Whether Report

[Jeff H]

"Whether" or not you find your desired "tools of the trade" available/affordable these days is, as we know IFFY, and subject to some pretty outrageous prices.

I finally broke down and bought a LEE .358" sizing die and another set of LEE 6C handles, both of which I have needed badly for some time. Both were available on ebay and Amazon, but for grossly inflated prices - even above the normal "free-shipping" prices, which actually surpass prices from other places by about as much as shipping would cost, plus a little. $35 to $40 for either the die or that handles!

Midsouth, a company I've used for ages, had the stuff for more than I remember paying the last time, but it's been a LONG time, and at prices I'd say were about pre-panic prices, but the shipping and tax took the final bill to over $50! For two Items I paid $10 ad $12 the LAST time I bought them. The order took over a week to ship, but I get that. Once it shipped, it got here fairly quickly, and someone at Midsouth is trying to offload seventeen tons of silver-colored Christmas wrapping paper, because I had to dig out and un-wad at least a whole ROLL of the stuff! In other words, they don't skimp on packing and your order will be safe.

I'm sure glad I pretty much have what I need - MORE than I need, and I intend to try to move some surplus stuff at a small local show coming up in October.

Just wanted to throw in some data for those watching for the return of "tools of t he trade."

 

[smokeywolf]

Was going to buy some 45 ACP brass from Midsouth a couple of months ago. Through their website you have to "register". Decided to just call them and order over the phone. Girl who answered insisted that you must "register" to buy anything from them by any means. I said, "I just want to give you name, address, credit card and hear that I'll have my order in a week or two. Don't want to "register"". She said, that's not possible. I said, "Oh well, so much for Midsouth."

 

[RicinYakima]

I just send all their email ads to junk mail, and let it go.

 

[Jeff H]

Well,.... the point was actually that some stuff is becoming available, and not at exorbitant prices, which I felt was good news.

Shop where you want. I checked Midway too and their prices were higher.

@smokeywolf , I do that myself, often, and usually for one-off purchases. I started buying from Midsouth, by real-mail and over the phone in 1986 when the McClure-Volkmer bill passed and was signed into law, allowing us to buy reloading components and ammo "by mail." Sent my driver's license to Midsouth, Natchez and Wiley's (now defunct) and have done a fair amount of business with all of them over the years. I don't remember formally registering, but I suppose I must have at some time.

@RicinYakima , the only e-mails I ever get from Midsouth is the one saying they got my order and the one saying it's shipped. IF you are registered (not saying it's a reason to), you can opt out of all other e-mails. Otherwise, you can mark them as "junk" and you won't see them to be bothered by them.

I typically shop among several places looking for all the items I need in one place so I pay one shipping charge and where I can get the best price. Sometimes, one of those two criteria supersedes the other. I've been treated well by the people at Midsouth in the past but haven't spoken with them personally since the Internet pervaded our lives, so maybe things have changed.

 

[Joshua]

Well they are the ones who stock that 130 grain 7mm soup can mold. I’m glad that it was in stock. It wasn’t very expensive for a “custom” run six cavity mold.

Also, their powder seems to be priced around three to four dollars less per pound when compared to Midway.

 

[smokeywolf]

I do business with about a half dozen suppliers. While I occasionally buy products from Midway, powder and primers isn't among them.

 

[Spindrift]

It’s good to hear things are slowly moving in the direction of normality.

In this phase of panic buying, a lot of people have probably bought equipment (like casting equipment and moulds) that they will not use much. My weather forecast is, you’ll have a «buyer’s market» in lightly used casting-related equipment in a year or two.

Here in Norway, we’re also noticing the draught in American components- but nothing serious, so far. It will get worse before it gets better, though. I’m stocked up pretty good, no worries for me.

 

[Jeff H]

It’s good to hear things are slowly moving in the direction of normality.

In this phase of panic buying, a lot of people have probably bought equipment (like casting equipment and moulds) that they will not use much. My weather forecast is, you’ll have a «buyer’s market» in lightly used casting-related equipment in a year or two.

Here in Norway, we’re also noticing the draught in American components- but nothing serious, so far. It will get worse before it gets better, though. I’m stocked up pretty good, no worries for me.

We'll keep our fingers crossed for you guys. I'm guessing there is less pressure on your market than here, but then the supplies will also be maintained to support the smaller market, but I especially like seeing others appreciate and enjoy OUR products as much as we enjoy THEIRS. I know I appreciate heck out of my Norwegian stove, Finnish rifles, Swedish knives,.... I feel like "shooting stuff" is something we do very right and hope that it continues to be available to all who appreciate it. Something we can be proud of.



I'm personally not in "danger" by any means and the items I "needed," I've gotten by without for a few years, but it's just really nice having that extra set of 6C handles after going from one 6C mould to several 4C and 6C moulds. I can run bullets into and out of my .3585" Lyman die, but it's extra work. I cast in gobs on the few occasions each winter I get to cast and process batches, running everything through each step a little at a time AS I HAVE time. I cast for three people. The other two do other things for me.

Regarding what you may read elsewhere, it's not black and white - either you were smart enough to stock up or too dumb or complacent to do so. Yes, there are MANY like that, but there are a lot of folks who just can't afford to do that. Not to get political about it, but the erroneous "haz-mat" fee - our own Department of Transportation has determined that powder and primers are perfectly SAFE to ship in certain quantities and as packaged by the manufacturers. In 1986, it was determined by Congress that it was safe enough to ship to anyone old enough to posses it.

Believe it or not, the "haz-mat" was an agreement made by one of our administrations we tend to think are on our side and the UN. When the $2 "haz-mat" fee went up by 50% very early in the game, I called DOT and complained. The guy was very nice and explained where that came from, what the carriers were supposed to do with the money, etc. Regardless of the intention, it becomes a "fine" or "penalty" - a regressive tax which hurts lower income people more than the more well-off. There is no extra effort required of a shipper worth $30 for handling something our own DOT and Congress deemed as safe to ship as they had been shipping all along - that I can see.

I'm still using primers I bought in bulk in 1994, when I was in industry, making good money. Being "poor," is not mutually exclusive with being "smart." Many choose lower paying jobs in public service (any ex cops, military, teachers among us?) and get penalized for voluntarily foregoing higher income potential to try to do something GOOD. I've shared some of what I have, which is NOT vast stores, with people like that. There is NOWHERE near me to pick up 1k primers every month or every other month, so I HAVE to wait and save to make an order worth the "haz-mat" and shipping - which is also getting ridiculous. I don't get to associate with enough other people who can scrape up enough to combine orders as I did when I was in industry either.

I'm not in the "danger zone," which I would consider, NO recreational shooting. A hundred large rifle primers would do me for a long, long time - as long as I only used them for hunting. A thousand large or small pistol primers would hold me for a long, long time, as long as I reserved them for small game and no self-defense practice AT ALL. I actually have enough stuff to "play" a little (cleverly disguised as "research" - load development) at the rate I shoot, for a long, long time. If I were shooting competitively, or had time to shoot every weekend, I'd be fretting a bit. I;m actually getting rid of stuff - reducing the amount of

My call to attention on the supplies coming back are meant as a good sign that things are on the shelf. I was "set" for toilet paper when the virus panic started, but it sure is nice to see full shelves of it again. For one thing, it keeps the many who WERE/ARE just stupid or complacent from rioting and looting. I cringe at the thought of having to use up primers and powder to protect my toilet paper.

 

[STIHL]

Mid south has went downhill. In my opinion. I’ve ordered from them in the past. Midways prices have been better than midsouth here lately, but packaging isn’t as good as it once was. Seems we are just screwed until this panic is over and a surplus of stuff is sitting on shelves. This will take a whole lot of people to finally calm down or run out of money to spend. Boom sticks prices have went up about 100 bucks here. And they don’t have to come down in the pricing. They will sell them. If we need anything, We have to try and source it local, or pay the prices they are asking. I did run across a #14 shell plate at my LGS yesterday, they are like hens teeth. 31.50 out the door. I thought that was as reasonable as I’ve ever bought one. On the flip side a pound of powder was 40.00 bucks. For all of it. I left that sitting on the shelf.

 

[Ian]

I've been working on a Diesel rifle design off and on for a while. Having a lot of trouble figuring out how to reduce lock time and moving mass to reasonable levels. Starting to think more about a gasoline or alcohol spark-ignition version with a lower compression ratio and less temperature sensitivity.

 

[Rockydoc]

Well they are the ones who stock that 130 grain 7mm soup can mold. I’m glad that it was in stock. It wasn’t very expensive for a “custom” run six cavity mold.

Also, their powder seems to be priced around three to four dollars less per pound when compared to Midway.

That 7mm soup can mold has a flat meplat. Midsouth is apparently the only source of this flat pointed mold. The one from Lee is round pointed. This is a 6 cavity mold and mine cast 6 perfect bullets on the very first pour. I can't remember that ever before happening to me on a new mold.

I like dealing with Midsouth.

 

[CZ93X62]

I've been working on a Diesel rifle design off and on for a while. Having a lot of trouble figuring out how to reduce lock time and moving mass to reasonable levels. Starting to think more about a gasoline or alcohol spark-ignition version with a lower compression ratio and less temperature sensitivity.

And I thought my "Duplexing WC-860 with IMR-4198" was kinda out there. That kind of thing is way esoteric. Dieseling airguns are not viewed in a good light by airgunfolk. Way-bad karma.

 

[Ian]

That's because airguns aren't designed to Diesel. My concept involves a pressurized fuel system, poppet injector, spring-driven piston, and large, spring-loaded pintle valve that vents combustion gas into the barrel from the combustion chamber once pressure reaches about 1000-1500 PSI. I also tinkered with the math of a propane-powered, spark-ignited, spring-piston-compressed system but although it would be far simpler to make and much lighter than the Diesel design, it wouldn't have nearly as much power.

 

[CZ93X62]

It's a hella-interesting concept. I hope it bears fruit for you.

 

[RBHarter]

I mentally explored the propane ignition in a small caliber . At the time I wasn't smart enough to figure out how to seal the front of the chamber . Oxy/pro torches weren't really a thing then so getting the fuel mix was also a problem for me . With what I have now 20 yr later those are simple solutions with conventional parts .

I was told once that propane operated at 115 octane . That would allow a safe compression to about 165 psi at about 14:1 mix .

 

[Ian]

Paslode makes a propane framing nailer that to handle and look at seems about 8-9 pounds and has a piston about 2.5" in diameter. The power it delivers is in the rimfire ballpark. The same sort of challenge exists for Diesel concept, only so many BTUs in a drop of fuel and only so much O2 in a puff of air.

 

[RBHarter]

So that takes us to NOS/OXY air and controlled chamber pre pressure maybe even preheated fuel .

There's lots of room between the paintball guns , $2000+ precharged super air rifles , and gas fueled potato guns .

Any chance a pressure step up device might work ?
Hydro/pneumatics applied it doesn't produce a lot of volume but a 3# about 24" long device will step up 120 psi in to 1200 psi out . It's an olio strut pump for aircraft with static sealed air over oil hydraulic rams for landing gear . I don't know how it would respond to an air/fuel mix injected in to chamber say 100 psi below hot detonation would work but is seems to me that it's just like adding an ignition point to a precharged Air Rifle with MAP gas .

Wrong end of the science pool for me . Mechanics is another thing .

 

[Joshua]

Years ago I had to rebuild a single acting, double piston air over hydraulic pump. Rebuild is really an overstatement it was just a disassembly, lube, o-ring replacement, and reassembly. Very simple design. It was able to develop 60,000 psi. The displacement however was super small per cycle.

If I remember correctly it had a 4” main piston that was coupled to the small diameter piston.

I wonder, could a rifle design be made recoiless if the diesel pump/combustion chamber was under slung below the barrel and drove the piston towards the shooters shoulder?

 

[STIHL]

I built a potato gun many years ago when I was a kid, I never could get it to light 92% Alchohol, but in my infinite ignorance I said 87 octane mixed 50/50 with alcohol should work it should go boom. Well 2-3 squirts into a 4 inch x 24 inch piece of 400 psi pipe with a 2 inch barrel about 24 inches long ignited with a lantern flint lighter threaded into the fuel chamber it would send a potato about 150 yards. I look back on that and thank God I still have all my fingers and arms and my life. 400 PSI pipe, in reality there is no telling what it had in it when that mix went off.
Ian I am glad you have a better understanding of this stuff than I do.

 

[Ian]

One concept I had to save weight was a hand pumped, relatively low-pressure reservoir that would dump its charge against a big air piston when the trigger was pulled. The big air piston would drive a much smaller piston in the pre-combustion chamber to bring atmospheric air to at least 500 PSI, lock in place, and hopefully ignite a tiny cotton ball soaked in Diesel fuel or activate a fuel injector. The pre-combustion chamber would empty into the main chamber behind the pre-seated bullet by displacing a poppet valve. Lock time would be glacial, but it would work.