New Combat Tupperware

CZ93X62

CZ93X62

Official forum enigma
No experience at all with 9mm +P+, quite a bit with the +P though. "+P" is a bit of a misnomer, in truth--all it seems to mean is that it is USA-made or -certified ammo that is loaded to European specs that have been around for over 115 years. 125 grain bullets running in the 1225-1250 FPS bracket, from the Glock 17s and SIG P-226s we played with at work. A 200 FPS uptick for the 125 grainers--and a 225-250 FPS uptick for the 147 grain bullets--is a worthwhile boost in energy between 9mm and 357 SIG in anybody's book. Heck, Winchester even loads its WWB ammo in the caliber, 125 grain bullets in FMJ and JHP forms at 1350 FPS.

I have just about talked myself into a die set and some aftermarket barrels now. I knew this thread was going to cost me money--and add yet another caliber to the circus act.
 
P

Petrol & Powder

Well-Known Member
Here in Virginia the state police have used the .357 SIG cartridge for quite some time and they seem to be happy with it. Despite this fairly common use, .357 SIG brass is rarely encountered. I don't think the cartridge is widely accepted with reloaders. Part of the problem is the expense of factory ammo and part of the problem is reloading that little bottle neck case. Now from a performance point of view the round is impressive.
The 9mm +P with a 124 grain bullet doesn't match the .357 SIG in terms of velocity but it gets close and the smaller diameter of the cartridge equals a bit more magazine capacity with all else being the same. Despite the performance of the .357 SIG, I don't foresee it displacing the 9mm.
 
CZ93X62

CZ93X62

Official forum enigma
Caliber preferences are weird behaviors. C. 2002, there was considerable enthusiasm at our academy over the 357 SIG and its 357 Magnum-like performance. But once the State ammo contract realities became known, the concept got dropped like a hot potato.

It seems like the 357 SIG has been relegated to same Caliber Purgatory occupied by the 10mm, the 41 Magnum, the 32 H&R Magnum and (probably) the 327 Federal. Decent cartridges, very capable, but just didn't explode on scene like the 40 S&W did.
 
P

Petrol & Powder

Well-Known Member
There's little doubt that price plays a large role in cartridge selection. The 357 SIG is clearly a very capable cartridge but its price can be a deterrent.
I think reloaders are a bit shy of 357 SIG because it has a reputation of being a bit difficult to work with.
And while some people report forming 357 SIG from 40 S&W despite the 40 S&W case being just a tad too short, it appears to be preferable to start with real 357 SIG brass. Because factory ammo for 357 SIG is expensive and there's not a lot of free 357 SIG brass laying around, I think that price thing raises its ugly head again.
CZ93X62, I agree the 357 SIG has been relegated to that caliber purgatory of the 10mm, 41 Mag, etc.
 
358156 hp

358156 hp

At large, whereabouts unknown.
My experiences have been the opposite. I set my sizing die to not set the shoulder back at all and load away. Accuracy is excellent. I think some potential reloaders are over thinking the whole process, and are trying to load the cartridge like a rifle cartridge. This is a 40,000 psi handgun cartridge, not a 65,000 psi rifle cartridge. Again, I do not try to size cases for headspace, 357 SIG headspaces on the case mouth IIRC.
 
CZ93X62

CZ93X62

Official forum enigma
No doubt whatsoever--I am over-thinking the 357 SIG reloading bit. I rassled with the 30 Mauser and 30 Luger for a couple years before getting a handle on bullet retention, which a roll crimp enables. If the 357 SIG can't be roll-crimped, I hope that dinky neck will retain bullets.
 
CWLONGSHOT

CWLONGSHOT

Well-Known Member
The 9mm has the annoying trait of saying it "just as good" as a whole bunch of calibers.

I find it off that most of these other calibers dont feel to need for such justification nor does any other caliber ever claim to be as good as a 9mm... :rofl:

CW
 
Last edited:
RBHarter

RBHarter

West Central AR
My favorite is 9mm is superior to 38 by a wide margin ....... Well it does come in platforms with 2-3 times the capacity so there's that . Otherwise it's pretty much a dead heat .
 
Will

Will

Well-Known Member
Petrol & Powder said:
Here comes the cartridge war....
Click to expand...
I don’t think there will be a cartridge war. Just some people try to argue that 9mm +P can compete with 357.
The 357 sig is gonna give you 100fps plus over the 9mm any way you go. 100fps makes a huge difference if you have ever done any expansion testing with pistol bullets.
 
Will

Will

Well-Known Member
I use a lee factory crimp die but I try not to rely on crimp.
I believe good neck tension goes a lot farther than crimp. Coming up with a die setup that gives you consistent neck tension is the key.
I will have a lot of testing to do with cast bullets to find the happy medium between adequate neck tension and not sizing the bullet down.
 
Hawk

Hawk

Well-Known Member
Will said:
I will have a lot of testing to do with cast bullets to find the happy medium between adequate neck tension and not sizing the bullet down.
Click to expand...

That is the trick and will probably vary for each brand of brass.
 
358156 hp

358156 hp

At large, whereabouts unknown.
You can safely load 38 Spl +P to over 1200 fps with a 125 gr bullet, just like 9mm, Hodgdon has data for it. They show 18,300 psi for their load. 9mm is pretty close, again according to Hodgdons data, but 9mm does it at 32,610 psi. Now if only we could come up with a 17 round revolver, I'd never look back! Bonus points if it weighs under ten lbs :rofl:
 
You must log in or register to reply here.