Cylinder throat reaming

[fiver]

titewad is an odd powder.
it is hard to get it to burn cleanly in a 12 ga. and it pressures out very quick if you try too hard.
it's too fast for 20ga where the pressure would be correct.
in metallic cases where you can get up near 20-K or better I think it's got a lot of possibility.
but I'm still leery of it because I don't know how it reacts once you get it to the 'clean stage'.

 

[Eutectic]

Clean is relative........ I was saying clean vs. Bullseye not vs. Clays. The grouse loads I spoke of were well under 20,000psi and we very clean... I used Winchester Small Pistol Magnum primers with them though. That could have cleaned them up??

Pete

 

[Eutectic]

Well....... I helped steer Brad's cylinder throats thread off course so let me take it back with a "Tale of Four Cylinders."

I have mentioned my .45 Blackhawk already. The .452" bore and .4525" throats...... polished...... I mean polished so I could shave with the surface finish if I could get my face in there!!!! AND IT IS ACCURATE! But not my most accurate revolver!

I have a Smith Model 15 6". It is just as accurate as the Ruger. Bore is .3575".... throats are .3585" Smith's work not mine. Throats are smooth with visible machine marks.....

I have a Colt Single Action Army .44 Special. I've had it for years.... bought it new. 7 1/2" Colt barrel was .429" groove. Cylinder throats are .432" It was very accurate. I say was... because I re-barreled it some 40 years ago now. The groove diameter is now .431". I shoot .4315" sized bullets and it's my second most accurate revolver! Colt throat's are smooth but WITH VISIBLE MACHINE MARKS.???

My most accurate revolver is as ugly as a sow's ear. It belonged to a longtime friend that passed away. It was a gift (tip) to Bob who was an outfitter who got this gun's owner onto a nice elk. I got the gun from Bob while he was still alive. He said it shot good but he wanted to know just how good.
It started life in 1918 as a Colt New Service .45. Some guy named Corbett re-barreled it with a 10" ventilated rib over the frame with adjustable sights addition that was hard to look at. I liked the deep rifled 8 land and groove rifling though. I put it in the safe.... It was SO ugly I had to take small bites... A couple months later I pulled it out of the dark. I took some .45 Auto Rim loads for my 5" 625 .452" bullets and shot over bags at my 40 yd pistol target. A cylinder full went into 2 1/2".... Hummm? Not too bad I thought.... I brushed out a little lead past the cone. I put it back in the safe. Maybe six months passed. Sitting with a cup of coffee I remembered those WW1 Colt's had large cylinder throats. "Where did that thought come from?" I said aloud. But I went to the safe....... .456" !!
I slugged the bore. The rifling looked good on my slug. I miced it..... .4545"!! I had a premonition it would shoot at that moment! I did not have a mold that cast big enough! (Except .45-70 stuff to heavy) I wanted a bullet that would size .4555"! I put the sow's ear back in the safe.
I had made some point forming dies for .45 that I though of one day...... I dug them out along with some telescoping gauges.... Ah-hah! I "bumped" up some Saeco 058 215gr bullets to .4565". I polished a Lee push through out to size .4555".......

6.2grs of WSF (I have it to burn) and the above modified bullet with 4Q lube in good lighting (necessary for an old f@@t) will have all 6 shots touching in a tight bughole if I do my part! Nothing handgun-wise I have will touch it! (no Contenders included) I have shot it 500 yards with that same load and it shoots way better than an old man can see even way out there. The cylinder throats done by Colt exactly 100 years ago have visible machine marks!

Pete

 

[fiver]

a hot start seems to really help that powder.
it is a common theme with the guy's that use it in shotshells to use a Fed 209A and to run it up to the top edge.

 

[Brad]

I had 8 pounds of Clays. I was using it for shotgun but burned up the last few pounds in 45 ACP. 4 grains with a 200 swc is quite pleasant.

 

[waco]

I think I have a few pounds of Clays in the shop. Bought it when you couldn't find powder. I'm not sure I have ever opened any of it?.......

 

[Brad]

It is a very fast burning powder. With a 200 swc in my 1911 it is awesome.
I bet it would be good in 38 special with light charges too.

 

[Pistolero]

I use 3.0 gr Clays as a full power load in .38 Spl 158 cast. I also have had some luck
with 1.9-2.3 gr under full WCs in .38 Spl.

Bill

 

[waco]

Sounds like 2-3 pounds will go a long way!

 

[Brad]

And then some.

 

[smokeywolf]

Read somewhere that, while Titegroup is a good substitute for Bullseye, it burns considerably hotter. Can anyone verify that?

 

[Brad]

I have used a few pounds now mostly in 44 special. I can't say that I noticed the revolver getting any warmer than with any other powder?
It does have a pretty high nitroglycerin percentage and that may be what frightens people.
I do know fiver and Ian have found it to be scary in small cases as pressure jumps fast with powder charge or a slightly deeper seated bullet.

 

[fiver]

I don't even describe it as fast.
it goes from being normal to an explosive instantly and without warning.

it is outstanding when it has a lot of room to work in, and it's a very good shot shell powder when used properly.
I have never done any type of study to see if it heats a barrel up any faster or higher than anything else.

 

[waco]

I use a lot of TG in .38spl
3.2gr with a 150ish bullet.

 

[Eutectic]

I've also found the 'newer family' spherical or ball powders to be 'kinda squirrely' to be nice.... All in all I like them better? but from Titewad on the fast end to and including LilGun burning rates need extra care in load development. Many of us monitor signs as loads are increased or changed some way (like seating depth) I've found some like LilGun can go crazy (and Tight Group I'm told) at changes where the older ball powders (like 231 or 296) move in a more even increase. Be careful even with listed loads too as a tight bore, short throat, etc. can change things W A Y faster than experienced reloaders are used to them changing.
More Heat??? Maybe so..... I was working plain base loads in the Savage 23 .32-20. A chronographed load of Unique to the same velocity as that of Longshot..... Throat leading first inch for Longshot... none for Unique! And Longshot is slower! Titewad and newer WSF display this 'hot throat area' to. So something is going on in the time pressure curve or formulation to cause that early heat.

Pete

 

[358156 hp]

Read somewhere that, while Titegroup is a good substitute for Bullseye, it burns considerably hotter. Can anyone verify that?

That's the way it worked out for me. I used to shoot bowling pins a lot, and loaded 38 Spl & 9mm with Titegroup for a match. When match time came I shot in the 9mm class first, did poorly (still won) and fired a total of 10 shots pretty quickly. My XD9 was hotter than blazes, and I burned my hand pretty good. Again, after only 10 shots. In the 38 revolver class I experienced the same issue, only with 8 shots. The 686 was hot enough to brand cattle, kind of like an AR15 barrel after a few mag dumps. This time I didn't win, and put the revolver away to move into the bigger caliber classes. When I got home I realized that the nylon insert in my Hogue grips was now warped, and the grips didn't fit the frame anymore.

The first thing I did was order a set of Hogue wood grips, and got ready for an IPSC match at another club the following weekend. Same issue, both guns hotter than blazes, but the wood grips helped a lot! I can't recall ever having guns get that hot, even with WW296. That was the end of my interest in Titegroup, I gave the rest of my 4 pounder to a friend. Both guns heavily smoked on the outside, and too hot to handle. The temps for both matches was in the low 90s, and it was pretty sunny out. And I went back to Unique.

 

[smokeywolf]

Compared to the rest of you, I'm very inexperienced when it comes to powder experimentation. Don't recall ever loading pistol ammo with anything but Bullseye, Unique, 2400 or 4227.

 

[Ian]

Where Titegroup excels in metallic cartridges is loaded behind cast bullets, in large cases, in reduced loads. Nothing else I've found burns as consistently or is as position insensitive at extremely low load densities. I would never use it for any kind of jacketed load, and never for anything much above 15K psi.

But Titegroup can be dangerous. Fiver's right, it goes from placid to full detonation in a fraction of a grain, or if there is a slight reduction in case capacity. A little bullet setback in the magazine was all it took for a target load of Titegroup to blow up one of my 1911s.

 

[freebullet]

Be it known, titegroup is my absolute favorite fast powder. For some of the same reasons mentioned, specifically position insensitivity. I run it with cast, Jax, & plated. It is THE powder for 380. I work it like I do all my loads, very careful, start to finish.

 

[USSR]

Compared to the rest of you, I'm very inexperienced when it comes to powder experimentation. Don't recall ever loading pistol ammo with anything but Bullseye, Unique, 2400 or 4227.

Don't worry about it, you are well served with what you have.

Don