Crowd funding a clip-on wheel weight AES analysis

[popper]

I use ~tblsp of shot for As in my HV alloy, HT or not. S solubility in Pb drops very rapidly with temp. One tsp in pot is about right. Excess outgasses as alloy cools. Rotten egg smell. It hardens but doesn't seem to help malleability any. When I smashed S cast (and recovered smashed) I got this very fine gritty stuff on my hands, The CuSO4 I now use may leave some S in the mix, never tested - but no gritty feel to smashed ones.
Th CuSO4 also (once you get all the byproduct out) leaves the top of the melt shiny through the casting session. I.e. after 'cleaning' the junk out and stirring a lot, alloy is very clean.

 

[BHuij]

a couple weeks ago, my buddy who is a "Metal Recycler Hobbiest" and all around scrounger, said he just got in a couple 55 gal drums of WW. I asked if this was vintage stuff from a Auto salvage yard or new stuff collected at a tire dealer? He has lots of sources for the Metals he hauls away from businesses. He tells me it's newly collected and judging from a previous batch he got, he figures this batch is about 30% Lead WW to 70% non-lead WW. We didn't get to a price per lb, I just turned it down, for fear of being WAY TOO MUCH work...he understood.

Yep, even my 5 gallon buckets I get from my source are around 30% lead and 70% steel/zinc/polymer/garbage. Sorting wheel weights is absolutely my least favorite part of the entire casting, reloading, and shooting workflow. Worse even than case prep Now once or twice a year, I have my competition shooting buddy come over, and we sort weights for a couple of hours, then melt down, clean, and flux the COWWs in a big dutch oven over a propane fire, before pouring ingots. Even going through a lot of 9mm and .300 BLK subsonics, my lead supply is growing faster than I can shoot it. Fine by me.

 

[BHuij]

Use garden CuSo4 copper sulfate (Zep root killer), pour measured amount on top of melt. Wait till it turns white, the stir the dickens out of it and CAREFULLY remove the greyish powder on top (Zn or Sn sulfate). Do not inhale. It replaces Zn or Sn in the alloy, Zn is much cheaper. Flux with wax and stir to clean all the junk out. Let alloy 'bake' for 1/2 hr before pouring. Size a day at most later. As will sped up hardening. Salt in the ice water will allow temp to get below 32F, dawn blue will work as sufficant = surface tension reducer. I don't use either, too lazy. An OP used a copper wire welder to zap the melt and add the Cu. IIRC he almost broke his press trying to size them, not WD. IIRC annealed Cu is BHN 36.

I may try this. Even with my plain old, totally un-enriched COWW alloy, after heat treating some bullets last night at 430 and water dropping, sizing down about 0.002" with a Lee push through sizer was absurdly difficult. And I don't think those bullets have reached anywhere near their final BHN. Gotta remember to always size before treating going forward.

 

[Ian]

They guy who used a welder and house wire also said he felt sick for a while afterward. Heavy metals vaporized to the plasma stage and being airborne is not a good situation.

 

[BHuij]

They guy who used a welder and house wire also said he felt sick for a while afterward. Heavy metals vaporized to the plasma stage and being airborne is not a good situation.

Yeah this method never made it past "that seems like a bad idea" status in my head.

 

[Joshua]

They guy who used a welder and house wire also said he felt sick for a while afterward. Heavy metals vaporized to the plasma stage and being airborne is not a good situation.

Sounds like fun though! Who doesn’t like lightsabers and bubbling cauldrons of molten death metal!

 

[waco]

Sounds like fun though! Who doesn’t like lightsabers and bubbling cauldrons of molten death metal!

I never got into death metal. Punk rock, yes, to some extent. Right now it’s all about classic ‘80’s alternative music.

 

[Bliksem]

I gave up on WW's a few years ago as the modern ones are not worth the effort. However, the ISO containers that are out there are worth the effort, IMHO. I was fortunate and gifted a few units some time ago. On the right are a few that have not been converted into ingots yet.

 

[obssd1958]

Bliksem,
Are you using them as is? Or do you alloy them to come up with a usable product?
And, is the alloy good for pistol, rifle, or both?

 

[popper]

I've used them straight for 308W. Worked fine.

 

[Bliksem]

Bliksem,
Are you using them as is? Or do you alloy them to come up with a usable product?
And, is the alloy good for pistol, rifle, or both?

I add 1.5~2% tin by blending in some Linotype. These ingots and others I cast up over the past few years have all tested around 96/3/1 so with a little tweaking with adding in Linotype/Monotype get close to Lyman #2 alloy. This final alloy is sufficient for all my pistol and rifle needs. For 45ACP or such lower pressure pistol cartridges this alloy could be used as-is but I prefer to stick to the same blend as it keeps things simple.

When absolutely required I will add a gas check and as I now prefer custom molds, such as those from Accurate, I typically have the GC shank omitted from the design. This allows me the option to use them as is or to add a plain base GC. Super hard alloy is a crutch that allows sloppy reloading practices to still produce "acceptable" loads, IMHO.

Pistol and rifle have similar challenges in that with the smaller the caliber and the higher the pressure there is less wriggle room. Larger caliber and lower pressure cartridges are easier to get to perform well as the bullet is not being pushed nearly as hard as smaller and higher pressure ones. For example, 45-70 is easier to get to shoot well with cast than 308Win.

 

[Mitty38]

Wish I could help with the cause but we got rid of our spectrometer that could be easily globalized and calibrated for lead alloys,quite a few months ago.
Our current lab has a Bruker full size spectro lab, but only standards to program for aluminum and zinc based alloys.
Our handheld x ray based spectrometer is off limits to everyone the exec, and the chemist, plus they have limited uses because of x ray exposure.
I did some testing on wheel weight alloy before, but can't find the certificates. Pretty sure they all came came out close enough to 95%- 0.5%- 3.5% with not enough variance to make a big difference when alloyed.
I remember one batch that I knew was from the 80's. It was like 95%- 1%- 4%.
Then I got into this zinc removal rabbit hole thing and lost interest in comparing wheel weight samples.


May be a stupid question, but how do you get hold of those Iso containers?

 

[Bliksem]

To the question where I got the isotope containers, various sources. The first ones I bought from the CB swop & sell forum and the clean good alloy impressed me enough that I sold off all wheel weights I had and the hunt began for more containers. I located a few more on evilbay and I was set for a while. A short while ago I was gifted 18 containers and the ingots derived from 8 of them are in the picture in this thread. The 3 containers to the right of the ingots are units that I had found at a recycler near San Antonio. They are different to the others I melted down and are softer, probably close to pure Pb.

 

[Mitty38]

To the question where I got the isotope containers, various sources. The first ones I bought from the CB swop & sell forum and the clean good alloy impressed me enough that I sold off all wheel weights I had and the hunt began for more containers. I located a few more on evilbay and I was set for a while. A short while ago I was gifted 18 containers and the ingots derived from 8 of them are in the picture in this thread. The 3 containers to the right of the ingots are units that I had found at a recycler near San Antonio. They are different to the others I melted down and are softer, probably close to pure Pb.

Thanks, I guess it's one of those things you have to kinda dig for. get a feel of how to obtain them in your area. Kinda like the elusive wheel weight. Maybe I will ask some nurses I know about them, someone is getting them thru a medical facility somewhere. Guess I am going to have to do some leg work in my area.

 

[Ian]

I was in the bidding for a few hundred medical isotope containers from BAM-C in San Antonio, actually was just backing up 257Shooter from Boolits who had the licenses and stuff for military auctions. I had truck and trailer and half the cash we agreed to bud up to. The catch was twofold: had to beat the pro bidders/snipers with deep pockets and had to destroy the containers before taking them. We had decided that splitting mauls would meet their requirements for "rendering unusable". We lost because for one, the mess went for tens of thousands and he accidentally killed himself with a huge glass of ice water after mowing his lawn in the hot August sun right in the middle of the bidding period. RiP Jim.

 

[Spindrift]

May be a stupid question, but how do you get hold of those Iso containers?

You might try marrying a nuclear medicine technician. Works for me!

 

[Mitty38]

Having one wife and keeping her happy, is plenty work enough, two would probably kill me. Plus I think it would be easier just to pick up my range scrap mining operation.

 

[Ian]

You might try marrying a nuclear medicine technician. Works for me!

Holy cow. How convenient!