Good deal

Rally Hess

Well-Known Member
I'll remember that when I'm chopping out a frozen dam tomorrow, with sheets of ice trying to knock me over, while in chest waders!! But the beaver are beginning to look pretty good.
 

fiver

Well-Known Member
could be worse man.
you could be in some factory somewhere, with a foreman looking over your shoulder from 6 to 6 trying to decide whether to recommend you for that .20 cent per hour raise this year or not...
 

Rally Hess

Well-Known Member
I'd guessed that from a previous post. We were talking about weather and yours was about the same as mine.
 

Rally Hess

Well-Known Member
Here you go Chris. Took these yesterday with my digital.
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This is the west edge of the 350 dam looking east. I can't get the whole dam in the picture because it curves, so took it also from where it curves to the left as far as you can see in this picture.
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This is continueing east to where you can see the other end of the dam.
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This is looking just about straight south from the dam to the beaver house.
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The culvert I was lucky to find through the ice is in the lower right, still half plugged. I'll remove the rest of that tomorrow and it should be back to the original size in a couple days.
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This is the large dam the forrester said was about 500' long. I'm standing on the dam looking east for this shot and the Birch trees you can see clear down in the center is the East end.
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This is looking back west to the West end. That is suppose to be an atv trail to the right in the picture. It is a caution sign because the trail is washed out. LOL
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This is looking out onto the pond at the beaver house. Note the number of dead standing trees in this pond. It's been there a long time. Also notice the standing timber in the background. It's already been sold to loggers, and "reasonable access" is guaranteed by the forestry. Logging equipment doesn't swim very well!!DSCN2072.JPG I started to lower this yesterday, and the break is about 3' deep now. I will have to take it down about 9' to get it to the original creek bed. Note the swamp grass in the spillway. If I open it up right, the current lifts the swamp grass up like cutting sod. Comes out in big sections and it's a good idea to be UPSTREAM from it when it gives way. LOL
DSCN2063.JPG This is another area I'm working for the forestry. It's a CCC ditch that is way out of it's banks, has water running over a road, and has over four miles of water behind it. All the brush is the beavers feed pile/cache , and was all done within the last 30 days or so. If you look real close down stream there is one beaver house on the left bank.
DSCN2064.JPG And this the beaver house next to the feed pile. The three green poles sticking up out of the ice are my snare poles to catch the beaver. They come to eat the popple poles and get in my snares. The number of snares on the poles depends on the water depth. The cross sticks on the ice keep them from pulling them under the ice and getting away. The white bubble trails under the ice tell me where the majority of beaver traffic is under the ice and suggests a good location for the poles. I like to put down poles on both sides of the feed piles but if you look close there is open water on the other side of it. Really sucks swimming in December with hip boots on.
 

Ian

Notorious member
Wow. Thanks for sharing all the pictures, that's a real eye-opener. Looks like there are an infinite number of ways to die real quick out there with just one wrong step or miscalculation.

So educate me: You put some of your snares UNDER the ice?
 

Brad

Benevolent Overlord and site owner
Staff member
I’m with Ian, looks like an excellent at to go swimming in damn cold water.

I have a feeling you take safety pretty seriously.
 

fiver

Well-Known Member
the snares go under the ice.
think about it like deer hunting where your waiting in a tree stand between the Deer's bedding area, his lodge [the big mound of sticks and mud] and the corn field.
[the big pile of branches with leaves and bark on them he pulled under water into a storage pile all summer long]

quite often they will have a trench dug between the two places so he/they can swim under the ice.
 

Chris

Well-Known Member
Here you go Chris. Took these yesterday with my digital.

Thanks, Rally, I enjoy seeing other country. I took a 'tour' of your country using google aerials, looks much like here but flatter. Sure looks like good beaver ground. Timber looks similar, balsam, popple, soft maple, white birch. We don't have the amount of tag alder beds I think I see in the aerials and our old flows don't seem to regenerate to beaver food, so there is a limit on how many of the darn things we can have. Also our woods are older and we don't have that much popple.

I'm in the forestry business in NY Adirondacks so often have beaver causing access problems. For bigger dams we either cut them out with skidders... is not always possible... or I have a guy who will blast them out. I have in the last 40 years cut out a lot of dams by hand and cleared many culverts... no doubt a shadow of what you do under contract... and I have come to just hate those rodents. Although I admire their work and appreciate their role in creating habitat.

For me the worst is clearing a dam in the summer, stinking mud, entwined sticks, and hordes of deer flies. And water always a bit higher than my waders. I have had luck using electric fence chargers to keep them from plugging culverts... run the hot wire an inch above the surface just upstream of the pipe. They often drop their stick and leave the brook for safer ground.

I see your ice there, pretty close to to thin. Been through a couple times on snowshoes, has made me shy. Be careful, I'm sure you are.
 

Rally Hess

Well-Known Member
Popper,
There are some dams where that would be real handy. I took one out this summer that was 12' thick across the TOP. I had as many hours in getting it opened up. I've considered getting certified to blast them and could from one of the mines. The problem is getting insurance coverage. Last I inquired only Loyds of London would insure. I have to carry a million dollar liability now, and that is enough.

Ian,
Yes, most often I put them under the ice. The green poles are the bait, and the later in the year the more attractive they are. A beavers feed pile gets slimy/sour from being under water all winter. I'm just offering him a fresher bait than what is available to him after being ice locked for up to five months. Even at first ice, like is pictured here, beaver are still in the gathering mode, so bait poles like these are attractive until around Christmas time. Around Christmas the beaver go into a doldrum state for a couple weeks and I go pheasant hunting. The hides are also primer after Christmas and peak prime is usually through the middle of March. The slimier their feed pile gets, the better I do on the snare poles. I most often only have access to the majority of the remote colonies by snow mobile and carrying a lot of traps is not a real conducive means of getting out a long line. I can carry a square five gallon bucket full of my "Beaver Spikes", a ice chisel, and a chainsaw, and set all day. After I get the line set I pull a trailer behind my snow mobile to carry my catch. In the summer I set snares in open water conditions, but, by law they are not capable of drowning the beaver, I have to check them every 24 hours. If I use body grip type traps, footholds type traps or snares on drowning rods, capable of drowning my catch, I only need checking every 72 hours. Under ice is unlimited, and I usually check every fourth day, depending on weather conditions. I rotate my beaver lines every four years, and try to take about 70% of the beaver from any given flowage. This way I am always leaving some seed, and have "farmed" most of my lines for over 30 years. Doing this keeps me in beaver that are not chewed up from over population and territorial fighting. Most of this area doesn't get trapped accept near the roads so it's rare, even in a good market, that these beaver ever see any trapping other than my efforts. This area I'm trapping for the forestry now is 78 miles south of me. A lot more people and roads, but again, the interior needs a good thinning. This contract is in a state forest (a big piece of bog that they can't do much else with except manage the timber), and I intend to make a run at it this winter. The beaver here are a fairly long haired red to brown beaver that sell well tanned. Not a highly sought item in the fur industry because they don't die well to darker colors but do well in the curio market where my wife markets them for me. I believe I can remove around 200 from this block and stay well within my 70% quota. I've already taken a little over 40 and the conditions are horrible. It was rainy/ snow there today but suppose to get a little colder the next week. Deer season ends this Sunday, so I don't have to worry about theft soon. I already had a beaver shot with a 20 ga. shotgun, and the snare poles stolen along with the beaver last Friday. The "Wizard" that stole it's truck was parked in the water, that was running over the road where he shot it, so you'd think he'd have figured it out. Deer season is a love hate affair for most trappers here.
Beaver Cook lake area 009.JPG
^These are multiple poles at one beaver lodge. The two on the right caught beaver and you can see how the "Beaver Spikes" go on the bait poles. There is a safety cable that goes through the loops of each spike and cinched on the center of a safety stick, that holds the pole upright until they freeze in, like the pole to the far left. The spikes are just driven into the poles about 1/2", just enough to stay in place to set the snare lock when the beaver gets caught. The system with the safety cable allows the beaver to go to the bottom of the pole when caught and entangle on the bottom of the pole, so it's butt or back don't freeze to the bottom of the ice, once they drown. The number or spikes/ snares put on the poles depends on the water depth at the set. Also notice the scores on the bait poles, where I remove the bark near the snare to give it eye appeal under water. Most often the beaver seeing the score thinks it is where the last beaver chewed on the pole, and is where I put my snares/spikes. I keep track of the number of beaver caught at each colony by notching a stick I stand up in the snow, and leave at each colony. That's what that dead peeled stick is behind my ice chisel.
I catch 15-18% of my beaver under ice by the extremities (feet, nose, tail). Here's one I got today by the nose.
DSCN2073.JPG
Most of the beaver are caught with their head and at least one leg through the snare and caught right behind the front shoulders. Most of the time the first beaver caught knocks down all the snares on the pole and ruins/ bends up the one it gets caught in, while the others can be reused. I hand shape/ load every snare so when the beaver gets inside the loop of the snare, it snaps closed. The lock on the snare gets tighter as the beaver fights and won't release until I tilt the top back manually to release it off the caught beaver.
Sorry I can't find the pictures of my ready to go under the ice poles handy. I have a whole series of them but just got a new puter and the pictures are on a discs. My son will straighten it all out some day soon, before I use some of those new Ranch Dogs on this puter. LOL

Brad,
I usually take a lot of precautions, and usually avoid ice conditions like this. I can trap either open water or under ice just fine but this far south and this year it wants to conform to neither. They are paying mileage but I figured to be done with the contract by now. The rain today isn't helping ice conditions any. I'm going to skin a couple days and let it sit until she firms up some. See if we can get my dad a deer the next couple days.

Fiver,
Good analogy. The beaver house are built from the mud and sticks the beaver push up from just outside of the lodge, so the deepest water is usually just out from the lodge. That is also why the feed piles are there so they can stack it in the deepest water, so when it freezes, the snow load on the ice compresses the feed pile close to the lodge. Most often there are under water trails(runs) that come from the lodge and on either side of the feed pile/ cache. Most often there is also one run that goes from the center of the lodge , under the feed pile to the outside edge of the feed pile. Those bubbles trails (visible a couple pictures up) show the trails and are "high traffic" areas. In short, a good place to put traps or snare poles to get maximum exposure. On good ice conditions I can put just a single snare in those runs coming out of the house and catch a lot of beaver. I have to keep the snares far enough away from the lodges so that when caught, the beaver can't just swim back into the lodge. Surprising how strong an adult 40-70 lb. beaver is when they get their feet braced in a hole. Also sucks chopping frozen mud to get a shot at them!

Chris,
We also have a lot of Ash here. Makes great firewood. The paper companies here promote popple planting and it will regrow out of the stumps pretty fast. Tag Alders galore, which is a secondary beaver food source. I hate a dam that has tag alders in it. The young stuff is so tough and grows in all directions.
Definitely no shortage of flying friends here in the summer either. The skeeters were unreal earlier and we had a second spurt of deer flies for some reason. I believe that was the first time I can ever remember that happening. They were bad for about two weeks and were gone, then a second shorter batch. Seems like the older the dams the worse the mud smells. Strong tannic acid in all my ponds, so no need to dye snares. A couple days under water and they turn a nice dark color all on their own. Any chance you know of Johnny Thorpe? He was a trapper from the Adirondacks. I've met your Furbearer biologist, Gordon Bachelor. I worked with him on snare development for the BMP studies several years ago. Nice enough guy but NY is not a snare friendly state. We are working on it though.
 

Rally Hess

Well-Known Member
185.JPG
Ian,
My winter ride. I didn't think I needed my sled that day. See the beaver on the seat with just a little ice on it. The reason is I was sitting on it for about 4 miles on the ride out. LOL183.JPG
This is how the snares are installed on the poles. Usually I'd put another two snares on the pole closer to the bottom, but the loon poop was that deep on the bottom of this ditch, so didn't make sense to put two more on this pole. Also note the pole has all the bark chewed off it. The beaver didn't do that the muskrats did. Still attracted the beaver, he's laying on the ice. Pretty common to see rats chew poles like this late winter.
 

Chris

Well-Known Member
Popper,


Chris,
We also have a lot of Ash here. Makes great firewood. The paper companies here promote popple planting and it will regrow out of the stumps pretty fast. Tag Alders galore, which is a secondary beaver food source. I hate a dam that has tag alders in it. The young stuff is so tough and grows in all directions.
Definitely no shortage of flying friends here in the summer either. The skeeters were unreal earlier and we had a second spurt of deer flies for some reason. I believe that was the first time I can ever remember that happening. They were bad for about two weeks and were gone, then a second shorter batch. Seems like the older the dams the worse the mud smells. Strong tannic acid in all my ponds, so no need to dye snares. A couple days under water and they turn a nice dark color all on their own. Any chance you know of Johnny Thorpe? He was a trapper from the Adirondacks. I've met your Furbearer biologist, Gordon Bachelor. I worked with him on snare development for the BMP studies several years ago. Nice enough guy but NY is not a snare friendly state. We are working on it though.

Rally, I did not know Johnny Thorpe personally but the man cast a big shadow around here. He died back in 2015 but you probably know that.

http://poststar.com/lifestyles/anno...cle_0a499d65-5c8e-52c0-8ccc-98972be1951d.html


I hold a generally dim view of NY DEC biologists but I hope you can make some headway with snares. They do NOT like snaring here. Over years of observation it seems to me that they work against the sportsman, if anything might be more effective in taking game (not to mention predators, they LOVE predators!). they stonewall and drag their feet. I get they idea they don't like us. The department is too political.
 
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Rally Hess

Well-Known Member
Chris,
I've been involved as a manufacturer, in the BMP process for 17 years. I built the "Cable Restraints"(snares with deer stops, loop limit stops, inline swivels, and limitations on set locations) to conform to EU standards. Without a doubt a political process, but it has developed a set of standards and brought out documentation, that has been instrumental in, now allowing the use of "Cable Restraints" in five states that didn't before. There is light at the end of the tunnel.
 

KHornet

Well-Known Member
A most excellent thread, well photographed, well written,
and very informative. Thanks for posting.

Paul
 
F

freebullet

Guest
Wow!

I spoke with some fellas from Canada who had to turn in a specific number of pelts to keep their own land each year, didn't realize how much damage they are capable of before that. I see the odd beaver chewed tree around here, but they pretty much get killed to fast to do such extreme damage. Thanks for sharing, excellent pics!
 

Pistolero

Well-Known Member
Hiking many years in Alaska and in NE has convinced me to be no fan of the beaver. And near our vacation
cabin in Colorado they have had to dynamite the dams after trapping all the beavers a couple of times to keep
the road from being destroyed. Neat animals in a way, but can be incredibly destructive if you don't want
a lake right there.

Bill
 

Rally Hess

Well-Known Member
Freebullet,
Much of Canada have registered trap lines. Meaning the trapper actually buys them, and trapping rights to certain areas. With those lines they are required to remove a certain number of animals, by species, with quotas set by the government. If the trapper doesn't meet those quotas they can lose their lines. Not all areas are registered lines and natives have certain areas guaranteed. Not a bad plan for the trapper when fur prices are high, but really sucks when prices are low, like now, and the trapper still has to maintain those quotas, and operates at a loss.

Bill,
Some times I feel really bad about interrupting some of the locations I'm contracted to trap. Some roads/trails are put in the most ridiculous areas, that just beg to be underwater(like the one pictured above) to gain access to timber sales. Then the ATV/ snowmobile clubs adopt parts of them and figure the beaver should just move. Then they put in 4-6' culverts where there was a 20' wide creek and wonder why the beaver plug them!! Also consider when the CCC ditches were dug in this country there were very few beaver. Between the demand for pulp and the CCC ditches, designed to drain natural flowages, it's no wonder the beaver populations have exploded. I call it all job security. LOL Just got the check for the above pictured contracts while I was out in SD pheasant hunting. Gonna have to go back soon!