The Lee c309-170-F

[Spindrift]

The Lee c309- family of bore- riders is kind of organized in pairs, each round- nosed bullet having a slightly lighter, flat- nosed sibling.
The 120-R, and the 113-F
The 160-R, and the 150-F
The 180-R, and the 170-F
The 200-R, and the... wait! What happened to the c309-190-F? Kind of shame they never made it, it would be useful to many people.

Anyway, I got a 2-cav c309-170-F a while ago. I cast some bullets, for some reason using my soft BHN 11 range scrap. I usually use this for subsonic loads. I put on my home- made alu gas checks, coated them and then forgot about them.

These bullets resurfaced the other day, and I decided to shoot them in my Howa 1500, .308win



I didn’t know what a soft bore-rider could take with powder coat, I decided to do a little «stress test». 37 grs Vectan Tubal-5000, which is an extruded single-base typical .308win powder. The listed starting load for 180grs jacketed, is 35,5grs. My bullets weighed in at 176grs.
I ran the noses into a .302 NOE nose sizer, which didn’t so much size the nose, as smooth out some high spots. Which is all you can expect from this sizer concept.
COL set to a little jump. All cartridges fed smoothly from the magazine.

Point of impact was more or less to point of aim at 100m, the rifle is zeroed at 150m with a full-power 185grs jacketed bullet. I shot 4 groups of 5 shots, average c-c 1,3MOA. Below is the best, and the worst group.



I also shot a bullet into water containers. 5 litre windshield- fluid containers are now the most common test medium around here, as you can get them for free at any gas station.
For reference, in the 30-06, a 180grs Interlock typically penetrate 5 containers. A 180-grs bonded bullet manages 6 such containers, and a 200grs bonded bullet 7.

I had expected this soft bullet to more or less blow up at almost mid-range jecketed load levels. Well, the containers sure blew up.... The fist two were completely ruptured. There were some lead fragments in the second and third container. The bullet actually penetrated through the 6th container, cracked the rear wall of the 6th and bounced back.

Retained weight 130grs (75%), the bullet was .413 when it came to rest.



Surprisingly good!
It acted kind of like a partition bullet; rapid expansion, moderate fragmentation resulting in a shank of modest expanded diameter with deep penetration.

This load will not win any competitions, or anything. But this seems to be a well balanced, reliable, useful load!

Edit: typo

 

[Rushcreek]

That bullet shoots better than I can
in my 30-30, 30-40, and 30-06 bolt action rifles. I like the 150gr sibling as well and the 113gr baby brother is the only lead bullet I use in the 30 Carbine.

 

[Ian]

You'll find that if you shoot it into a catch medium, the bullet won't be a bore-rider anymore but will have slugged up considerably to fit the barrel, likely beginning its shape-shifting in the throat. Looks pretty dang good to me, I hunt with a load that does almost exactly the same thing and it is quite devastating to wild pigs.

Isn't powder coat a wonderful tool?

 

[JustJim]

I've used that bullet (sans PC) at about 1500fps for control shooting and varmints. It wasn't the most accurate in any rifle but seemed to perform fairly well in game.

 

[Spindrift]

Isn't powder coat a wonderful tool?

Yes, it is!
I'm shooting a lot of coated plain-base bullets these days, and it is quite fascinating how this skinny polymer coat extend the tolerance of my PB bullets.

Rushcreek, I also have the 113-F and the 150-F. While the 150-grainer has been a solid performer in many rifles, I've never achieved stellar accuracy with the 113-F.

JustJim, it seems to perform like a good hunting bullet! My magnetospeed has broken down on me, so I have no functioning chrono at the moment. But I'd guess my load is around 2200fps.

 

[Reloader762]

Thats a nice rifle there Spindrift and good shooting as well, wish I could go shoot at 100 yds. whenever I wanted, all the shooting range around here are pay for play and very expensive and I understand why that it but it's not in my budget.

The Lee .309 170 gr. is one of my favorite bullets in my 30 cal. rifles, I shoot it in my $250 Rem. 770 budget rifle and scope and my Sav. 99 in 300 Sav. I cast the bullet from 50/50 PB/COWW, PC, quench, GC and size to .311" I have a NOE nose sizer but haven't messed with it any yet. I worked up a couple of loads using H-4198 a couple of years ago, but the chrono wasn't cooperating at the time so I had to go back later and redo the test and here were my results. Granted, this is only at 50 yds. so take it for what it's worth.

Average MV 1725 fps.


Average MV 2295 fps.


Just for kicks, I tried some 2400 loads as well, using the Lee 309 170 gr. FP as well as the Lee TL312" 160 gr. RN. Same bullet makeup specifications MV on both bullets ran just over 1700 fps. with either bullet. You should give the Lee 160 a try in your 308, it seems to do very well in ever US 30 cal. rifle, I've tried it in.

 

[MW65]

Great info gents!! I normally use the rcbs 30-180 fn for my 300 sav loads, but do have a lee 309-170 I need to test out... thanks!

 

[Spindrift]

Excellent results, Reloader762!

MW65, it sure is worth a try!

 

[Rushcreek]

Today I had great results with the Lee C309170F from my 30-30 with Accurate 2015 and from my 30-40 Krag with IMR 3031 at 40yds. Actually my best group so far with cast in the Krag. 7shots in 1" with Redfield peep and blade front sights.

 

[Jeff H]

I've used this bullet in the 30/30 and 300 BLK with excellent results, shooting at about 1500 fps. I never chronographed either, and I was not PC'ing at that time. I just used 45/45/10 and home-made aluminum GCs. I was impressed with the deformation at fifty yards, using ACWW and plowing into wood in various stages of decomposition and dirt. Those which did not run into each other (few) in the back stop, were nicely expanded. I've never shot an animal made of decomposing logs or dirt, so I can't comment of their effectiveness in that respect.

I was using an old, borrowed 1C mould because I didn't have a 30 cal mould at the time. Otherwise, just looking at the bullet, I'd have never thought to try it. A larger meplat would have appealed, but these still made some cool-looking, little fist-like remnants in the back stop.

 

[Ben]

Jeff H

I once tested a pistol ( .40 S&W ) with one of my HP reloads in a bucket of wet sand. I posted photos of the nicely mushroomed bullet.

Another fellow posted below that photo :

" That's real nice, if you are attacked by a bucket of wet sand and have to protect yourself, you now know exactly how the bullet will perform. "

 

[CWLONGSHOT]

Jeff H

I once tested a pistol ( .40 S&W ) with one of my HP reloads in a bucket of wet sand. I posted photos of the nicely mushroomed bullet.

Another fellow posted below that photo :

" That's real nice, if you are attacked by a bucket of wet sand and have to protect yourself, you now know exactly how the bullet will perform. "

There is always THAT GUY.. Probably a cousin to the commenter " Ya just cant quite actually hit that Quarter can ya."

 

[Spindrift]

Nice to hear you've also had good results with this bullet! What surprised me the most, was how well it fared in the water containers, considering the soft alloy, and pretty hot load.

There are those, who like to showcase the brilliance of their intelligence by pointing out that wet-packs have no bones, we don't hunt water containers and rarely need protection from wet sand.

I think these are relatively widely known facts.

However, if we want to get an idea about the terminal behavior of our bullets before actual use, we need to test them in something. And that medium must be at hand, manageable and preferably not expensive. We use what we have, and interpret the results with a sound regard of the limitations of the model. Not much else we can do?