Making a Fixed Rear Sight for a Revolver

[Ian]

I've heard and read it said often that the difference between a hobbyist and a professional is the first expends time to save materials while the latter expends materials to save time. Time is the most precious commodity of a professional, and the most abundant for the hobbyist.

 

[Bret4207]

@KeithB , "butt in??"

You kiddin' me?

I'm honored that you are willing to take the time to share such experience and wisdom. Seriously!

That is one crazy "part." Any time I see something made using today's technology and modern manufacturing methods, I wonder how they might have made it a hundred years ago. Imagine the hours that would have gone into that. THAT would have made that part a ridiculous idea then and something would have been designed to suit contemporary means.

Changes in technology drove changes in products. Look at the Savage 110 or the Charter line of revolvers, ANY of Ruger's guns. The Remington 700 is hailed as a wonder of rifles, and it well may be, but in reality, it's a CHEAPER to build rifle than its predecessor, which was cheaper to build that ITS predecessor, and so-on. The pre-64 Model 70 gave way to the cheaper-to-make push-feed that followed and the CZ 550s and 527s fell to cheaper-to-make rifles. Making the old Mauser action must not be terribly conducive to reproduction using extant technology, or we'd be enjoying those guns yet.

Savage and Charter were seen as "cheap" guns for decades, but the old Savage 110s I've shot were very accurate. The (old) Charters I've had were excellent guns - they just weren't made using 18th century design, which isn't as easy to execute using today's technology.

We trade in hours for scrap and chips today.

Find some video of a guy with a CNC plasma cutter! You want "amazing"?!!! Not much scrap or chips with one of those. I want one, but learning how to program it is likely beyond me.

 

[Jeff H]

Find some video of a guy with a CNC plasma cutter! You want "amazing"?!!! Not much scrap or chips with one of those. I want one, but learning how to program it is likely beyond me.

I SERIOUSLY doubt that learning to program is "beyond you." I've done some robot programming, did a LOT of PLC programming, as well as taught it, and have worked extensively with CNC programmers. Not to demean "programmers," but you should meet some of the people I've known who can do it. Anyone can learn to do it "by the numbers," but someone with the ability to actually process thought can be a really effective programmer - case in point - "OLD GUYS."

It's a creative process and I'm sure you have a handle on that. The problem is that much is taught today based on monkey-see, monkey-do, or "by the numbers" - memorization of a specific sequence of tasks, and that's not how "old guys" learn. WE have to UNDERSTAND, and go to a lot more trouble sorting through decades' worth of empirical data (not all good) and very take little for granted.

I just erased a long lecture I know you don't need, but it's reflexive - when I hear "I can't," my immediate response is a very emphatic "you WILL!"

"Old Guys"* ROCK, man. Girls too. They come out on top every time and the younger guys, who THINK they're learning by memorizing and mimicking start to take notice as the old guys gain traction and start running circles around them.

*"Old Guys," is obviously relative. When I was 25, I worked with a slew of just-out-of-high-school punks who thought I was an "old guy." They thought they were going to weed me out and run me off the job so they wouldn't have to help me keep up. I ran them ragged for the first two weeks and never heard another peep about "old guy."

No disrespect intended by the "lecture" or to "old guys."

 

[RBHarter]

I'm on another forum , actually a couple , where they think I'm some sort of a cast bullet genius ........ I don't feel like I have much more than a good handle on how to get a bunch of lost wheel weights to the back stop so I can pick them up again . Of course a box full of parts converted to a running 1973 355 Chevy SB or 1963 428 FE isn't a really big deal so maybe I don't respect my skill sets enough .

When I was a kid all I interacted with were smart old people the IA I studied with , apprenticed under really , was a Douglas line Mechanic for the one Douglas loaned to Trumann after the Super Connie Columbine .

Knowing why ......how we learn .......
I can read the book and the instructions, but it just makes more sense if I have the pieces and tools in hand . I understand that with a mill you plot x,y,z,a,p to make a 3 dimension cut of so wide and so long from AA00@# at CD17$& to CD23() but I just can't get used to the idea that the cutter doesn't move and until I can put my hand on one in motion it's an engraving pantograph in my mind . Then there's the Britt's that draw the isometric drawings inside out and from the right at ZZ6B6B// . A lathe I can see but I've cut few of decapping pin/expanders on a drill press and did a few candle sticks in HS wood shop classes .

 

[Jeff H]

I'm on another forum , actually a couple , where they think I'm some sort of a cast bullet genius ........ I don't feel like I have much more than a good handle on how to get a bunch of lost wheel weights to the back stop so I can pick them up again . Of course a box full of parts converted to a running 1973 355 Chevy SB or 1963 428 FE isn't a really big deal so maybe I don't respect my skill sets enough .

When I was a kid all I interacted with were smart old people the IA I studied with , apprenticed under really , was a Douglas line Mechanic for the one Douglas loaned to Trumann after the Super Connie Columbine .

Knowing why ......how we learn .......
I can read the book and the instructions, but it just makes more sense if I have the pieces and tools in hand . I understand that with a mill you plot x,y,z,a,p to make a 3 dimension cut of so wide and so long from AA00@# at CD17$& to CD23() but I just can't get used to the idea that the cutter doesn't move and until I can put my hand on one in motion it's an engraving pantograph in my mind . Then there's the Britt's that draw the isometric drawings inside out and from the right at ZZ6B6B// . A lathe I can see but I've cut few of decapping pin/expanders on a drill press and did a few candle sticks in HS wood shop classes .

Being "better with hands-on" is not an EXCUSE - it's a HEAD START.

I know that's not where you're going with that, but I often get the excuse "I'm just better with my hands,...." Yep, and yer gonna loose 'em one day if you don't have half a clue about what yer puttin' 'em ON first. I'm not nearly as polite and pleasant in the classroom as I am on the forum.

I understand what you are saying though, and, believe me, you're surely bright enough to UNDERSTAND the theories and laws many simply recite from rote memorization - without having any idea what they MEAN. Finding a way to reconcile the abstract with the real is the key, and association with something else makes that work. Too many people think that formulas are the key, but they're just a "cheat-sheet," a way to document something in short-hand. You still have to UNDERSTAND what the formula MEANS or it's useless. Most creative and resourceful people, like yourself and others here are missing the smaller part of it all. You UNDERSTAND what IS and what need to be done to change it - you have that "vision." When I say "vision," I don't mean hair-brained, stupid ideas either. I mean you can SEE the reality.

What makes ME so damned smart? LOL! I'm NOT and I KNOW it! We "dummies" are still making the world go 'round. My ol' man was an amazing tool & die-maker, but he wouldn't touch anything with a computer on it or even a digital readout, yet they wouldn't can him for not doing mandatory training in either, because he could do stuff none of the "new guys" could. Now, if you're a crusty ol' fart with a modicum of "digital literacy," you've got the world by the butt. You can work your way out of or around.

 

[Bret4207]

I've watched a guy on YT show some of the set up, it's not really "programming" I know that much, for his CNC plasma table. Dudes got a 3D display and down the side bar there's numbers and letters and angles and lengths and different colors and all sorts of fancy schmantsy stuff. All I want to do is make a tab to weld on a hunka steel so my manure spreader...does! Watching him do basically the same thing simply boggles my mind. I admit it- I'm intimidated. I can't get my new router to stay linked to the modem, or set my phone so the camera stops spinning around on me, so how can I possibly learn how to do all that stuff?!!! I'm a wimp. There's also the matter of the $4-6K investment that stops me. I mean, how many times would I REALLY use it?

You can see my thinking I'm sure. But thanks for the vote of confidence. Old guys do rule, we just have a real hard time convincing the rest of the world that it's a fact!

 

[Jeff H]

Old guys have a hard time of convincing THEMSELVES, Bret. That is NOT a criticism.

The "rest of the world" lives in ephemerally, artificially-lit darkness, they just don't know it.

We abuse and misuse, under-utilize technology, because people who don't know no better are in charge. THAT is why this stuff looks so weird and unintuitive. Most "kids" don't understand that they have phones and computers because a lot of old duffs were once young too, and worked to figure things out and make them better. Computers used to get "bigger," faster and better because the market demanded it. Now, the "market" is the spoiled masses looking down their noses at the old duffs who created all this and they now demand "point-n-grunt" and what fails is what doesn't work after three uninspired nudges (taps, swipes or pinches) do not yield a treat in the bowl!

 

[Bret4207]

Oh yeah, I get the "spoiled masses" thing! Dear Lord, it used to be easy to figure stuff out, relatively at least. Seems like somewhere between like XP and W7 (I know nothing about Apple) they went nuts and just tried making things harder instead of easier. I'm not even close to geeky enough to understand the why, but it sure seems to me they could offer a bare bones system for old farts that lets us do what we need without gazillions of extra crap for shopping, gaming, etc. When I got this laptop I had my IT guy give me what I wanted and not much more in Win 10. It's soooooo much simpler not having to try to figure out how to navigate around crap that probably appeals to a 20 something kid but that has no application in my life. Worst part is that MS has managed to make it so I can't get rid of a lot of things! I keep trying to uninstall programs that are linked to the core processes (I guess) and I can't. So somehow even though I never downloaded a bunch of programs, I keep finding them running on my system and collecting files. Not sure if that's industry spyware or what, but every time I deal with it I get one step closer to shooting this thing!!!!!


Bah! Sorry for the rant. Just another of lifes growing irritations!

 

[Jeff H]

You, Sir, are a heck of a lot more enlightened than you are believing yourself to be.

You described perfectly what is going on. Computers and phones today are just milking machines attached to each of us, and far as the software people (MS) are concerned, none of it is yours, not even the music or books you pay for.

Where you miss the mark is thinking that "old farts" need "simpler" machines. On the contrary. It was "old farts," when they were younger farts who drove the IMPROVEMENT of the machines and the software. Between XP and W7, computers were dumbed WAY DOWN for the operators, which is the way it always should have been for 98% of users, but they captured, hobbled and harnessed the users at the same time to milk them for "information" - "data." No, they don't care one bit about little ol' Bret and the piddly goins'-on in his life. Little ol' Bret's contribution is a drop in an ocean, and little ol' Bret can suffer exponential personal consequences for the meager bit they are tapping him for.

When I shopped for my wife's last laptop, W10 was ramping up and I had to shop hard, and actually find an older, refurbished model to get more memory and speed than the antique I was replacing for her. All the new ones were geared toward all the software (and all YOUR stuff) being stored on the cloud," so speed and space were less an issue and computers got less capable. They made computers more like phones.

I have no actual data to back this up, and won't waste my time digging it up, because only a few of us "old people" care, but programs (called "apps" now, and apps used to be too small and limited to be called a program) are designed such that if the unthinking populace can't figure out how to make it work within THREE point-n-grunt attempts (pokes, pinches and swipes), it's not good - it fails. It's all made so that even an ID-TEN-T (idiot) can figure it out!

The catch? If you're not an ID-TEN-T, the you can't figure it out! Problem is - you're thinking too hard. Stuff don't run on that antiquated fuel of brain cells any more.

I better shut up. This is starting to sound like a manifesto. I get onto a social commentary regarding technology and my own prejudices, conjecture and bitter, old-guy resentfulness bubbles over. But, TRULY, we under/mis utilize technology today. If you can get away from the brainless binky-application of it, it really is great, but we let it be used to milk us and most people think that's OK.

 

[Jeff H]

I've heard and read it said often that the difference between a hobbyist and a professional is the first expends time to save materials while the latter expends materials to save time. Time is the most precious commodity of a professional, and the most abundant for the hobbyist.

Very applicable, Ian. I trade little bits of time - at a time to get anything like this done. I also trade time for other resources, like the proper equipment to do it "right," and there's a huge time-surcharge tacked on in that case. I got lucky yesterday and got rained out,... or "rained-IN."

I had started messing with the setup to do the front sight as well, as I had come to resent the amorphous front sight now that I had a crisp outline through which to view it. Fermin Garza (who makes amazing front sights) encouraged me to replace the front sight with a blade in a tenon, rather that the dovetail I was considering. That was the impetus needed to move on it, so yesterday, to the sound of rain on the "tin" roof, I forged on with an idea.

The sight shown is not one of Fermin's sights, but a new Ruger Security Six sight I snagged in the late eighties. I will use it to dial everything in and then order a sight from Fermin. I want a patridge-type sight, but this ramp will do until I get this revolver tested-out/sighted-in again. Everything went fine until I realized I hadn't a single 1/16" roll pin in the shop. Have to wait for a trip to town - which I do reluctantly to begin with.

Very little of this was very conventional, and a significant amount of time DID go into this, particularly on setup, checking setup, RE-checking setup, RE-RE-checking setup,... Anyway, probably an honest three hours, maybe four. Dressing the wheels to the right diameter took a while and the actual grinding took even longer, but everything else was pretty quick. Aside from setup. I did have t o make a jig too.

 

[Petrol & Powder]

VERY IMPRESSIVE !

Well Done.