Getting started with the 300blk ...

[popper]

Midweight subs in BO AR don't work very well. Pistol powder and pistol gas but won't cycle.
Finnally got the magnetospeed figured out, 3 each 150spp, 155 amax, 110 vmax, 125sst & some 142 PB - decent fps and ES.
Had fun with the marlin 60 @100 too. Not too bad for what it is and 10 mph breeze.




The middle ones are actually the 150SPP that does need to be pushed harder to expand, even though they are an exposed lea point. the first cast were OK but I got override jam and dented nose after the first. Also a 170 gr PB that jammed after the first which was way off. All the cast have a big meplat and were not H.T.d like my normal loads. I might get another reload from these cases before the PP goes bad. The problem with the blade was mounting too far out and turning up the sensitivity to compensate. The jacketed should give longer range shooting, thinking of getting a GC mould for the 145 cast with slightly modified nose.

 

[wquiles]

From what I am reading, the 300blk shines with the Barnes 110gr black tip for a hunting load (a lot having to do with the higher muzzle energy coming from the highest velocity attainable from the "light" bullets, and a solid bullet designed to expand at the 300BLK speeds), and the 220-230grs for suppressed work, but understanding that the suppressed rounds are in the 45ACP power range. I read about before deciding to pull the trigger (no pun intended) on the 300blk, but I still wanted to "experiment"

PLUS, not IF, but WHEN the zombie apocalypse finally comes, those "quiet" 45ACP power slugs are going to be the ticket for those close-n-personal zombie encounters, right?

 

[popper]

Seems like the gold dots are actually the best hunting bullets, but the black tip are supposed to be good. Any zombies at close range get hit with 165gr cast, longer will be 170 cast. Silver is a good lead hardener too.
150SPP & 145 cast are running 1800, I can push harder. 110vmax= 2300, sst & amax = 2200 fps. That's 30/30 range.

 

[Ian]

230 subs have the same energy at 100 yards that a 230 .45 acp has at the muzzle. Difference is the .45 will deliver its energy to the target and the 300 will pencil through 3' of phone pole lengthwise. If anyone ever comes up with a solution to the cast bullet expansion problem while using a bullet that will cycle through an AR and shoot accurately I'm all ears.

 

[RBHarter]

Trade secret .

 

[freebullet]

I got a few ideas on that, Ian.

One was a not a hollow point. Imagine a small properly sized soft aluminum, plastic, or even brass/steel (so long as it's less than 25% of th bullet weight for pistol guys) sealed tube. If the mold had a hole in the nose sized right to accept it, they could be cast in the bullet. Point shape could be controlled allowing semi auto friendly shapes, with the high bc designs, to get reliable expansion or sploders from home cast. Nothing widely available I've found to serve as the tubes. They'd need pre heated to cast in prolly. Found glass vials about the right sizes but nothing yet that would take being cast upon. Maybe a hollow sealed bead?

Another idea was a shell like mold. Have a hp like pin that is large & all the way to the base. Slip those cast shells, pre heated, in the regular mold of the same bullet design, fill with pure. Hard shell, super soft core, guaranteed to be tunable somewhat.

Haven't had time to pursue either idea. I followed along the foil tip spearmints, had hopes you'd stumble into something.

Two ways I've got great controlled expansion with home cast, soft lead or hollow points. Both of those methods touch on those attributes but might allow for semi auto friendly high bc designs. Your welcome to pursue or mod the idea so long as you share the adventure.

 

[Ian]

A high-BC nose going 900-1000 fps at the target is only going to expand if it is a) really soft, like pure lead or b) soft/malleable and has a finned wedge mechanism with a hard, small, flat tip to feed well at 10 fps yet drive open the nose like a concrete anchor at higher speeds. I thought tumbling would happen and deal destruction but that one Swiss-cheesed pig begged to differ. The one pig I did manage to kill with a lung/liver shot from a Lee 230/air-cooled ww/powder coat ran about a mile and a half and died in a fence. The only effective solution I know of is a commercial jacketed bullet that does the Black Talon thing at very low speeds, and at least one person who claims they've made soft points Veral-style using the NOE 247 mould and gotten them to feed and shoot straight out of an AR.

 

[freebullet]

Soft'll definitely do it.

I believe trapped air space within the bullet will do it to. I think (yep, dangerous at best) we would find the sploader grail of home cast with it.

 

[wquiles]

Two ideas:
- Couldn't we have a mold that had some thin streaks in the nose portion that would cut into the nose, to provide a weaker path for the nose to deform? Similar to what those Leigh bullets have in the solid coper bullets, but cast?
- Second, couldn't we create a HP mold what would take one of those high BC plastic tips that could be press-fit into the HP cavity to help/aid in the expansion of the nose? I know we are trying to "cast" our own, but I would expect that the plastic tips would be "really" cheap right?

Will

 

[KeithB]

Hot melt glue and other similar compounds have been used to fill in HP cavities to get better expansion, but the end result I've seen is a flat tip. I take it you are looking more at a pointed plastic tip. They could be cheap once the cost of the injection mold is paid for. Not so cheap making them in small quantities.

Penta points that create sharp corners inside the cavity to aid expansion are already an option with Miha molds, is this the thin streaks you are thinking about?

 

[Rick]

Been my experience that any sort of sharp corner inside a HP cavity such as a square bottom or sharp penta styles only serve to break off the nose, not expand the bullet.

 

[wquiles]

I was thinking the same idea as the penta but on the outside surface of the bullet instead, like this:

Not implying for a second that it would be easy to do/duplicate with cast, but wondering if it would even work with cast bullets when combined with a hollow point.

Will

 

[wquiles]

These corbin tips are about 4-5 cents a piece:
http://www.corbins.com/highbc.htm

​

ULD Tip Inserts, Ultra Low Drag tip inserts for Higher BC: * TIP-30-5 ----- ULD Tip Insert, .284-.323 cal, pk/500 ---------- 110.00 * TIP-50-5 ----- ULT Tip Insert, .324-.510 cal, pk/500 ---------- 120.00

 

[freebullet]

Someone used plastic ski tips in some trials some years back. They didn't work so great without the air space.



Looks like most of the best varmint bullets use the wedge effect with air space.

 

[wquiles]

Gotcha - nice photos. Note also how the jacket is very thin (relatively speaking) on the tip area to help with the fast deformation.

 

[Brad]

Ian, ever think of a large straight sided HP for casting followed by forming a pointed nose in a bump type die? You could get a small HP on the nose with a larger cavity a bit farther back. You could control the depth of the cavity easily.
In ways having the nose blow off isn’t all bad for a 230 gr 30 cal bullet. It is long as hell so knocking 1/4” off the nose won’t hamper penetration that much and a 30 cal flat nose will cause more internal damage than that pointy nose too.

 

[Ian]

Casting a tubular end and swaging a point would be a bit tough in the re-forming setups I've been using, would require some hardened, highly polished dies and ejector and a press set up with an ejector linkage. Not horribly difficult, but not real fast for casting or production, either.

The ballistic tip thing I have done but was limited by plastic quality. I made a mould out of HDPE for casting hot-glue points but even the harder, high-temp hot glue didn't want to feed well in hot weather in an AR-15.

I also tried a skived HP pin design for the .458 Socom with a huge cup point (AKA "flying ashtray" to promote expansion and it barely worked at all with 50/50 WW/soft scrap alloy at 950 fps with 500 grains pushing it.

Me too! HP'ing a Lee mould without proper tools

I wanted to experiment with hollow-point bullets in my .458 Socom AR-15 to see if I couldn't improve upon the subsonic lethal factor. Mastadons are out of season and pigs are in, so knock-down power is more important than raw penetration. Before spending a lot of money to have a good custom...

www.artfulbullet.com

 

[Brad]

Casting a tubular end and swaging a point would be a bit tough in the re-forming setups I've been using, would require some hardened, highly polished dies and ejector and a press set up with an ejector linkage. Not horribly difficult, but not real fast for casting or production, either.

The ballistic tip thing I have done but was limited by plastic quality. I made a mould out of HDPE for casting hot-glue points but even the harder, high-temp hot glue didn't want to feed well in hot weather in an AR-15.

I also tried a skived HP pin design for the .458 Socom with a huge cup point (AKA "flying ashtray" to promote expansion and it barely worked at all with 50/50 WW/soft scrap alloy at 950 fps with 500 grains pushing it.

Me too! HP'ing a Lee mould without proper tools

I wanted to experiment with hollow-point bullets in my .458 Socom AR-15 to see if I couldn't improve upon the subsonic lethal factor. Mastadons are out of season and pigs are in, so knock-down power is more important than raw penetration. Before spending a lot of money to have a good custom...

www.artfulbullet.com

If anyone could cobble together such a setup it would be you.

 

[RBHarter]

I haven't used it but I bought a set of HF counter sink drills with just this in mind with a drill press and a nylonish camlock holder it would be pretty quick and consistent .
45° mouth with a .2 deep round 115° bottom angle suited to accommodate a #6,8,10, or 12 screw thread dia . The #6 or 8 would be ok in a 30 cal I think #10 is 3/16 it happens to match the number drill .

I concure with the 30 cal WC nose loss maybe being a good thing . A blunt nose 190-200 gr slug plowing to a stop should mess up a lot of tissue . I did a 200 gr spire point and HP'd it down to 195 gr left a 155-160 gr WC . I shot a 12×12×12 cardboard box with 1/2" plywood plate inside going in and out and then a plastic bag and a gallon milk jug both water filled , 10 ft from a dry powdered clay bank . Don't recall the thought process . Maybe it was hit a rib , make up for membrane , exit , see what's left ........ It was fun with a 1600 fps x39 paper patched SKS at 50 and 100 yd . Without the HP it would tumble on impact ......

 

[wquiles]

The FFL receiver does not arrive until Monday, which of course I have to pick up in person and transfer, but the rest of the parts arrived

I now have reloading dies and shelholder, Hodgdon CFE BLK powder on hand, Fed Small Match Primers I already had, LC-converted and fully prepped brass, and the lower parts kit:

I will start making some supersonic ammo to test things out soon, and I will also remove the hand guard/cut it to allow the suppressor to be mounted, and mount/align my DIY griffin taper suppressor mount I build a few months back: