Ian
Notorious member
Maybe in your state, but not in Texas.
Little Lady's CC pistol?
- Thread starter JWFilips
- Start date
Maybe in your state, but not in Texas.
RicinYakima
High Steppes of Eastern Washington
Very true Pistolero.
RicinYakima
High Steppes of Eastern Washington
The safe storage issue, as interpreted by the WA AG.
CZ93X62
Official forum enigma
CA has similar statutes by default. They don't "require" a safe or locked/secured action, but they will fang you criminally or civilly if some child, fool, or miscreant gets possession of your firearm and causes injury or death. They haven't (yet) initiated criminal actions against owners when firearms are stolen and reported as such. Common sense left the room several decades ago.
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RicinYakima
High Steppes of Eastern Washington
Q: What about the “safe storage” provision?
A: That’s the other big part of I-1639. The initiative creates gross-misdemeanor and felony classes of a new crime, “community endangerment.”
Owners could be charged under those community-endangerment crimes if someone not allowed to access a firearm — such as a child or a felon — gets ahold of it and displays it publicly, causes it to discharge or uses it in a crime.
"in the age of cell phones the "displays it publicly" means taking a picture of it. No one has been able to define what "gets ahold of it" means.
A: That’s the other big part of I-1639. The initiative creates gross-misdemeanor and felony classes of a new crime, “community endangerment.”
Owners could be charged under those community-endangerment crimes if someone not allowed to access a firearm — such as a child or a felon — gets ahold of it and displays it publicly, causes it to discharge or uses it in a crime.
"in the age of cell phones the "displays it publicly" means taking a picture of it. No one has been able to define what "gets ahold of it" means.
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Pistolero
Well-Known Member
Our local gun store has a range and rents a lot of different guns. A great way to figure out what works
for a particular person. For my wife's Sig 238, I had a friend who had one, he met us at our range and
let my wife shoot it. She liked it and that was that. Shooting is the best way to decide, if it can be a
arranged some way.
for a particular person. For my wife's Sig 238, I had a friend who had one, he met us at our range and
let my wife shoot it. She liked it and that was that. Shooting is the best way to decide, if it can be a
arranged some way.
F
freebullet
Guest
Looks like we are going to be testing out the new Springfield 911 in 380 next week.
Pistolero
Well-Known Member
That's a version of the same design as the Sig P238, which is derived from the Colt Mustang, which is a copy of
an old Star design which never sold well. Colt had sold some Stars as the Colt Pony, and I guess that is
where they made the connection. Look up Star Model S, later versions. They are a variation of the Star
Model B, pretty much, shrunk down.
Sig 238/Colt Mustang/Springfield 911/Sig 938 are all variations on the same design. If you look at the
thumb safety you can see the plunger which controls it sits in a top-hat device which is common to all of
them, gives away the lineage.
My wife likes her Sig 238 well and shoots it well. I imagine that the Springfield version will be a good one, too.
Bill
an old Star design which never sold well. Colt had sold some Stars as the Colt Pony, and I guess that is
where they made the connection. Look up Star Model S, later versions. They are a variation of the Star
Model B, pretty much, shrunk down.
Sig 238/Colt Mustang/Springfield 911/Sig 938 are all variations on the same design. If you look at the
thumb safety you can see the plunger which controls it sits in a top-hat device which is common to all of
them, gives away the lineage.
My wife likes her Sig 238 well and shoots it well. I imagine that the Springfield version will be a good one, too.
Bill
JWFilips
Well-Known Member
We There is a lot to Digest Here! Thanks
I'm going to have her read this thread and see if she gets some tips from the carry perspective!
I think we decide to go to a dealer and let her handle and rack a few different autos ( I think she is going to go back to her Terrier baby!) At least there is 5 assured shots she is familiar with!
We recently got a Cabella's Flyer with a ton of Small pistols and she got the bug to see If there is something better....since we are in PA a Trip To Hamburg PA is easy!
I'm going to have her read this thread and see if she gets some tips from the carry perspective!
I think we decide to go to a dealer and let her handle and rack a few different autos ( I think she is going to go back to her Terrier baby!) At least there is 5 assured shots she is familiar with!
We recently got a Cabella's Flyer with a ton of Small pistols and she got the bug to see If there is something better....since we are in PA a Trip To Hamburg PA is easy!
F
freebullet
Guest
Looks like kimber has one out in that class too. I remember the star but thought it was the model d they were modeled after. Had a star bm, was a good shooter.
Pistolero
Well-Known Member
The Model S SEEMS to be the progenitor of the Colt Government Model .380. That gun was shortened to Commander-type
size and called, IIRC, the Mustang. Then they added the aluminum frame and shortened it more IIRC was the Mustang Pocket Lite.
And then the marketing geniuses at Colt stopped production, just about the time that small guns for CCW were starting to take off
like a rocket ship.
And a few years later, maybe 5-10, Sig launched the P238 which was better made than the Colts, and
a lot more money. The Sigs used a tunnel extractor on the early guns, like the 1911, and like Colt had done, I assume to further
make the "Government Model" name/marketing idea stick, but Sig have gone back to the external extractor on
current production, which is what Star used on all theirs. My wife's SIG was used, and came to us tossing brass all over the place. On
the first four shots she fired, #1 hit the overhead tin roof smartly, bounced away, #2, went about 10 deg above horizontal and 15 ft to
the side, #3, went dead horizontal and 5 ft out, and #4 rolled off of her hand at zero velocity and fell on the bench and lay there.
I called cease fire, and took a look at the gun. Since it had a tunnel extractor like a 1911, I pulled it to check extractor
tension like on a 1911 when it is doing that crap. Yep, zero tension on the extractor, it just fell out once the FP stop was
removed. I bent it and got the tension right (it is a leaf spring) and all was, and still is, well. I think that Sig got lazy and
decided that the external extractor didn't require any 'setup', and went back to their roots at some point. I never noticed
exactly when they did the switch.
Good little guns, not that much like a 1911 inside, really, "kinda-sorta". Pivoting trigger, BHP (sorta) type of barrel
cam instead of link, a few other changes, but clearly has the general genetics from JMB. The Stars locked the slide with
the safety, and the current version from Sig does not, so you can unload or load with the safety on. They have ambi
safeties avaialable, too. All sorts of minor variations on the design now. Kimber's is called the 'Micro .380', a more prominent
and styled rear horn on the frame, I guess to look more like their 1911's beavertails.
en.wikipedia.org
Bill
size and called, IIRC, the Mustang. Then they added the aluminum frame and shortened it more IIRC was the Mustang Pocket Lite.
And then the marketing geniuses at Colt stopped production, just about the time that small guns for CCW were starting to take off
like a rocket ship.
And a few years later, maybe 5-10, Sig launched the P238 which was better made than the Colts, anda lot more money. The Sigs used a tunnel extractor on the early guns, like the 1911, and like Colt had done, I assume to further
make the "Government Model" name/marketing idea stick, but Sig have gone back to the external extractor on
current production, which is what Star used on all theirs. My wife's SIG was used, and came to us tossing brass all over the place. On
the first four shots she fired, #1 hit the overhead tin roof smartly, bounced away, #2, went about 10 deg above horizontal and 15 ft to
the side, #3, went dead horizontal and 5 ft out, and #4 rolled off of her hand at zero velocity and fell on the bench and lay there.
I called cease fire, and took a look at the gun. Since it had a tunnel extractor like a 1911, I pulled it to check extractor
tension like on a 1911 when it is doing that crap. Yep, zero tension on the extractor, it just fell out once the FP stop was
removed. I bent it and got the tension right (it is a leaf spring) and all was, and still is, well. I think that Sig got lazy and
decided that the external extractor didn't require any 'setup', and went back to their roots at some point. I never noticed
exactly when they did the switch.
Good little guns, not that much like a 1911 inside, really, "kinda-sorta". Pivoting trigger, BHP (sorta) type of barrel
cam instead of link, a few other changes, but clearly has the general genetics from JMB. The Stars locked the slide with
the safety, and the current version from Sig does not, so you can unload or load with the safety on. They have ambi
safeties avaialable, too. All sorts of minor variations on the design now. Kimber's is called the 'Micro .380', a more prominent
and styled rear horn on the frame, I guess to look more like their 1911's beavertails.
Star Model S - Wikipedia
Bill
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CZ93X62
Official forum enigma
I had the use of a Colt 380 Government Model for a time in the 1980s. I liked its locked-breech design that was much like that seen on the 1911-series, toggle-link and all. I did have a bit of trouble with that screwy ejector that pivoted down to clear the slide over the receiver rails. You didn't want to allow it to spring up uncontrolled after the slide was past it, nor did you want to let it get pushed down too far during replacing of the slide. I don't know why the fixed ejector found on 1911A1s could not be scaled down to fit and work. Aside from that quirk, it was a very reliable and reasonably accurate little pistol, perhaps the most accurate 380 ACP I have ever fired. The Colt Mustang was a smaller variant of this Govt. Model (I thought so, anyway....), so perhaps all of them are Star variants and clones. I don't recall doing any casting for the pistol or running commersh cast bullets through it. It did shoot .355" jacketed HPs of 88-100 grains very well, and the 95-100 grainers got run to Euro standards--900 FPS or so. The "hot" ammo of the day--Winchester Silvertips/85 grains--barely clocked 825 FPS, and the FMJ 95 RN didn't reach 800 FPS. No, my disbelief of ammo ad claims is not a recent development. My reloading hobby grew not so much as a cost-saving venture but to obtain actual full-value performance from the firearms I managed to acquire. The 32 and 380 ACPs are pivotal examples of that quest, as is the 9 x 19 Luger. American ammomakers loaded some real ^&%$ ammo in these calibers, and still do to some extent. The chronograph has become the polygraph of cartridge and firearm hobbyists, and ammomakers got caught lying their aspirations off.
Since the 9mm Makarov landed here in numbers c. 1992, I pretty much got out of the 380 ACP entirely. I haven't loaded the caliber for 25+ years. I have rolled around the idea of a Glock 42 a bit, but other things are lined up in front of it--and keep "taking cuts" in line.
Since the 9mm Makarov landed here in numbers c. 1992, I pretty much got out of the 380 ACP entirely. I haven't loaded the caliber for 25+ years. I have rolled around the idea of a Glock 42 a bit, but other things are lined up in front of it--and keep "taking cuts" in line.