New to me late 80's Redhawk

abj

Member
Winelover, I did not consider that. I might stay in the 250/280 grain range. Mostly my range will be inside 50yds in my woods stands. 150 on the food plots. we only hunt the plots early and late. The rut is about over here in north Ga.
Tony
 

Winelover

North Central Arkansas
Heaviest, 44 caliber mould I own, is a 265 RNFP for my Marlin. Longest shot I ever took, deer hunting, was @ 160 yards. That was with a 270 W in a open field. Hard to tell if you even hit them, even harder to locate the exact spot. Almost all of my shots are less than 100 yards, majority at 15 to 20 yards. I've taken more deer during archery than gun season............and prefer it. Weather is better, too.
 

abj

Member
Archery season here is hot and leaves still on the trees. I love muzzleloader season, just a hint of cold weather. I have taken plenty with a 451 round ball out to about 70 yds. They all drop inside of 50 yds, most at about 25 or 30 with good placement. Whitetails are not hard to harvest, I am amazed at how well a patched round ball does with a muzzle velocity of about 1700 or so. Just two perfectly round holes. I can't remember how much that ball weighs but not as much as the average person thinks.
Tony
 

Winelover

North Central Arkansas
Archery season starts here, the third Saturday in September. I usually don't bother to hunt till October..............too hot. Deer aren't moving, in the heat. Muzzleloading runs for 10 days, starting the third Saturday in October. I took a eight point with a 180 grain .530 diameter round ball. Deer went about 60-70 yards. Passed on three other nice bucks. Two with the crossbow and one with gun. Holding off for the 10 point, I picked up on the trail cam or the exceptionally wide 6-7 point that is in the area. Last weekend was the second 3 day muzzleloader hunt. I didn't participate. Gun is over, except for a remaining 3 day X-mas hunt. Archery ends the end of February. Only deer I'm seeing, are coming in the middle of the night. Picked up two young bucks fighting, the other night.

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CZ93X62

Redlands, Kalifornistan
Round balls are impressive harvesting tools. Trivia time, for those you haven't run across the info previously. The 44/45 caliber round ball for revolver and rifles varied from 440." to .454", and weighed 128 to 140 grains. The 36 caliber RB spanned from .350" to .375", and weighed from 70-75 grains.

The selection of these two calibers was not random. They are a derivation of artillery calibration, which used the weight of spheres of pure lead (e.g., a "12-pounder") to gauge their bore diameter. Bores smaller than "1-pounders" were also "gauged" in this way--a 12 gauge shotgun's bore diameter (.729") equals the diameter of 12 RBs that total 1 pound in weight, the 16 gauge is is 16 to the pound, and so on excepting the 410 and 9mm shotshells, which use a decimal/metric diameter for labeling. The 44/45 diameters are roughly "50 gauge", and the 36 calibers are "100 gauge". The 31/32 calibers were derived from RBs of 150/lb; 28 calibers were derived from RBs of 200/lb. Modern handgun and rifle calibers still adhere loosely to these "standards" set up centuries ago using a common element to calibrate dimensions, and seem to cluster closely around them. FWIW.
 
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Pistolero

Well-Known Member
Well, you can learn something every day. I knew about the 12 ga meaning 12 balls per pound, but not that it had gone
down to rifled weapons. Makes sense, I guess it started with muskets of a certain size, then went smaller, and eventually
rifling was added for round balls.
 

abj

Member
Update.......
Pin gauges are in and all cyl. are a go at .432 and no go at .433 with minus gauges.
Barrel slugs at .429, tighter at muzzle than at breech.
I have ordered a .432 die from Magma yesterday. I shot some .430's through it and did get some leading just past the cone. I think it was from the light loaded 180's I tried. The 240's I had shot good starting at 9.0 unique and I stopped at 10.0. I'm pretty sure the .430 will bump up with 2400 or 296 loads but I ordered the 432 anyway. Range report with 2400 is next.
Tony
 

Pistolero

Well-Known Member
Same as throats or -.001 or even .002, or sometimes +.001 seem to get
best results in most of them. Bullet design has a definite impact on the
situation. How about thread choke? This can be a real issue, but Rugers
seem to suffer from it quite a bit less than S&Ws. Tighter at the muzzle is
a very good thing.

Bill
 
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Winelover

North Central Arkansas
Never slugged my barrel, let alone measure the throats. Wasn't till I met Rick, that I even contemplated that aspect the equation. Still haven't slugged the barrel but did check the throats for slip fit with oversized bullets used in the Marlin. All were large and pretty uniform.

In my early days of cast, no internet, I used RCBS's recommendations. Why not? I was using, exclusively, their 240 SWC gas checked bullet and sizing with .429 sizing die. I was getting exceptional accuracy at twenty yards, sitting with arms supported by my knees, and no leading. Even kilt a deer. What's not to like? I was, supposedly, doing everything wrong. Planets must have been in perfect alignment.:eek: Only other thing I can come up with is the gas check was forgiving aspect of the process. Alloy wasn't much different than I use today.
 

Pistolero

Well-Known Member
Gas check covers a multitude of problems, so that would explain it. And it would explain the
popularity of GCs. I am with Elmer on that topic, never found a need in pistol rounds. Not that
they hurt anything other than the cost and time fiddling with them, which I am happy to avoid.

Bill
 

Winelover

North Central Arkansas
Anymore, when I purchase multiple cavity moulds, at least half of the cavities are ordered with GC shanks. Have carbine companions for all of my pistol chamberings, except 45 Colt.
 

abj

Member
Pistolero, No thread choke that I could detect, quite the opposite actually. It took no effort to push the slug down to the breech. I think I have a very slight tightening from breech to muzzle, which is the best possible condition to have. I'm happy so far. The .432 throats can be solved with a size die.
Hope to get some more .430 loaded on top of 2400 and shot this weekend. I'm kinda thinking I won't see any leading with that powder.
Tony
 

Creeker

Active Member
I used the Lyman 429421 in my 44 with 20 grains of 2400 & a Winchester primer. That load from my 4" S&W clocked 1201 FPS & would do anything I needed. It was accurate at all ranges.
 

CZ93X62

Redlands, Kalifornistan
I used the Lyman 429421 in my 44 with 20 grains of 2400 & a Winchester primer. That load from my 4" S&W clocked 1201 FPS & would do anything I needed. It was accurate at all ranges.
That is about perfect for the S&W Model 29-series revolvers. Even the late Elmer Keith said so, with his statement "1200 FPS is all you'll need" discussing use of his #429421 bullet design. Ol' Elmer knew what he was talking about, too--loads of this intensity are right at my personal limit for recoil comfort in sustained shooting strings with the 4" Smiths. In the Redhawk or the Anaconda, such loads are almost docile--comparatively speaking.
 

Jeff H

NW Ohio
..................Even the late Elmer Keith said so, with his statement "1200 FPS is all you'll need" discussing use of his #429421 bullet design.........................
44 Mag or Special, I always start with the 429421. It seems to work in all of them whether it's factory-level Specials or rip-snortin' Magnums.

It's not always the bullet I want to shoot, but since it always seems to work, I try that one first.
 

Creeker

Active Member
That is about perfect for the S&W Model 29-series revolvers. Even the late Elmer Keith said so, with his statement "1200 FPS is all you'll need" discussing use of his #429421 bullet design. Ol' Elmer knew what he was talking about, too--loads of this intensity are right at my personal limit for recoil comfort in sustained shooting strings with the 4" Smiths. In the Redhawk or the Anaconda, such loads are almost docile--comparatively speaking.
My Model 29 used magna stocks & a Tyler T Grip. The recoil was mostly straight back into my hand. I could handle 1200 fps pretty good. I could not shoot that load over a couple cylinders in my SBH. Ate my hand.
 

Bass Ackward

Active Member
Need your input as to which mold. Hunting mostly and was planning on using 20:1. I have looked at every thread on 44's and still can't decide on round flat or swc. Do the round flat noses have any accuracy advantages over the 429421 clones? Thanks for any advise or experiences you have. Tony
My Redhawk likes longer (heavier) bullets & higher velocities. 20:1 PB, huh? You'll have the heaviest 44 Special on the planet. Either that or you'll do a muzzle loader impersonation carryin a cleaning rod wrapped with a chore boy between each shot. Don't know bout this new fangled coating stuff. But hey, …. if ya can't win fair in life, …. CHEAT! (sure makes that GC look cheaper ALL the time.) :)

You can make almost anything fly well if you are flexible. Meplat size & velocity you want to shoot (or are dictated by 20:1 & your powder choice) will more or less dictate (or eliminate) designs & bullet weight. (eliminate options) So I have to shoot a little harder in my Red than everything else. Just don't get meplat crazy. If a 70% meplat kills well in a 357, then that's only a .59% meplat in a 44 bore. Hollow pointing breaks all the flight rules as it establishes air flow faster and moves bullet balance to the rear where it is easier to stabilize at lower velocities. So it minimizes meplat size (bullet designs) effect on accuracy.

But …. I never hollow point for game anymore.
 
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CZ93X62

Redlands, Kalifornistan
I backed my judgement today with cash--and committed to a new Ruger Bisley Hunter in 44 Magnum. Ruger seems to be phasing out Bisley Model grip offerings outside of special distributor runs like their 44 Specials, and having BisHawks in 357 and 45 Colt with 7.5" barrels (and holsters for same) it seemed like a good time to get on board.