Cast in the 6.5 Creedmoor

[richhodg66]

So deer season is over, the rifle I used, Ruger American, in 6.5 Creedmoor got started on this today. All I did today was some plain based ones with between 6 and 7 grains of Unique and 700X at 50 yards. Nothing to write home about but not wildly inaccurate either.

Good story about these bullets, they are old Ideal 266386, nominally 105 grains. I did not cast them. While at my first duty station in the Army as a young and eagear gun nut just learning the ropes of things without Dad's oversight, I used to peruse the local gun shops and my very favorite one was Starkey's out in northeast El Paso. I loved that place, and the old man was always patient and mentoring to a young guy asking a lot of questions. Among other things, he had a big corner of the shop full of old reloading stuff, a lot of which looked like estate sale stuff and a bucket of scrap lead, oftentimes cast bullets. There were couple hundred of these (no mold) cast well and unsized. I sorted through them and bought them as scrap lead even though I had no 6.5 rifle and wouldn't for close to 20 years later. So these things have followed me around for thirty some odd years, only shot a few through the abortion of an experience I had with a 6.5x55 a few years ago. I guess the rest will get shot up through this one, unless I can get #1 son's ,260 Model 7 out. I hope the ancient caster who made them is smiling down on me as I enjoy his handiwork.

I have several tubs of various cast bullets, plain based and gas cheked variety left from the Swede. I also got a bunch in Dad's stuff and the mold for a long, heavy Saeco design which I have good hopes for.

If nothing else, this will get me trigger time with what is probably the best deer rifle I own, even if it is fugly and boring, it sure shoots and carries nicely.

 

[BBerguson]

That’s a great story. I had a similar experience with the local gun shop in town. Mom would drop me off and do errands while I hung out with gun shop boys. I was 12 and they always treated me great.

I’m curious to hear how your cast loads work and what powder works best. I started with Bullseye and found it worked better in smaller bores and the big bores (my 450 bushmaster) didn’t like it all. Unique is working best in that and my sons 45-70 seems like it’s preference is Blue Dot. I’m trying to find something that works as well as Unique because I don’t have much of it left and just loaded some Win 231 last night in my 350 legend to try. Now I need to figure out a way to get to my shooting bench with the driveway having 12 inches of snow in it. Well, not too worried about the 12 inches, it’s the snow plowed in from the road dept that will probably need to be shoveled out. Maybe next weekend…

 

[richhodg66]

These are plain based, so being careful not to push it too hard. Bullseye is actually a good idea for these loads. Probably won't get to shoot again until next weekend, maybe I'll try some Bullseye.

 

[Spindrift]

Great story!
I bet the creedmoor can work very well with cast bullets. NOE have a bullet that’s supposed to be designed for it, the 266-140. I’ve shot this bullet a lot in my 6,5x55’s (don’t own a creedmoor), and it shoots well.

Good luck, and have fun!

 

[richhodg66]

I miss gun shops like Starkey's. By the time I left a couple of years later, I was into casting and had a Blackhawk in .45 Colt. I went in his shop and bought a four cavity Saeco mold for it, big SWC, which I still have. Poured a lot of bullets with it over the years. First casting session with it was in the backyard of the little rental house we had in Lawton, Oklahoma using range scrap on a Coleman stove.

Unless this rifle really shines, I'll likely just shoot up what I have on hand and cease the experiemnt. I already cast and load for too many things, and I'm really a .30 caliber guy.

 

[RBHarter]

Oh , come on you know you want to have a shorter list of calibers you don't cast from 22-50 than those you do . (Insert chicken sounds) , (add big stupid smirk) .

 

[richhodg66]

I cast and shoot .22 Hornet and .458 Win Mag and a whole bunch of things in between. I just turned up some bullets I cast for a .270 last night and was scratching my head wondering why I went down that rabbit hole for a cartridge I really don't even like much. It's a sickness.

I probably wouldn't have for this, but had a bunch of molds an bullets around for it. We'll see how it does before I commit to casting more.

 

[Ian]

It keeps us from wasting time and money in beer joints and golf courses.

 

[waco]

I love beer on the golf course. Just not the right time of year.

 

[fiver]

you can access our golf course from the lake.
which means you can walk to it if so desired about 8 months of the year.
or you could just park in their parking lot and walk the 3 steps to one of the fairways.

i'd advise the lake route since one of the sheriff's trucks is usually parked right there in the lot and would probably become curious about why you were standing 4' away from his truck drinking beer in snow up to your waist.

 

[RBHarter]

That's the best laugh at a mental image I've had in some time .

 

[462]

It's either 24 golf courses within a 20-mile radius of my house, or 20 golf courses within a 24-mile radius of my house, but what with all the tourist traffic (mostly lost drivers despite their electronic navigation devices) and people who wear weird and funny clothes (especially the men with sweaters draped over the backs of their shoulders and the sleeves tied in front to keep them from falling off their backs) makes me think it's the former. As I've said numerous time, the only thing good about golf is, the balls are fun to hit with cast bullets.

Speaking of weird and funny looking clothes, do the multi-colored and multi-logoed clothes bicyclists wear make them pedal faster? Some of their clothes make my eyes bleed.

 

[L Ross]

It's either 24 golf courses within a 20-mile radius of my house, or 20 golf courses within a 24-mile radius of my house, but what with all the tourist traffic (mostly lost drivers despite their electronic navigation devices) and people who wear weird and funny clothes (especially the men with sweaters draped over the backs of their shoulders and the sleeves tied in front to keep them from falling off their backs) makes me think it's the former. As I've said numerous time, the only thing good about golf is, the balls are fun to hit with cast bullets.

Speaking of weird and funny looking clothes, do the multi-colored and multi-logoed clothes bicyclists wear make them pedal faster? Some of their clothes make my eyes bleed.

How about the multi-logoed jump suits on Bass Fishermen? Makes sense to me that bicyclists want to be seen by automobile drivers, but Bass Anglers out blinging NASCAR? Oh, wait, I may have answered my own question.

 

[richhodg66]

I've been plinking with old, plain based 105 grain bullets for a while now, got serious today. In my Dad's stuff were a couple hundred or so from a Saeco mold, about 140 grain, gas check design (I have the mold) Dad likely cast them about 40 years ago, I remember when he and everybody else hopped on the Swedish Mauser bandwagon, seems like I was in high school, but may have been earlier.

No cast load data for the Creedmoor. Looking at data for the 6.5 Japanese, Carcano, etc., I started with 15 grains of 2400, shotgun patterns at 100 yards. Dropped a grain, same results. Dropped another grain, got a bit better. Dropped down to 11.5 grains and an actual decent group resulted (ten shot group at 100 yards). Gonna tweak it some more tomorrow.

It seems the general wisdom on the 6.5x55 is that the fast twist prevents good cast accuracy at anything higher than 1500 FPS, slower is better. The Creedmoor seems to be the same way in my limited experience.

Much lower on that 2400 and I'm gonna be worried about the possibilty of hangfires and/or position sensitivity. Might have to switch to Unique or 700X.

Thoughts?

 

[RBHarter]

I 4350 and H4831 both appear to be limited by seating depth more than pressure in the Japanese .
Me and Lovern designs don't as a rule get along , however , in the Japanese I sized the 266469 at .265 and patched up to .272 . WWII surplus H4831 showed promise at jacketed 140 gr start loads . If memory serves , it's been hit and miss lately , the powder was right at it's clean cusp not a lot of mummies but enough to know it wasn't clean burn , that's around 28kpsi with 4350 and probably about the same with 4831 . That's for full tilt . I also used the .270-140 NOE at .272 , it wasn't dazzling but it wasn't bad with Unique . I didn't chronograph anything so I can't help there . The 4831 was down probably about 80% .

 

[Spindrift]

In my 6,5x55, the «sweet spot» with 140grs gas checked, lubed bullets is around 16 grs of Vihtavuori N110. This powder is only slightly slower than 2400, I think.

11,5 grs seems very low for a 140 grs bullet. My guess is, you might need a slightly larger sized bullet. Do you know the sizing diameter of your bullets?

 

[richhodg66]

.265 is the only sizer I have for this. New production rifle not like milsurps where and over sized bore is expected.

Think I'll try some Unique or 700X. I don't think this bullet is going to work very well at faster velocities.

 

[CZ93X62]

In 243 and 250 Savage, the sweet spots in my rifles with 100 grain cast bullets using 2400 was 12.0-14.0 grains.

Dunno what twists the 6.5 CMs come with, the fastest twist I've shot cast in was 1-8", and it had a HARD speed limit of 1600 FPS (25/35 WCF). My Ruger 77R in 6.5 x 55 has a 1-9 twist, and #266469 (.265" sizing) stays accurate to about 1800 FPS. 1-10" in several 30-06s over the years have stayed accurate to 2000-2100 FPS.

IME, faster twist rates DO have an effect on velocity potential with cast/sized/lubed bullets. No deep experience with the coated bullets so far.

 

[richhodg66]

That 1600 FPS limit seems to be the general wisdom with cast in the Swedes and probably holds true in the Creedmoor as well. Have to try it though.

 

[fiver]

if you have any steel or 800-X type powders they'd really be worth a try.
you might be experiencing some issues with position sensitivity with the 2400.
the slightly faster but bulkier powder should be a help.
you could even try something 'radical' like 20-22grs. of 3031 or thereabouts [not 322 it needs a filler if reduced like 4895 does]