Suggestions for a 357 mag mold
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CWLONGSHOT
Well-Known Member
Dont forget NOE is running a sale ending tonight 20% off all instock
Molds!!!
CW
Molds!!!
CW
CWLONGSHOT
Well-Known Member
CZ93X62
Official forum enigma
Lyman's #358156 Thompson SWC with GC does a lot of things VERY well in 357 Magnum. It feeds in my Henry and bro-in-law's Marlin leverguns, and is at least acceptably accurate in every 357 Magnum I have run it in. Sized to .358", most 357 revolvers have very consistent throat diameters and groove specs, which is likely why 357s shoot so darn well for most folks. If i had to restrict myself to one mould design for 357 Magnum, Ray Thompson's design would get the call.
Still--it is hard to say "NO" to a round flatnose of 160-180 grains in weight for this caliber. That Group Buy 180 grain RFN/GC Lee mould of mine REALLY comes into its own when kicked out hard from the Ruger BisHawk or the Henry. The round flatnose is no slouch as a "Man For All Seasons" choice either.
Still--it is hard to say "NO" to a round flatnose of 160-180 grains in weight for this caliber. That Group Buy 180 grain RFN/GC Lee mould of mine REALLY comes into its own when kicked out hard from the Ruger BisHawk or the Henry. The round flatnose is no slouch as a "Man For All Seasons" choice either.
358156 hp
At large, whereabouts unknown.
Here's a great article to check out- http://www.lasc.us/Fryxell38SWC.htm
I have a lot of 38/357 moulds, probably too many if there is such a thing. My "go to" gas check bullet is 358156, and I have several of them, both solid & hollowpoint. I have about as many Ideal & Lyman 357446 moulds as 358156, possibly more. This design likes to be pushed fairly hot in my experience, extra points if you managed to secure one of the later Lyman marked versions that has a wider & larger front driving band like the original Keith design, not the production version Keith with the reduced front band although many, many people have been completely happy with the production version.
Keith bullets seem to work better for me when driven hard as well. My 38 Spl bullet is a SAECO 382. It seems happiest at higher 38 Spl velocities, and I keep a few various wadcutter moulds around for light target work. Wadcutters can also be pushed past the low recoil "target" velocities with good accuracy and terminal effect at medium velocities at longer ranges than you might expect. BTW, Lyman lists reloading data for 357 mag wadcutter loads in the old manuals up to 1400 fps or so. I haven't tried them yet myself. For a plainbase SWC at moderate velocities, I've heard excellent reviews on 358477 from people I trust, some of them on this board but I haven't tried that design myself for some reason yet.
I have a lot of 38/357 moulds, probably too many if there is such a thing. My "go to" gas check bullet is 358156, and I have several of them, both solid & hollowpoint. I have about as many Ideal & Lyman 357446 moulds as 358156, possibly more. This design likes to be pushed fairly hot in my experience, extra points if you managed to secure one of the later Lyman marked versions that has a wider & larger front driving band like the original Keith design, not the production version Keith with the reduced front band although many, many people have been completely happy with the production version.
Keith bullets seem to work better for me when driven hard as well. My 38 Spl bullet is a SAECO 382. It seems happiest at higher 38 Spl velocities, and I keep a few various wadcutter moulds around for light target work. Wadcutters can also be pushed past the low recoil "target" velocities with good accuracy and terminal effect at medium velocities at longer ranges than you might expect. BTW, Lyman lists reloading data for 357 mag wadcutter loads in the old manuals up to 1400 fps or so. I haven't tried them yet myself. For a plainbase SWC at moderate velocities, I've heard excellent reviews on 358477 from people I trust, some of them on this board but I haven't tried that design myself for some reason yet.
2011redrider
Member
He may have been referring to the 360-165 swc, seems to be the only one in that weight range w 2 crimp grooves.View attachment 12463
I too favor the #358156. Use it only for MAX Loads. And those loads from the distant past are a Lot hotter then those published these days. But then Hercules 2400 was reformulated in the 1990's. So you save a grain or 2 for the same Velocity/Pressure. Stopped using the Skeeter Skelton .38Spl load with the #358156 crimped in the lower crimp groove a loong time ago. Just see no use for it anymore. Brass is cheap and plentiful these days.
The #358477 is My second std for .38Spl , the first is the Keith #358429. Both My 6" .38Spl revolvers, a Colt OP & S&W M10 shoot to POA at 25yds with it and 3.0grs of Bullseye.
I use the #358477 for .357Mag in a M27, (short Cylinder) over a Medium charge of Unique. And a #358429 for all other .357Mag revolvers.
The #358446, I don't have much experience with. My bullet choices are pretty much what I grew up with.
My choice of bullets is the same thing My Dad cast and loaded. Except for the Wad Cutters. He cast the H&G #50 from a 10cav mold for Practice and a Lyman #358395HB for Competition. I've never competed in Bullseye Competition. I have no use for Wad Cutters so I haven't cast any in a loong time. The SWC's fill My needs for Paper Punching.
The old #358311 RN serves for non paper plinking.
Only "new" mold I ever bought was the #358665 & later on the Lee # 358-158-RF, for My Kids Cowboy Shooting Guns.
It boils down to what works for you. I know a lot of Folks in Cowboy Shooting use the 125gr bullet with a "light as can go powder charge".
Saw one even using the old Lyman 75gr WC in Revolver Loads.
So many Loads are .38Spl & .357Mag, almost interchangeable. Just the one .357Mag Hot Gas Check load and two Medium "target/plinking" loads.
All the rest go in a .38Spl case.
Just a Ramble on My Loads. Served Me for so long, I see no reason to change.
But I am gonna experiment with the #358446. Always wondered why My Dad never used it.
The #358477 is My second std for .38Spl , the first is the Keith #358429. Both My 6" .38Spl revolvers, a Colt OP & S&W M10 shoot to POA at 25yds with it and 3.0grs of Bullseye.
I use the #358477 for .357Mag in a M27, (short Cylinder) over a Medium charge of Unique. And a #358429 for all other .357Mag revolvers.
The #358446, I don't have much experience with. My bullet choices are pretty much what I grew up with.
My choice of bullets is the same thing My Dad cast and loaded. Except for the Wad Cutters. He cast the H&G #50 from a 10cav mold for Practice and a Lyman #358395HB for Competition. I've never competed in Bullseye Competition. I have no use for Wad Cutters so I haven't cast any in a loong time. The SWC's fill My needs for Paper Punching.
The old #358311 RN serves for non paper plinking.
Only "new" mold I ever bought was the #358665 & later on the Lee # 358-158-RF, for My Kids Cowboy Shooting Guns.
It boils down to what works for you. I know a lot of Folks in Cowboy Shooting use the 125gr bullet with a "light as can go powder charge".
Saw one even using the old Lyman 75gr WC in Revolver Loads.
So many Loads are .38Spl & .357Mag, almost interchangeable. Just the one .357Mag Hot Gas Check load and two Medium "target/plinking" loads.
All the rest go in a .38Spl case.
Just a Ramble on My Loads. Served Me for so long, I see no reason to change.
But I am gonna experiment with the #358446. Always wondered why My Dad never used it.
CZ93X62
Official forum enigma
Lyman #358477 has been VERY GOOD to me for a lot of years, mostly in 38 Special and more recently in my 'tight' little Colt and S&W 38 S&Ws. It has been accurate from 600 to 950 FPS. It has had only a small bit of use in 357 Magnum, and those are the 900-950 FPS loadings. These are quite docile in the L-frame S&Ws.
It took the 38 S&Ws to show me just how effective the ancient 38 S&W can be in a good revolver. A 150 grain SWC sized to fit throats and running at 675-700 FPS pole-axes small game and varmints to 40-50 yards, and will shoot as accurately as my 38 Special revolvers to that same 50 yard distance. The bullets don't bounce back from the targets' cardboard backer, either. Revolvers are VERY capable of "Low Node" accuracy just like rifles can be, with a whole lot less Donner und Blitzen than the SAAMI-level or Doug Wesson-level 357 Magnums put out.
It took the 38 S&Ws to show me just how effective the ancient 38 S&W can be in a good revolver. A 150 grain SWC sized to fit throats and running at 675-700 FPS pole-axes small game and varmints to 40-50 yards, and will shoot as accurately as my 38 Special revolvers to that same 50 yard distance. The bullets don't bounce back from the targets' cardboard backer, either. Revolvers are VERY capable of "Low Node" accuracy just like rifles can be, with a whole lot less Donner und Blitzen than the SAAMI-level or Doug Wesson-level 357 Magnums put out.
358156 hp
At large, whereabouts unknown.
357446 had a reputation for being a bit fussy. It was always hit or miss though, the design had a very long catalogue lifespan (1939ish to 1999ish), so Lyman was selling plenty of them. I pretty much think it was simply better at higher velocities, and not everybody wants to go all out. It also is suspected of being an inspiration for 358156, and the resemblance is quite remarkable.
I know the Thompson Gas Check bullets were given existing mold numbers when Lyman/Ideal bought the designs from Ray Thompson in the early 1950's.
The old molds were given new numbers. The only one I'm sure of is the #429215 became the #429478, a 210gr RN.
As far as I know, My Dad was loading the #358429 in .38Spl cases for .38-44 loads as a teenager in the late 1930's. He never loaded much for the #358446, don't know why He didn't like it. We only had 1 2cav mold for it.
He loaded the #358429 in .357Mag cases by crimping over the front driving band.
Once the #358156 became available, that was His only Bullet of choice for Hot Loads in the .357Mag.
He did load a few 180gr FP's, that's were I got My Saeco #354 mold from. But only for Rifle loads.
I've looked at #358446 & #358156, don't see that the #156 is a gas check copy of the #446.
The driving bands are different on both. Guess you have examine both side by side, good clean castings, unsized.
The old molds were given new numbers. The only one I'm sure of is the #429215 became the #429478, a 210gr RN.
As far as I know, My Dad was loading the #358429 in .38Spl cases for .38-44 loads as a teenager in the late 1930's. He never loaded much for the #358446, don't know why He didn't like it. We only had 1 2cav mold for it.
He loaded the #358429 in .357Mag cases by crimping over the front driving band.
Once the #358156 became available, that was His only Bullet of choice for Hot Loads in the .357Mag.
He did load a few 180gr FP's, that's were I got My Saeco #354 mold from. But only for Rifle loads.
I've looked at #358446 & #358156, don't see that the #156 is a gas check copy of the #446.
The driving bands are different on both. Guess you have examine both side by side, good clean castings, unsized.
358156 hp
At large, whereabouts unknown.
I did say "inspired". As strange as it sounds, this is the way many bullet designs were originated, Keiths included. Take existing design & features and blend together to suit your needs. Ray Thompsons double gas check grooves were a stroke of genius, 357 mag brass was hard to come by in the late 40s & early 50s. This design made that situation far less important, and I've often wondered why others didn't do it more often as well. It's too bad that the 44 magnum didn't exist when Ray was designing his bullets, what would the 429244 look like if it had? Oddly, the 358156 & 452490 appear to be sort of related, but 429244 appears different. We'll probably never know.