"Holy Navy wax, Batman!"

[Ian]

Some of you know I gave a sample of the world-famous Navy-surplus "beeswax" (the stuff sold by Mr. Bob Williams of Fernley, NV over ten years ago to bullet casters throughout the country) to a friend of mine around Christmas time to have analyzed by his brother who heads up the chemical laboratory for a major petro-chemical company. "Life" has rather happened to the three of us since then, but I have some data to share. It turns out this stuff it more of a mystery than any of us had imagined, and the only thing conclusive is that it most definitely is NOT beeswax. The best estimate is that it was used as an ingredient in the formulation of anti-corrosive hull paint.

Here's an excerpt from our communications: so that Navy wax I tested was Carbons 23 through C90+. Boiling range of 728’F through 1300’F a full 60% of the wax material boils above 1000’F.
A typical paraffin wax is C20 – C44 but this stuff is very “full” range.
Carbon 23 is Tricosane melts at 120’F
Carbon 90 is Nonacontane.

This would explain why the wax as a bullet lube ingredient is so versatile, stretchy, heavy, low-smoke, and "full-range", some will remember the discussions of finding a wax which has a wide-spectrum carbon chain base to make the phase transition point extremely gradual as opposed to, say, 180F microwax which is solid at one temperature and abruptly liquid one degree higher. Gradual phase transition is a quality that I believe makes old, low-refined Vaseline and beeswax so effective in our lube recipes.

Anyway, there you have it.

 

[Ben]

Great, now I need a translator...............

Ben

 

[Ian]

Well, it settles two huge questions:
Is it beeswax? NO.
Can it be duplicated? Not bloody likely.

 

[Brad]

Short version Ben, it ain't beeswax.

What it is is a mix of stuff. Lord knows what all was thrown together.

This is the wax version of range scrap

 

[Ian]

Remember, this stuff comes from a time when plastics technology was in its infancy and crude oil was fractioned and refined only to the bare minimum requirements for things made at the time. I tend to think it's less what was "thrown together" than what was simply "left alone". Today, things are separated and refined out to practically the individual molecule and every piece sold to make something else. Engine oil used to be just barely solvent-refined and had lots of minerals and waxes still in it, while now all the "contaminants" are removed through hydrogen cracking and other means. Even Vaseline is being refined, lots of the little intermediate "goodies" probably being siphoned off and sold to make Pepsi bottles or some such and just enough "stuff" left to be sold as "white" petrolatum with the spectrum of wax and oil that used to be full now being full of holes. Even asphalt isn't much good anymore, too much of the stuff in it is being refined out and used for other things so what's left is basically just charred sludge unfit for anything but fill.

 

[Brad]

Does that mean we are unrefined too?

 

[Ian]

I'll let your wife weigh in on that, I already know what mine will say about me.

 

[Blaster]

Maybe melt down the Pepsi bottles and add them back to the mix?

 

[fiver]

woo hoo I made it in.

okay so we got long chain molecular structure and various 'grades' [chain lengths] of it blended together.
I know that the ethylene glycols come in different chains strands and can be ordered so, like MEG-20, or PEG-20.
and that parrafins are considered long chain molecular structures too.
however the only thing I can think of right now that uses longer chains of carbon is the various poe oils.

I'm wondering if there is a way to bind the carbon chains together at home.
or if it would be even worth the bother to try something like oxidizing the longest strand paraffin available so it could take more heat kinda like the alox thing.

 

[Ian]

Good to see you!

Paraffins are pretty much inert and don't react with much in their normal states, a good thing, but the trick is to get a combo that gives consistent CORE and doesn't condense in the bore after each shot to leave a deposit that's more or less slick when cool than when the barrel is hot.

Ever wonder why those "homo-lubes" we make by combining a bunch of leftover experiments tend to work so well? Gotta be they cover every conceivable facet of the viscosity/temperature window, and dang near every hydrocarbon compound known to man.

 

[fiver]

my latest homo-lube lubes everything in the gun but the barrel.
it doesn't lead or even leave a lube star on the 4" barrel [I get a powder residue star that's completely dry]
I have to put motor mica on the boolits straight from the sizer to keep the lube in the grooves, but the lube isn't sticky.
weird stufffff for sure.
I'm afraid to try it in a rifle under any kind of higher pressure.

I agree that c.o.r.e. condition and lube viscosity at any given moment in time are the keys to success.

 

[JSH]

Well your answer to this being a petro product clears up my original thinking on it leaving tar!
I don't recall how much of that stuff that I bought but it was a fair bunch. Sold some to a couple of friends and they have had zero issues to my knowledge.
My very first batch of FWFL was made with beeswax from a craft store. It was pricey to say the least but worked as I was told it would.
I guess maybe my question with this lube base that a lot of us have is,
What is the good, bad and ugly of this stuff?
I myself have had zero problems with it. That is from handguns of all different sizes. Same goes for rifles. And muzzle loaders.
I also lubed some Postell bullets for a buddies 45-70 when his had some major issues when he was getting ready for a match. He used Shaver's lube, which I taste tested so to speak and had bad luck with it to say the least.
He loaded his 45-70 with good ole black and did better in the match than he figured he would, he said his shots were running higher than normal, but groups seemed to be smaller.
He also admitted that he thought it was a better lube than he had been using and it cleaned up easier. He is still using his Shaver lube, which he has actually messed up or burnt by putting it in the microwave to long.
Jeff

 

[Brad]

I think the best we are going to get is to use a mixture of waxes to get a range of melt points and properties. Sort of like using paraffin and microwax because they each bring a different set of properties to the dance.

JSH, the good, bad, and ugly of this "navy wax" is that it is good in lube, it is bad that you can't get more, and Ian gets ugly if you try to take his.

What you have is a "one off" wax that once it is gone it is gone. Forever.

 

[Charles Graff]

Say What? I remember that pallet of WWII Navy surplus wax that was sold to us as beeswax. I have about 20 pounds of it in a box sitting on a shelf in my shop. I have never opened the box, it is just as it came to me in the mail. I still have a big supply of beeswax from other sources, so I was considering this my stash for my old age. If it isn't beeswax, what do I do with it? How do I make bullet lube out of it?

No, you cannot have it, if it is as good as Ian says it is!

 

[Ian]

I'm ugly anyway, the rat in my avatar makes me look gooooooood. I still think that some of the modeling waxes or blends made with it would work well. Microwax and paraffin both bring good things to "the dance", and we've talked about blending the two varieties in the hopes of fixing the problems with either. More time and experimentation will tell. I'm off on a tangent with polyurea currently, now that I got CORE and the majority of the accuracy licked I'm going for a non-metal lube with long storage life. The high-soap lubes and beeswax lubes still give me the heebee-jeebees when I think of long-term loaded ammo storage.

 

[Ian]

Say What? I remember that pallet of WWII Navy surplus wax that was sold to us as beeswax. I have about 20 pounds of it in a box sitting on a shelf in my shop. I have never opened the box, it is just as it came to me in the mail. I still have a big supply of beeswax from other sources, so I was considering this my stash for my old age. If it isn't beeswax, what do I do with it? How do I make bullet lube out of it?

No, you cannot have it, if it is as good as Ian says it is!

Use it just like beeswax in any lube formula you like, pound for pound it may make lube that is slightly softer than beeswax, but it's tough and glossy so the extra softness is actually an advantage for jettison without being a detriment to handling. If you do an alcohol/water density test you'll find the "Navy wax" to be more dense than any paraffin, micro-crystalline, or beeswax you can likely find. The carbon numbers from the test finally confirmed the suspicions that it is made from some super-long-chain molecules.

 

[fiver]

after 3 years....jeez.

 

[freebullet]

Um.......you guys lube your boolits with agent orange now?

 

[Brad]

We haven't tried that. Yet.......

If you ever need a lube or two to try out, let me know. I have plenty

 

[Brad]

Ah, but it isn't beeswax, is it? It may contain beeswax but calling it beeswax is sort of false advertising, isn't it?