You have heard .38-55 rumors for a while.....

Eutectic

Eutectic

Active Member
Well my ol' buddy and I finally made a swap! I have dropped a hint a time or two about this trade.....

This gun started life as a Remington Model 788 in .30-30..... I convinced my old friend to send it to JES early last year.... It wasn't too hard as we played with a 94 .38-55 when we were kids. He told JES he would be using .375"-.376" jacketed bullets. I can't get him interested in cast??? JES kept everything snug and the throat short for the magazine length. It has match tolerances in the neck area!

The barrel is cut 5 lands and grooves. It measures .3665" bore and .376" groove. It twists one turn in 15". It is a smooth beautiful job. The Winchester brass he gave me is too tight to use a .379" sized cast. .378" sized chambered squeaky tight and one group of five went 3/4" at 70 yards! Good start!! I have Starline brass coming which is thinner necks and should be perfect ( but minimum) with .379" cast.

Let me play with it a while and I'll start another thread with my results!

PeteIMG_0583.JPGIMG_0585.JPG
 
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Brad

Brad

Benevolent Overlord and site owner
Staff member
Wow!
With the right load that will be a damn fine shooter.

I can't wait to see what you can do with it.
 
4

4060MAY

Active Member
Eutectic
a caution with Rem 788's
do not force the bolt handle
it will come off in your hand, I do not think Rem will fix it, had a hard time in the early 90's getting it done
it is just butt silver soldered to the bolt
ask me how I know,
 
Eutectic

Eutectic

Active Member
fiver said:
you know they make 377 size dies...
Click to expand...
I have them Lamar..... But my goal includes 'soft' hunting bullets..... So naked I want them .379"....

But I'm an impatience ol' cuss...... And my Starline brass won't be here until Tuesday........ So

How about I size .367" ?????? I found my stash of 14# patching paper.... This paper mics .0026" thick and usually adds .010"

These 246gr babies as pictured are .377"! I'll see how they do today!

Pete
38-55-001.jpg
 
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Eutectic

Eutectic

Active Member
I just shot 5 rounds including the one pictured above. I can get to my 85 yard target now (as long as a Mountain Lion doesn't bother me!.) Rancher/neighbor/friend just shot another big one about 180lbs... This 1/2 mile from my 85 yard backstop! I'm getting as bad as ol' Elmer packing a 4" .44 everywhere I go! I stapled a target at 85 with no company though....

The highest shot in the group was the cold start. The next 3 gave me a 4 shot 3/4" group at 85 yards, The last shot is to the right.... My buddies light 2 1/2 lb trigger got me off a hair quick..... But even ignoring excuses the 5 are in 1 3/16" at 85 yards!

This is a warm load...... Bunch of Rel 10x on board. More .375 Winchester than .38-55 actually ... The 246gr bullet is right at 2000 fps. These bullets are soft.... Like one part tin to forty parts lead soft!!! It never ceases to amaze me how you can drive butter soft bullets to 2000 fps and beyond by simple wrapping them with paper! Not to mention with accuracy!

Here's a quiz....... Why are the holes like they are? Very soft alloy paper patched and shot over 2000 fps do this for me.... In .30, .35, now .375, .41, and .45. Gnarly with great accuracy. Could the 1/4" plywood backing be doing it?

PeteIMG_0586.JPG
 
quicksylver

quicksylver

Well-Known Member
If you are referencing the lack of a clean round hole I get those with damp/soft paper and round nosed bullets...Jacketed bullets will make even more ragged holes in damp paper as they suck in the air...If you are referencing the holes being so close together that's your fault buddy..
 
fiver

fiver

Well-Known Member
I agree nose shape, and the soft alloy is trying to expand some on contact with the backer board.
on the bright side you don't get any black rings around the holes.
 
Ian

Ian

Notorious member
Yup, I get that too from butter-soft at warp speed into a hard backer, the bullet kinda splats when it hits.

The paper jacket thing has always amazed me since the first time I tried it. Straight clip-on wheel weight alloy, air cooled, got me to 2700+ with MOA accuracy in a .270 Win with 150-grain bullet. Same with the '06 and 160-190 grain cores. The paper will let you shoot a softer bullet much faster than is prudent for game, I've had to stiffen the alloy a bit at times to minimize the splat factor and just get the nose to puff up a little.
 
Eutectic

Eutectic

Active Member
Shot a couple more groups with the same load. Most shots touch each other at 85 yards... Both groups under 1" though....

I saved one loaded round..... It was a nice day so I filled a plastic garbage container with my toughest wet paper. Glossy wet magazine paper slightly compressed. From experience was a lot of loads in various papers and then into big game I have a pretty good idea what to expect. This medium penetration will penetrate about double into an elk inch wise. This paper is to the bullet like the toughest of meats.... Maybe an old boar Grizzly or a tough ol' Angus bull?

I wanted to learn a couple things..... First, just how soon would this soft bullet setup (after looking at targets.) How deep would it go? For elk I need 10" minimum in these compressed wet magazines... Would the bullet lose weight? Also important.... Would it shoot through itself? Leave a donut of lead and just the base section either IMG_0587.JPG
which won't penetrate deep.

First picture is the entry. Pretty impressive huh? I though I'd find what remained of the bullet in 6" or 8"..... But I was wrong! I found 30 grs of mushroom tear 10" deep. The remainder of the bullet was 12" deep. It has expanded to .88" caliber! It weighs 190grs. I lost 26 grains somewhere (probably early on) But what I found is still 89%. The bullet is past inside out and the front view shows it was thinking of shooting through! This test was at 20 yards.

You will see a gascheck on this bullet. I do this at 40,000 psi or higher with very soft alloy. Why? I've got better accuracy that way. It is crimped on first and then sized along with the bullet prior to patching. A sharp eye will see no engraving on it....And an even sharper eye may see just a hint of the .0005" I'm above the bore dimension. Still may be too violent on our Whitetails....

Pete

38-55-002.jpg
 
V

VZerone

Active Member
Pete I done about the same thing and test with a 170 SWC 357 magnum bullet cast of about 20 to 1 or softer and freechecked. Fired it into even tougher wet paper water soaked for a day. Velocity was (YIKES I know) around 1300 fps!!!! Basically found of the bullet what you found and showed here and the cavity in the paper was awesome!

You have an awesome load there.
 
fiver

fiver

Well-Known Member
look at the ridges that alloy tried it's best to fight the deformation going through the wet pack.
 
Eutectic

Eutectic

Active Member
I found some bullets I cast a while back for my Model 94 .38-55. They are from an NOE mold and weigh 228 grs as cast. Air cooled soft maybe 10bhn. They are a Ranch Dog copy with a wide flat nose...... I took some and shortened the gascheck shank leaving a small rebated section, I sized them down to .367" and paper patched them. Weight was 214 grs. I loaded six and shot them this morning. First shot was toward the top of the diamond; second was low! I mumbled under my breath. The third was with the first.. cutting into it! Fourth and fifth went along with #! and I had a 7/16" group! Number six was a little high right.... So 67% made a fabulous group.... This tells me the load will shoot them all in there if I just learn what bothered those two???

This is the name of the game in load development. These were bare based (no gascheck) But they didn't strike me as that being it.... But I would test it and see. This is a full power hunting load by the way at 2200 fps. I shortened some more and sized them to .367". Gaschecked the same bullet and sized them to .367" as well... 234 grs.

Brass and neck uniformity is screaming at me so will start there to round up the strays. Group is shown..... Look at how that wide meplat cleaned up the holes! Second photo is an as cast bullet (left) then a shortened and sized 214 gr, and a gaschecked 234 gr. also .367" diameter. Glad I took the closeup as the tumble wash to remove viscous size lube is dinging them up!

Pete
IMG_0588.JPG38-55-004.jpg
 
fiver

fiver

Well-Known Member
neck tension would be a good place to start.
I think I would look at that and re-shoot.

my gut feeling is the bottom three are your true group size.
 
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