Distance shooting with cast bullets...

[waco]

I'm in the middle of working up loads in the 30-06 with both the NOE 315 clone and the 312299. I have 10" and 12" steel plates out at 500 yards I would like to try to hit consistently with cast.
So, Taco. Did you have a certain caliber/rifle in mind?

 

[freebullet]

We shoot plain base mostly inside 200. Im expanding horizons though.

I do recall writings of the 45 70 being shot to 25-2700 yards.

 

[fiver]

I think that much of the 45-70 trials were held at sandy hook.

the biggest problem with shooting 30 cal rifles at longer distances is the sight adjustments.
when you start out at 3-400 settings to get to the 100yd line and add 5+ moa every 100 yds you quickly run out of options.

 

[KHornet]

Agree Fiver. I plan to play with a 303 Brit MIII and a P14 at 2-400
come spring.

Paul

 

[Full.lead.taco]

I have multiple firearms to choose from, but was wondering more who has done it before and what worked for them. Curious as to the actual "been there, done that" type of examples. Who has done it, what they used, and the distances they shot at successfully if that makes sense. What speeds are you going to try to push those bullets in the 06?

I'm in the middle of working up loads in the 30-06 with both the NOE 315 clone and the 312299. I have 10" and 12" steel plates out at 500 yards I would like to try to hit consistently with cast.
So, Taco. Did you have a certain caliber/rifle in mind?

 

[Full.lead.taco]

I recently picked up a 1871/1971 NRA musket edition long barrel 94' with a ladder sight. I figured that this might be a candidate with the ladder sight--as long as the rifle can shoot. Maybe single feeding pointy bullets.

I think that much of the 45-70 trials were held at sandy hook.

the biggest problem with shooting 30 cal rifles at longer distances is the sight adjustments.
when you start out at 3-400 settings to get to the 100yd line and add 5+ moa every 100 yds you quickly run out of options.

 

[Full.lead.taco]

Pete, good info. Always happy to see people test things for themselves instead of relying on what "the experts" say.

We shoot cast in handguns (usually revolvers) out to 500 yards all the time. Same spot ol' Elmer Keith used in fact that he referred to as "The BLM Range" in his writings. I've shot .44 Magnum with 429421 at our 1000 yard range in the same vicinity. We put a large 42" white box halfway up the mountain (we call it a hill) for an aiming point. The .44 will surprise you at that range. I've shot my Savage 340 .30-30 at the same 1000 yards with 31141 and almost broke a balloon several times. (We used 9" diameter balloons taped to metal fence posts) Long range will tell you if your cast bullets have voids inside. I've shot the .45-70 W A Y O U T. 1000 or more..... Far enough flight time was several seconds! I wouldn't want someone shooting that ol' gal with cast bullets at me out there..... especially if they could dope the range!
I read in Whelen's book "The American Rifle" (1918) where he said the .38-40 became inaccurate after about 150 yards. Shook me up some as I was right in the midst of load development with my Model 92 for my Canadian elk hunt. It kept gnawing on me too.... So when I was happy with my load I tried them at 500 yards..... These were cast soft (8.5 bhn) and gaschecked with checks I made. In the case of my .38-40 and my loads Townsend Whelen was wrong!

Pete

 

[waco]

What speeds are you going to try to push those bullets in the 06?

I have some of both cast up that I heat treated to about 19bhn. I was thinking around 18-1900fps.

 

[Full.lead.taco]

I was playing around with the Encore pistol on Wed and shot some 5744 loads with the NOE Saeco 315 mold. I was shooting a large steel plate at 370 yards with the pistol grip and rifle barrel in 30-06 and a low power scout scope. Hits were pretty easy to repeat, but I need to put on the rifle stock if I want to shoot smaller targets and farther distances. I will try to post a video when I get a chance (probably this next week or so). On the video, it was cool to see the vapor trail right before hitting the steel plate.

 

[Bodie]

Furthest out for me was about 1350 yds. Rifle and load:
Shiloh Sharps #1 Sporter .45-70 30" barrel
MVA LR Soule rear with Hadley eye cup. MVA spirit level front with 125 aperature
535 gr Steve Brooks Creedmore .459
SPG lube .60 Walters fiber wad
63 gr Swiss 1 1/2 Fg BP Fed 215 primer
Winchester brass un-sized
This load shoots better than I can see. This is my standard BPCR Silhouette set yp.

 

[Full.lead.taco]

Furthest out for me was about 1350 yds. Rifle and load:
Shiloh Sharps #1 Sporter .45-70 30" barrel
MVA LR Soule rear with Hadley eye cup. MVA spirit level front with 125 aperature
535 gr Steve Brooks Creedmore .459
SPG lube .60 Walters fiber wad
63 gr Swiss 1 1/2 Fg BP Fed 215 primer
Winchester brass un-sized
This load shoots better than I can see. This is my standard BPCR Silhouette set yp.

How fast are those 535's coming out of the rifle?

 

[waco]

How fast are those 535's coming out of the rifle?

1,100 or less I would think.

 

[Bodie]

Never ran em across screens. 1100 to 1200 I woyld guess. All I care is how they do at the 500 meter rams!

 

[longhunter]

Bodie and I have similar experiences. Same gun, same sights brass all of it. I used a card wad that was much thinner. I was using a heavily compressed load of 70 gr of 11/2 Swiss.
Shot mid range with it just fine. Long range was good out to 800 yards. At 1000 my load fell apart. I think the bullets lost stability and tumbled. The bullets are almost falling vertical.
As he said shoots better than I can see.
Jon

 

[oscarflytyer]

I think that much of the 45-70 trials were held at sandy hook.

the biggest problem with shooting 30 cal rifles at longer distances is the sight adjustments.
when you start out at 3-400 settings to get to the 100yd line and add 5+ moa every 100 yds you quickly run out of options.

I remember reading about the 45-70 trials at sandy hook. iirc, at something like 2700 yds, they were penetrating 1" boards(?) and, this part I remember, driving 13" into the sand! And, the boards were set at a 30 deg angle for the bullet to hit square. More like a mortar coming in!

and Fiver - trick the sight problem is a tang Vernier peep or a ladder. Vernier will be much more accurate I think - at least with my old eyes. I recently picked up a Remington Rolling Block built out to 45-70 w/ a Vernier. Haven't shot it yet, but once set up would like to try longer range with it.

 

[waco]

trick the sight problem is a tang Vernier peep or a ladder.

Or buy a scope that has 120moa of adjustment.

 

[Ian]

....and put it on a 30 MOA base.

 

[Full.lead.taco]

They make these really cool 300 moa adjustable scope bases for the extreme long range shooters, but they cost a pretty penny.

 

[300BLK]

A few of us were silly enough to waste ammo shooting 1000 yards at Ridgway. Coyote silhouettes, sitting/howling, 18" across the base and 24" tall, so basically a triangle with a cutout behind the front leg. The best I was able to do was hit 2 in a row and rock the 3rd. There are 2 E-W valleys between the firing line and the 1000, and no way to read the wind. Close misses are the norm, and I can often see my own impacts in the dirt through the scope. My normal shooting/spotting partner and I both shoot 30-06, 20moa tipped bases, Burris rings with +/- 10 inserts, scopes with 125+moa elevation and mildots. 311299s are my bullet of choice and he shoots 314299s. I HAD shot Saeco 301s, but the 311299s require less elevation.

That same rifle was my "production gun" for the cast bullet silhouette match 4060MAY alluded to. Its just an older Rem700ADL, that's never been bedded or free-floated, just had the trigger adjusted. The aluminum buttplate isn't particularly shoulder friendly, but I'm not modifying that rifle. Last year I was coerced into shooting my 300BLK AR in the match. I built it, so had to shoot "silhouette class" along with the guys shooting custom guns, heavy barrels, etc. It weighs 7-1/4# with Vortex Viper PST 1-4x on it. At the of the day I was tied for HOA, but lost in reverse animal count to a guy shooting a Tom Gray built Rem722 in 35Rem with 36x Leupold and 250gr Saecos.

I set the NRA BPCRS long run record for turkeys back in 2001. 32 consecutive turkey silhouettes fell at 385m/421 yards, and they are just slightly bigger than a basketball. The rifle had tand/globe sights and was chambered 40-50 Sharp bottleneck, shooting Goex ffg.