The continuing quest for "Extreme" bullet lube

Just roll a tiny play-doh snake of MML+Soap between your fingers and then squish it into the lube groove and run it through a sizer. It's even easier to do than it is to type out. I wear rubber hospital gloves when I do anything with cast bullets and it was easy for me to roll it out with them on. I'm glad somebody else brought it up as I completely forgot about it and it is a lot easier than pan lubing. At least it has been for me the couple of times I have done it.
 

Brad

Benevolent Overlord and site owner
Staff member
6661 with STP in place of Ivory is going to be sticky and soft. I mean really sticky.
I would go with 6661 as designed.
 

Volume One

New Member
Just roll a tiny play-doh snake of MML+Soap between your fingers and then squish it into the lube groove and run it through a sizer. It's even easier to do than it is to type out. I wear rubber hospital gloves when I do anything with cast bullets and it was easy for me to roll it out with them on. I'm glad somebody else brought it up as I completely forgot about it and it is a lot easier than pan lubing. At least it has been for me the couple of times I have done it.

Thanks Andy, you really made an effort to explain this and i appreciate it.

I need to pick up a lee sizer but I do have a small aluminum press I never use, would be great as a dedicated sizer
 
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Brad

Benevolent Overlord and site owner
Staff member
Ok, that is a lot different. One-half ounce of STP in 3 pounds of lube wouldn't make a big difference.
What the soap adds is a hint of high temp ability. Keeps it from going liquid as fast in heat.
 

Spindrift

Well-Known Member
Have anyone tried silicone grease as a component in bullet lube? The product I have been looking at seems to have some interesting attributes, like extreme temp resistance(-40-750F working temp) and very high film strength.
 

Will

Well-Known Member
Interesting, the ratio might be a little different. It was 1 lb of each main ingredient and one tbsp of STP.


I still think without the ivory soap it’s going to be way to soft and runny in hot weather.

My biggest downfall with 6-6-6-1 is in hot weather it gets a little soft.

To be honest though I’m mainly worried about my first shot hitting where I’m aiming when it’s 30deg out and a deer walks through.
 

Ian

Notorious member
I steered away from silicone for several reasons.

Silicone oil doesn't play well with most waxes.
It doesn't lubricate metal very well.
It doesn't lose viscosity fast enough when fired.
The grease varieties are thickened with fumed silica, which is highly abrasive under boundary conditions.
Under heat and pressure, silicone oil reverts to crystalline silica......sand.

If you want to fool with something having similar positive properties and none of those particular negatives, try polybutene.
 

Eutectic

Active Member
We lube cooks with a PhD degree in lube formulation also have a language of our own for our creations! I think before we ever lube a bullet with a new formula we 'feel it up' first! Then we have a complete vocabulary to our 'feel up' opinion. Myself (to not insult anybody) notice hardness first. I feel for tackiness then cohesion.... By now I'm pretty good at judging adhesion as well which I confirm on the first finger lubed bullet. Then we have 'film' and 'glide' (who came up with that one??) My last 'feel up' tests for thixotropy as to speed and how the oils move. This is PhD stuff! Then I (we?) make a diagnosis as how the lube will perform! I personally, have changed a formula because I didn't like a particular quality! Smart???? Hummmm?

You most know by now that a cold start from a fouled barrel has no peer for me as the very most important thing! Would a cold start of say 3/4" at 70 yards make me miss a grouse??? Probably not.... So I picked up two NOE molds on sale. One is a 63gr gas check .25 I hadn't seen. It appears to be the Lyman 257283 design shortened with a gas check. My two Savage 23's normally don't like a bullet under 67 grs. But they like this one! I recommend this design to make your Model 23 shine!

Second mold is a .32-20. They call it 85 grs but it cast from soft alloy at 83 grs for me. Holds minimal lube which I liked on observation. Preliminary tests showed it fussy and it wouldn't stay with my Accurate design 31-108C. I liked it smaller meplat so stayed with it. I got bullets touching at 70 yards with 45-45-10 with plenty of thinning (like Lamar says...) But every 6 or 8 shots one would go from touching to 3/4" high. No big deal??? It is for this gun!
666-1 has been kicked around... I like it! But it was sired off the old NRA formula of 1/3 beeswax, 1/3 paraffin, and 1/3 Vaseline. I have this made up too. Back to 'feeling up'! NRA feels light and fluffy..... cohesion/adhesion are nil! Cohesion to the point your little snake will break as you finger lube. Very little thixotropy either! But it shot pretty good in light loads.... Faster and warmer made lead! It did seem to handle big or small lube amounts the same...
So I cleaned the Savage .32-20.... I lubed some of those 83 gr primadonnas with NRA and loaded them with 3.5grs of Unique. I wiped out the solvent wet barrel with a dry patch and started shooting at 70 yards.... 5 shots were touching at 70 yards including the one from a clean bore........ and they stay touching since then! So just maybe our 'feel up' ain't what we think it cracked up to be??????

As good as it is for my grouse loads it is no lube for Ian! Texas right now would 'melt it down' quick...... fast....... and in a hurry!

Pete
 
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Ian

Notorious member
I think Fiver invented the term "glide". We know what it means, not greasy/slippery, not tacky, but like feeling fine silk cloth. "Feathering" is a term I stuck with, you know it when see it, a characteristic of highly-branched waxes.

Cohesion is a handling property, not a shooting property. The thixotropic property is super-important to accurate, consistent lube, and it's an easy feel test, sort of a "work softening" test. Greasy...not good. Lube should rub away to nothing between your fingers, and wipe away leaving no residue that can be felt. Gritty lubes often shoot well at high speed, reference the old thread Fiver started entitled "does your lube have enough friction?"

Alox lubes have little use at my house except for Ben's Liquid Lube, which cured the chronic calcium ash build/purge cycle of virtually every other film concoction out there. A little beeswax melted into 45/45/10 is almost as good, in fact better if you just use BW, LLA, and Stoddard solvent.

One of the essential attributes of a good lube is being soft, but in Texas or anywhere else that it gets really hot in the summer soft lubes won't work the way I like without a serious dose of grease thickener of some kind so they don't slump or weep in the heat, but will go liquid quickly under pressure and jettison at the muzzle (provided it isn't TOO cohesive and doesn't have a bunch of other high-melting stuff in it to keep the viscosity too high too long).
 

Hawk

Well-Known Member
I'm with Ian.
Daytime temps 4 months out of the year are near 100 degrees. 140 to 150 in a truck sitting in the sun at the deer lease. Last Sunday it reached 112 in my back yard.
Really cold may get into the upper teens 4 or 5 days a year but usually in the mid to upper 30s.
The start of deer season, highs could easily be in the mid 80's.
I need a lube, for pistol and <2,000 fps .223, that will handle those temps.
I've been powder coating, lately, because that seems to solve most of the problems, but would like something I could cook up if the SHTF and PCing isn't really an option.
 
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Ian

Notorious member
I'm looking to PC more and more. Pesky cold-bore wild flyers have been an issue in some instances, though, still working on that to isolate cause and find a correction.
 

JWFilips

Well-Known Member
Ian,
I have been testing PC since January 2018 Granted I do not shoot heavy charges but I have not experienced that. Seems the wost case is just out of group with a cold bore but I do not clean unless the bore looks messed up! % guns no issues very tight groups.

Now my last rifle is the 243 Win Ruger 77V That is a different story. Maybe because loads are alway approching 2000 FPS I'm getting stuff in the bore and Fliers!
Jim
 

Ian

Notorious member
Jim, this is one of mine which doesn't throw the first shot....Savage .308 hog hunter, Lee 309-230-5R, powder-coated straight wheel weights @ 980 fps muzzle. Target shows two shots fired at the 80 yd target frame from a cold (98-100F!!!), dirty bore, for demo purposes of consistent 1-2 shot placement for a friend at his private range. Why no bullseye you ask? I brought the wrong suppressor that day, had to use my Blackout can and it's an early design by me which is extremely quiet but induces some poi shift. Works great on rifles sighted in for it.

20180623_084147.jpg
 
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