For Those shooting 45 ACP

[Petrol & Powder]

JWFilips - to get back on track to your question,
Because of the phrasing, I don't believe your question can be answered in its current form.
The question is not whether or not there is a benefit. The question is, "does one need to adjust the loading when using different style primers"?
I'm going to say there's an obvious difference between a SPP and a Magnum SPP (although I once did some testing and the velocities were not significantly affected by magnum primers).
I'm not sure that a SPP listed as non-toxic is any different in terms of pressure when compared to a standard SPP.


Years ago I compared loads with magnum primers against loads with standard primers. All other variables were the same. I was only looking at velocity and couldn't directly read pressure, so I can't speak to a pressure curve.
What I saw was the magnum primers produced velocities slightly higher but functionally similar to the standard primers. The shot to shot deviation in velocity was smaller with the magnum primers. Now, we're not talking about big differences here, so don't get excited.

Because I couldn't read pressures, I'm not going to say you can interchange magnum primers and standard primers. I will say that unless you are operating at the extreme upper limit of acceptable pressure, a magnum primer is probably not going to make a big difference.

So, I wouldn't use the phrase "is there a benefit" but I might ask, "can you use a magnum primer"?

 

[fiver]

the larger flash hole would indicate to me the primer isn't near as efficient as a regular one.
they can get away with it because the pressure is low enough in some cases that your not blowing pressure back and around the seal to the case, or puncturing the primer and eroding the firing pin.
using the small primer size is another 'safe bet' to help keep those from happening.

 

[bruce381]

IIRC, doesn't the WIN NT have larger flash hole ?
I believe I sorted those out?

Yeah primer hole is larger I think but a fat slow 45 seems to not care, as far as types of primers mag or not I do not know I load em up and leave them for some one else to sort and deal with. Maybe send to Ian? have had a 5 gallon pail at one time of them.

 

[Petrol & Powder]

I try to sort out the small primer cases but every now and then one ends up in the 1st station on the Dillon 550. It's rather annoying when that happens.
I'm steadily pulling out the small primer pocket casings from my supply but I haven't accumulated many at this point. I suspect when I get enough to deal with I'll configure the press to SPP and load them. I'll likely shoot them and leave the empties for someone else to deal with.
I agree that the 45 ACP is a low pressure cartridge and a flash hole that's a bit larger is probably not going to be a huge problem, small primer or large primer.

Format changes just seem to be the norm these days.

One of the MANY funny lines in the movie, "Men in Black" is the scene where Kay (Tommy Lee Jones) holds up some new data storage format and says, "Now I got to buy the White album again..." .

 

[dale2242]

I tested large standard and magnum primers in 45ACP.
I found the magnum gave 20fps faster than standard.
No accuracy difference.
I`m not sure that will apply with SPPs.

 

[RicinYakima]

I have read that Winchester replaced the lead styphenateaziate with potassium dinitrobenzofuroxan; there are some other changes, but the end result is about equal to the older primer compounds.

 

[JWFilips]

IIRC, doesn't the WIN NT have larger flash hole ?
I believe I sorted those out?

That is what I'm worried about . The crimp in the primers in a different way then usual crimps I do not think they what these reloaded.
But I I did after fighting to ream out that crimp

 

[CZ93X62]

I have had the great good fortune to not encounter any brass cases with renegade primer pockets. No, I don't get out much. See another thread regarding "six months of 14-day lockdown" for further details regarding this sequestration.

 

[RBHarter]

I read about testing and loading the correct NT primers , which I've never seen on a shelf , that the larger flash hole had something to do with the density vs the volume of primer flash maybe it was heat duration ......anyway the larger flash hole was needed to get enough primer flash on enough powder to get it to burn consistently and 100% reliably . Functionally it sort of gives the standard SPP more of a magnum flash to powder effect while bit allows more gas volume per pressure to escape unless you're running loads like the Rowland with FC primers there's little worry .

Retained from reading for bulk of content relative to 9mm NT at that time circa 98-00' .

 

[Outpost75]

.45 ACP, Revolver vs. Carbine, Old Vs. New Bullseye, Small Vs. Large Primer, Jacketed Vs. Cast Bullet
RCBS Little Dandy Rotor #9, nominal 5 grains of Alliant vs. Hercules Bullseye, CCI large vs. small pistol primers, Federal cases
			H&R Bunny Gun 20"	Ruger Blackhawk 4-5/8"
230-grain FMJ		Avg.	Sd	ES	Avg.	Sd	ES	RifleVGain	VHercVsAlliant
TW55 Ball REF		957	31	78	858	28	72	99
										RBH4-5/8"	H&R20"
Old Herc. Lot 571	Large Pmr	886	24	58	823	12	45	63	-49	-19
		Small Pmr	824	30	97	793	4	11	31	-67	-18
		LP_Vgain	62			30
Alliant		Large Pmr	935	33	83	842	11	29	93
		Small Pmr	891	35	88	811	18	49	80
		LP_Vgain	44			31			FMJAvg.+73fps
Saeco #954 230 LFN
Old Herc. Lot 571	Large Pmr	990	8	20	874	11	30	116	-50	-34
		Small Pmr	972	13	30	846	15	35	126	-55	-41
		LP_Vgain	18			28
Alliant		Large Pmr	1040	6	18	908	14	38	132
		Small Pmr	1027	15	38	887	11	29	140	RBH	H&R
		LP_Vgain	13			21			LFNAvg.+128 fps	HercDropAvg-55fps	HercZDropAvg.-28fps
		Rifle+LP	34fps			27fps			RifleAll+87fps
			H&R			RBH
Alliant	5.5 grs.	Large Pmr	not fired			980	11	30
		Small Pmr	not fired
H&G#68 20 SWC
Alliant	4.0 grs.	Large Pmr	not fired			819	7	20
		Small Pmr	not fired			784	15	46
	4.5 grs.	Large Pmr	1057	20	49	863	21	51
		Small Pmr	999	35	87	864	46	115
	5.0 grs.	Large Pmr	1112	12	29	945	6	15
		Small Pmr	1105	12	36	922	19	42
	5.5 grs.	Large Pmr	not fired			951	16	37

 

[Outpost75]

.xls spreadsheet wouldn't import so format is scrambled. Anyone wanting the sheet PM me with your email address.

 

[JWFilips]

I will be trying them tomorrow with SPP& pretty safe load of 4 gr BE and a lee 230 gr RN
I feel the Large flash hole indicates milder primers for the NT brass as mentioned above
I still may not collect the fired brass as I have a lage amount of LPP brass in my inventory

 

[springfield17074]

My brother gave me a bunch of federal brass that have the SPP. He said they were loaded with syntech bullets. I have reloaded them and they have shot fine for me but I have noticed that some of the flash holes are off center. He gave me 200 cases and 34 had the flash hole off center. The rest shot fine, I didn’t notice any difference. I haven’t chronograph any yet though.

 

[RicinYakima]

There is no difference.

 

[462]

There is no difference.

Ah, ha!
I've tossed a lot of GFL .45 ACP brass, because of off-center flash holes. Maybe I ought to rummage round the scrape brass bucket and retrieve them.

 

[Ian]

I have a special plastic coffee can mostly full of "shoot it and leave it" .45 ACP reloads. It's a mix of leftovers from various casting runs, odd primers, and "ends" of powder lots and is all based on brass with off-center flash holes. The can accompanies me on hunting trips, range trips, etc. where the brass will get left where it fell and I won't give a damn about it. Well, that's the idea anyway, much of it has been shot until the headstamps are nearly obliterated because against my every intent I keep picking it back up and throwing it in the can. When the live round count gets low I restuff them again with odds and ends....

Meanwhile, 8,000 rounds of carefully crafted 45 auto ammunition stays hoarded neatly in boxes, sorted by headstamp, lonely on a shelf.

 

[alamogunr]

I've gone to small primer .45 ACP for much of my loading. I bought most of the OF brass fairly cheap. The guys that shoot competitively don't want to sort their brass and the small primer brass fouls up their progressive loaders. I load progressive too but only cartridges that use small primers. The
.41 mag and .45 Colt and above, I load single stage.

Most of the small primer brass is either Federal or Blazer. I've seen a few Winchester NT headstamps but it is much less than the previous two. My understanding is that Blazer is from Federal. Doesn't really matter to me. I don't shoot competition just for my own enjoyment and like several others have mentioned, mostly H&G 68 clone from 2 MP molds

 

[Petrol & Powder]

When I shoot on someone else's land I pick up my brass because I just think that's what one should do. When I shoot on a range I pick up my brass (and everyone else's too) because I can't stand to leave it.
Like Ian, I have those cartridges that I tell myself I'll leave on the ground and .....like Ian, I keep picking them back up.

 

[dale2242]

I started saving SPP 45ACP when I had a hoard of SPPs.
I even traded LPP 45s for SPP 45s.
Now that SPPs are hard to find, I may save them for later and use the SPPs for cases that can use SPPs only.

 

[alamogunr]

I didn't realize that SPP were "hard to find". I haven't bought any once fired SPP in several months but before that I found enough to last me the rest of my life. I'll be more careful about picking them up if I want to leave them for sons and grandsons.