Let's talk 45-70 moulds.

CWLONGSHOT

Well-Known Member
I agree. Always a soft spot for the Win’86. (And good copies)

I was able to buy a super nice 1970 Marlin 1895 45/70 because a Winchester 1886 came in that was affordable and my fellow employee couldn’t afford both. I bought that Marlin from him he bought the Winchester. That was almost thirty years ago. No regrets but I like that Winchester!

cW
 

Glaciers

Alaska Land of the Midnight Sun
I picked up a Lyman 457191 plain base about 292 gr a few years ago for the same reason of wanting a lighter bullet without going to pistol style bullets. Have yet to cast with it but looking forward to this season as it's one in the line-up. Seems like spring is a ways off yet as we got 8" of snow yesterday and it's still coming down, fortunately at a slower intermittently rate. Puts what we have on the ground now at your waist.
 

fiver

Well-Known Member
if that 86 has the saami throat like the win and browning 86's do, your gonna want a short and slightly small nose diameter.
of course you could ream the throat [I know you can do that]
but the saami spec on the 45-70 is more what you'd expect in a newer pistol, and not a lever rifle.
 

CWLONGSHOT

Well-Known Member
I picked up a Lyman 457191 plain base about 292 gr a few years ago for the same reason of wanting a lighter bullet without going to pistol style bullets. Have yet to cast with it but looking forward to this season as it's one in the line-up. Seems like spring is a ways off yet as we got 8" of snow yesterday and it's still coming down, fortunately at a slower intermittently rate. Puts what we have on the ground now at your waist.
My last pic in post #17 shows that bullet. (Lyman 457191). It’s a nice one!
CW
 

USSR

Finger Lakes Region of NY
With the 405gr MP Mold I have, which has a large meplat, and crimping into the crimp groove, I get an COAL length of 0.010" over the SAAMI specified OAL, and it feeds fine. So I am thinking the lighter and shorter bullet should not be a problem. Now my only consideration is what diameter to size these as cast .460" bullets to. I have sizing dies in .458", .459", and .460". BTW, I just pulled the trigger on the "B" bullet. Shipping charge was really reasonable and there is an expected wait time of 3 weeks. Thanks for discussing this with me.

Don
 

CWLONGSHOT

Well-Known Member
I though that was the 457191. Looking forward to trying reduced loads with that one. Do you use it in a 45-70?
Yes I have. It’s a good one. it drops lil small form my liking making it ideal for sizing to 454 to use in my smaller 45’s.

I recently picked up a RCBS. By mistake... eBay. Price was good and mold fine but not what I wanted. Wanted the 300g 45 Colt Mold. Guy didn’t have a clue and admitted that but listed it as a SWC and took crappy pics. But as I said price was right. I gambled and lost. Well not really cause I got a awesome 300g 45/70 bullet!! ;). I use it for my 45/70 now.
 

StrawHat

Well-Known Member
The 1886 is a decent lever action. A bit heavy but that helps as some think the 45-70 recoils. Winchester made a lightweight version that weighed slightly more than the current Marlin 45-70.

The Gould cast soft, 30/1, shoots and expands well. I used it in a rolling block and an 1873 Springfield Single Shot Rifle. Both dropped deer for me.

If you cast it a little stiffer you could probably warm up that load with your choice of smokeless.

Kevin
 

USSR

Finger Lakes Region of NY
While you are correct that most Model 1886's are heavy, mine weighs in at a mere 7.1 lbs. Sure glad it has a recoil pad.

Don
 

david s

Well-Known Member
Aesthetically I like the Winchester 1886 rifles mechanically the Marlins win out. I have a pair of Browning reproductions. Member fiver mentioned chamber leade these rifles don't have any. Pretty much square. I've used four moulds with these rifles the RCBS 45-405-FN the NOE 460-405-RF as well as the NOE 460-429-RF and a LBT 460-400-M Mould LBT makes for Marlin rifles. My best luck has been with the NOE 460-429-RF mould. I was given four boxes (200 bullets) of Cast Performance 458/420 WLNGC these definitely live up to there claim of "Heat Treated Solid". They are a hard cast. They also sot very well. AS A SIDE NOTE SPELL CHECKER CHANGED RCBS INTO CRABS AND NOE TO NOTE AND NONE.
 

Brad

Benevolent Overlord and site owner
Staff member
I prefer a Marlin over a Winchester from a mechanical point of view as well. So easy to clean from the breech. I prefer how they handle recoil as well.
From a fit and finish point of view the Winchester will win hands down. It will also cost far more.
 

USSR

Finger Lakes Region of NY
This is CRAZY!!! I order a custom-made mould on Tuesday and it arrives on Friday? Hell, my handles haven't even arrived yet. He must have had it already made and sitting on the shelf. Looks nice, will let you know how it casts.

Don
 

CZ93X62

Official forum enigma
Yep--that is how Tom rolls at Accurate Molds. Great tools in impossible timeframes.

.459" has always been a good start point in the several 45/70s I have owned. There may exist--in some galaxy far, far away--a 45/70 rifle that has throating and grooves at SAAMI-spec .457". I have yet to encounter one, though. I have seen Trapdoors with .461" to .463" throats as shown by Cerrosafe casts. Consensus on modern 45/70s (Rugers and Marlins) seems to be .4585" to .459" throats. .459" bullet sizing and a .458" M-die spud has worked well for me, even with softer alloys like 30/1 Pb/Sn. Small to moderate crimps hold bullets well in their shunting trip down the mag tube.
 

FrankCVA42

Active Member
Have to agree that is one beautiful 1886 45/70. Should shoot as good as it looks. And I thought I was the only one with a .459 dimensioned Ruger #1 in 45/70. My Lyman 45 rifle mold will barely cast at .459 and not so good accuracy. Another reason to go to the Accurate molds website and brouse through his listing of molds. Frank
 
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CZ93X62

Official forum enigma
The .457" diameter spec for the 45/70 is a lot like the .311" spec for 32/20. Black powder was and is a lot better at "bumping up" the softer alloys of the black powder era than smokeless powders are, regardless of bullet metallurgy. The .0015"-.003" oversize throat didn't matter as much when the low-order-detonation propellant pulse smacked the bullet base, and the lower pressure level was far less prone to blow past a bullet sidewall.
 

USSR

Finger Lakes Region of NY
Thanks Frank. The Accurate mold casts beautifully. Without a doubt the best casting mold I have. The bullets are dropping at .462" and I'm sizing them with a .460" sizer die I got from Buffalo Arms Co. BTW, the sizer die sizes them exactly to it's stated diameter, something that my Lyman sizers won't do (they tend to size larger than stated size).

Don
 

FrankCVA42

Active Member
Don, I'm a member on the cast bullets forum and so far I have nor seen anyone who doesn't like the molds that Accurate does. I'm definitely in the market for a fatter bullet for my #1 in 45/70. As well as a couple molds for my 30-06's. Time to sit down and slug a few of them and write the numbers down. Have one of those little note book pads that I write down the numbers in. Have a case of CRS so better write them down. Frank
 

USSR

Finger Lakes Region of NY
Frank,

If you order from Accurate, expect your mold to cast them larger than what you specified. I specified .460" and they drop at .462". Tom says that they will cast at somewhere between the specified diameter and +.002", and he is absolutely right.

Don