FYI ENFIELDS

[quicksylver]

Been following the "Throat Fit" Post. There were some comments on the bore size of Enfields., There seemed to be some issue with trying to get them to shoot with cast bullets.I'm going to keep my comments focused on the P14 and us 1917 Enfields, especially, the US 1917 because they are my life long favorites, I went through about five before I could get them to shoot, It wasn't until an old man at my club who was watching me struggle loaned me a book ,on the us 1917. I imediately went home and read it from cover to cover. The section that held most of my attention,descrided the rifling.VOLA! I had made many bad assumptions. Yes it is a us military firearm with a .30 cal bore and is chambered in .30 Gov't there the similarities between it and the 1903 and 03a3 end. the 1903 1903a3 have barrels with 2,4 or 6 grouves their barrels are cut leaiving a .308 normal bore, there fore , cast bullets sized . 311+shoot very well in them. The. P14 and 17,on the other hand because, of the corrosive effects of cordite got a new rifling, that the Brits hoped would eleaviate the effects of the cordite and result in longer barrel life, 5 grouves right hand, cut at .0055leaving them with a .311 bore,2x.0055+ .30= .311, needing at least a .312 +sized cast bullets to perform well and they do. Since Remington was under contract for the P14,they saw no need to change the rifling of the 1917 barrels. the deeper rifling,along with the 5Rand 26" barrel in my opinion really helps with cast bullets.Dan P.S. it also let the 1917 out shoot the 03, 03A3 At every turn , it's downfall was the lack of windage adjustment.

 

[Petrol & Powder]

I have always considered the Pattern 14 & Pattern 17 rifles to be excellent rifles.

The 03 Springfield was a bit more "Mauser" like and was more of an American design that the P17.
In my opinion, the P17 had better sights for actual combat and the rifle was very strong.

 

[quicksylver]

I agree

 

[Petrol & Powder]

And that's some nice shooting there.

 

[Rushcreek]

I’ve always liked the P14 and US1917 rifles, but my experience with both has been in sporterized samples.
I always considered them to be the British Mauser as the Springfield is considered to be the American Mauser.
I recently obtained a sportered 1917 Remington that has a .300 WinMag chamber and a 30-06 bolt……. Will see how that turns out.

 

[MW65]

Love my 1917... great with 168gr match, and still tweaking cast loads... thinking a 314299 bore rider might be the ticket. Tried a tl313-150 which was seated too far into lands, and didn't fit as well as it should.

 

[richhodg66]

Interestung to note that Alvin York did his famius work wuth a 1917, not a 1903 as depicted in the movie.

 

[RicinYakima]

Interestung to note that Alvin York did his famius work wuth a 1917, not a 1903 as depicted in the movie.

While this is most likely, he said he use a "Springfield" in all the interviews for the rest of his life. Since it shot the Springfield cartridge, who knows what he "knew" or "Thought".

 

[Tomme boy]

I had a M1917 that was sporterized. It was very well done in a what looks like a Weatherby styled stock. It had the angled rosewood tip and grip cap. But it had a very bad bore. It shot ok with jacketed but it turned lead bullets inside out. You could only get about 5 shots and the barrel was toast. Sold it to a friend that had a new old stock barrel for it. He was going to have it put on. Still don't know where he came up with that barrel.

 

[RicinYakima]

I had a M1917 that was sporterized. It was very well done in a what looks like a Weatherby styled stock. It had the angled rosewood tip and grip cap. But it had a very bad bore. It shot ok with jacketed but it turned lead bullets inside out. You could only get about 5 shots and the barrel was toast. Sold it to a friend that had a new old stock barrel for it. He was going to have it put on. Still don't know where he came up with that barrel.

Remington made thousands of 2 groove barrels for the 1917's for training rifles for the US Army and rebuilt them.

 

[Bret4207]

I’ve always liked the P14 and US1917 rifles, but my experience with both has been in sporterized samples.
I always considered them to be the British Mauser as the Springfield is considered to be the American Mauser.
I recently obtained a sportered 1917 Remington that has a .300 WinMag chamber and a 30-06 bolt……. Will see how that turns out.

Zillions of 17 Enfields were used as the basis for sporterized magnums back in the day.

 

[Bret4207]

I just came into a 17 Enfield. Haven't done a thing with it yet, but if I ever do I can side by side it with my '03 Springfield.

 

[Missionary]

The 1917 was for sure made to be a combat rifle. Solid and plenty heavy to deliver a "butt stroke to head" or bust the door down...
And as a typical British design, good, fast combat sights well capable to the task.
We like all of our's !

 

[Snakeoil]

Interesting point about the deeper rifling. That Enfield a friend shoots at the club with the "worn bore" is probably one of the cordite bore rifles you mention.

I've always wondered why the groove diameter on my 1921 03 is 0.311. Now I wonder if it was originally made for the Brits or perhaps an experiment using their deeper rifling. Do you happen to know the date when the Brits used that deeper rifling? I would assume the period shortly after WWI.

 

[PED1945]

The company commander at a neighboring unit in RVN carried a 1917 Enfield. He was always willing to go along whenever we took a bunch of new guys to the range to sight in their M-16s. Before we started shooting he would demonstrate what a rifleman could do by splattering a can of C-Ration ham & limas at 200 yards. For those not there, nobody would eat the canned ham & limas that came with C-Rations. Therefore they made excellent targets.

 

[quicksylver]

Interesting point about the deeper rifling. That Enfield a friend shoots at the club with the "worn bore" is probably one of the cordite bore rifles you mention.

I've always wondered why the groove diameter on my 1921 03 is 0.311. Now I wonder if it was originally made for the Brits or perhaps an experiment using their deeper rifling. Do you happen to know the date when the Brits used that deeper rifling? I would assume the period shortly after WWI.

the first accepted shipment of rifles was in 1916

 

[Rushcreek]

This is interesting, I think that I should slug the barrel on mine. Cut and crowned at 22”- the barrel date is long gone. It’s not a two groove so probably 1917/1918?
I’ve been shooting cast in all my .30 caliber rifles so I thought Holy Hell when I touched off the first .300 magnum round!