize gas checks or use special tooling, in that regard. Don't anneal necks or even turn them for that matter. There could be a combination of reasons for a wandering bullet. And..... I won't live long enough to explore them all, with every combination of powers and charges. What I do know is, that very little changes (< 1 grain) in powder charges will double or even triple group sizes. I don't expect to reach high velocities with cast......every powder I've tried.....groups will open up fast when pushing the velocity envelope. And believe me.....I've tried a whole host of them. Results are always the same. Could be because of bullet fit, but with any autoloader, very few will feed with 100% reliability and that is the main concern.
The quest goes on........
fiver
Well-Known Member
100% function trumps accuracy every single time.
my comments were on the amount of lube the boolit holds.
and that the slight amount of verti errrr horizontal umm 45* stringing is usually caused by the primers ignition characteristics.
it could be caused by the rifle glancing off your elbow over the trucks hood too.
my comments were on the amount of lube the boolit holds.
and that the slight amount of verti errrr horizontal umm 45* stringing is usually caused by the primers ignition characteristics.
it could be caused by the rifle glancing off your elbow over the trucks hood too.
Cliff
Member
Any further updates on this thread?
I recently assembled an Ar308 from various new parts and a 80% lower, PSA 18'' 1/10 barrel, topped with a Leupold 8.5-25LR. After testing for accuracy with 168g. Hornadys & IMR4064, I started to test, for function mainly, with cast. Alloy was Foundry type from Roto Metals mixed with 50/50 (ww/pure) 1 part foundry to 2 parts 50/50, powder coated and air cooled. I did try some NOE 311299, air cooled, lubed (by hand) with fiver's "simple lube" and Varget, one batch sized at .310 and some at .311. Chrony at 10 ft. the average was 1875 fps. No leading except for 2 or 3 specks on the cleaning patch. Powder coated was pushed a little more, with IMR4895 average was 2110fps. with the 311299, and 2076fps. with Lee's 312-155 2R. I tried Lymans older 311644 with the lube groves in the nose, and Lymans 311332, both powder coated, just to be sure they cycled the action and held the bolt open. They did but I didn't chronograph them. All loads tested held the bolt open, except the 312-255.
I did try a load with 35.0g. of IMR4350 and powder coated 311299's. Average velocity was 1644 fps. and didn't hold the bolt open.
I will be interesting to see how the 311644 and the 311332 shoot. Their so far out of round, It's amazing. Maybe the barrel will make them round. LOL !! Just got some Superhard, Supertough, and some Tin from Roto Metals on Monday. But........ it's deer season here, and I don't want to ruin anyones chances, by shooting too much.
I live on a side road, one mile from the main road. The shooting range is out of my basement window, or off of my deck. 100 yards to 350 yards. Or 40 yards from the basement porch into a sand trap. Usually use this short range to set up scopes, and to get different loads centered on paper. Then to 100 yards to test. My lube sizer has Ben's Red in it, but haven't tried it yet. The powder used is Candy colors from Powder by The Pound. Cases were L.C. and the primers were old Winchesters WLR from the 1980's and CCI #34's. So far I haven't tried for accuracy, just functioning of the rifle. Anyways, this is where I started. Also, I've been casting and reloading for many years. But this casting for a gas gun is new to me. Thanks ''''''' I think """" to Winelover for his testing, here and on the other site. It's the reason I started this project.
I'm also looking at NOE's 30XCB, and, or, the 311-169 ELCO. Any thoughts on these? Is there a better choice? Also, any criticism or other comments would be fine.
Thanks Cliff
I recently assembled an Ar308 from various new parts and a 80% lower, PSA 18'' 1/10 barrel, topped with a Leupold 8.5-25LR. After testing for accuracy with 168g. Hornadys & IMR4064, I started to test, for function mainly, with cast. Alloy was Foundry type from Roto Metals mixed with 50/50 (ww/pure) 1 part foundry to 2 parts 50/50, powder coated and air cooled. I did try some NOE 311299, air cooled, lubed (by hand) with fiver's "simple lube" and Varget, one batch sized at .310 and some at .311. Chrony at 10 ft. the average was 1875 fps. No leading except for 2 or 3 specks on the cleaning patch. Powder coated was pushed a little more, with IMR4895 average was 2110fps. with the 311299, and 2076fps. with Lee's 312-155 2R. I tried Lymans older 311644 with the lube groves in the nose, and Lymans 311332, both powder coated, just to be sure they cycled the action and held the bolt open. They did but I didn't chronograph them. All loads tested held the bolt open, except the 312-255.
I did try a load with 35.0g. of IMR4350 and powder coated 311299's. Average velocity was 1644 fps. and didn't hold the bolt open.
I will be interesting to see how the 311644 and the 311332 shoot. Their so far out of round, It's amazing. Maybe the barrel will make them round. LOL !! Just got some Superhard, Supertough, and some Tin from Roto Metals on Monday. But........ it's deer season here, and I don't want to ruin anyones chances, by shooting too much.
I live on a side road, one mile from the main road. The shooting range is out of my basement window, or off of my deck. 100 yards to 350 yards. Or 40 yards from the basement porch into a sand trap. Usually use this short range to set up scopes, and to get different loads centered on paper. Then to 100 yards to test. My lube sizer has Ben's Red in it, but haven't tried it yet. The powder used is Candy colors from Powder by The Pound. Cases were L.C. and the primers were old Winchesters WLR from the 1980's and CCI #34's. So far I haven't tried for accuracy, just functioning of the rifle. Anyways, this is where I started. Also, I've been casting and reloading for many years. But this casting for a gas gun is new to me. Thanks ''''''' I think """" to Winelover for his testing, here and on the other site. It's the reason I started this project.
I'm also looking at NOE's 30XCB, and, or, the 311-169 ELCO. Any thoughts on these? Is there a better choice? Also, any criticism or other comments would be fine.
Thanks Cliff
Cliff
Member
Thanks Popper. 1 1/2 MOA would be great, and 2400 should be easily obtained from an 18'' barrel. But, 1-1/2 will be the challenge. Accurate mold 31-165A & C seem to be somewhat similar to the
311-644. The 311-644 has a tapered section along the side. Here's the line up so far....
Lee 312-155 / NOE 311299 / Lyman's 311-332 & 311644
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311-644. The 311-644 has a tapered section along the side. Here's the line up so far....
Lee 312-155 / NOE 311299 / Lyman's 311-332 & 311644
Cliff
Member
Coating is Candy Apple colors from Powder by the pound. From left to right the colors are red, violet, blue and purple.
Last night I cast various 30 cal. bullets. 10 pounds w/w + 5 ounces of Roto Metals #3 babbitt. Heat treated and quenched in ice water just a few minutes ago. They were sized and gas checked first. Plan to shoot these lubed with 2500+
Last night I cast various 30 cal. bullets. 10 pounds w/w + 5 ounces of Roto Metals #3 babbitt. Heat treated and quenched in ice water just a few minutes ago. They were sized and gas checked first. Plan to shoot these lubed with 2500+
F
freebullet
Guest
Cliff
Those are some pretty wild looking finishes. Definitely some outside the box coatings. What application method are you using?
Those are some pretty wild looking finishes. Definitely some outside the box coatings. What application method are you using?
Cliff
Member
The Harbor Freight ESPC gun.
