45 colt wadcutters
- Thread starter PGPKY2014
- Start date
RBHarter
West Central AR
I get a lot of backlash for this .
Not a full WC but a bunch of the Lee 452-252s . The 454424 was better .
Inside 50 yd they should shoot well presuming they will feed . It is my belief after 100s of rounds with identical results that the Rossi 1-32 twist is insufficient for supersonic loads so keep them down around 800 fps in your pistol and you'll be good to go .
Many knowledgeable folks have told me that the bullet behavior that sets up at 78-82 yd and results in a 30° 10:00 line of flight departure isn't caused by the sonic transition and the bullet upsetting and tumbling. I can't find any other explanation for a 1000 fps load not doing it and whacking softballs at 75 yd while completely missing a 24×36 steel ram at 90 yd over shooting it by the 110 yd berm impact 18' right and 8' high . (Yes feet not inches) No it didn't bounce on its way in .
Same results in a 1982-86 20" as in the 2013 16" .
The Ruger BH doesn't do that with the 1-16" twist .
The High Point carbine with the 1-16 also doesn't do it . I didn't chronograph it so the 250s in 45 ACP even in the 16 barrel may not make it to supersonic.
The 1-16" Rhineland barrel doesn't like a 350 at 1900 fps but also doesn't do the rising curve ball thing with the same bullets down loaded to 454 levels in the 45 Raptor.
Not a full WC but a bunch of the Lee 452-252s . The 454424 was better .
Inside 50 yd they should shoot well presuming they will feed . It is my belief after 100s of rounds with identical results that the Rossi 1-32 twist is insufficient for supersonic loads so keep them down around 800 fps in your pistol and you'll be good to go .
Many knowledgeable folks have told me that the bullet behavior that sets up at 78-82 yd and results in a 30° 10:00 line of flight departure isn't caused by the sonic transition and the bullet upsetting and tumbling. I can't find any other explanation for a 1000 fps load not doing it and whacking softballs at 75 yd while completely missing a 24×36 steel ram at 90 yd over shooting it by the 110 yd berm impact 18' right and 8' high . (Yes feet not inches) No it didn't bounce on its way in .
Same results in a 1982-86 20" as in the 2013 16" .
The Ruger BH doesn't do that with the 1-16" twist .
The High Point carbine with the 1-16 also doesn't do it . I didn't chronograph it so the 250s in 45 ACP even in the 16 barrel may not make it to supersonic.
The 1-16" Rhineland barrel doesn't like a 350 at 1900 fps but also doesn't do the rising curve ball thing with the same bullets down loaded to 454 levels in the 45 Raptor.
CWLONGSHOT
Well-Known Member
The Lyman 452389 & 454309 shoot and feed well enough. But the Arsenal 45-250 FWC is most impressive but least accurate.
All feed fine in my Rossi and Marlins.
CW
All feed fine in my Rossi and Marlins.
CW
CWLONGSHOT
Well-Known Member
I was suprised to learn my 45's will feed empty cases. While the 357's cannot. My 92 25/20 and 32/20 also will not but my Browning 92 44 mag will for the most part.
Bret4207
At the casting bench in the sky. RIP Bret.
Now THAT is interesting!
Snakeoil
Well-Known Member
Yeah, that was my thought, too. And not to be argumentative, but "knowledgeable people" is a relative term.
I would think that somewhere, somebody did some experiments with wadcutters to determine what they do as the yardage increases. Your point about twist rate is probably part of the root cause. The nose of the wadcutter is anything but aerodynamic. My guess is at some point where the spin and the velocity hit a sweet spot, the bullet tips and after that, it's all over.
If you think about it, the attitude of the bullet is pointed slightly upward for the entire flight. The WC has a sharp edge at the nose and another at the base. This creates two different pressure areas above and below the bullet as the bullet travels thru the air. I'm not aerodynamicist. Hell, I can hardly spell it. But my thought is at some point the pressures pushing up and down at different points along the bullet length overcome the stability imposed by spin and can alter the attitude of the bullet. Once that occurs its flight path rapidly deteriorates. Here is a sketch to show you what I'm thinking. Black arrows are airflow over the bullet. Not trying to come off as one of those "knowledgeable people". Just some random thoughts on what might be going on.
And it could be that every bullet goes thru this, but the nose shape and twist rate alter the point at where this effect takes place. In talking to guys at the club that have been shooting .38-55 for many years, the lighter bullets work well up to a certain yardage, about 300 and then fall apart accuracy-wise. Could be the same thing going on, only to lesser extent due to more aerodynamic bullet shape.
CZ93X62
Official forum enigma
Very limited experience with 45 Colt and WCs. A co-worker that shot PPC with my sister had a Model 28 turned into a 45 Colt WC gun. Given the wallowed throats found in late 70s-early 80'd S&W 44s and 45s, that was understandable. Custom WC mould (235 grains, IIRC) and he ran those at 775 FPS or so. Accurate as all get-out, and he competed with it for a couple years, did all right. He told me that the trade-off between the line-cutting advantage of the 45 bullet didn't out-weigh the fatigue factor of increased recoil over a 150-round match. He never spoke of anomalies like the Rising Curve Ball Effect mentioned above. I don't contest the notion of that Effect actually occurring or existing, it's just outside my experience (so far). Wind is my principal adversary at longer distances, and it provides sufficient entertainment for yours truly.
CWLONGSHOT
Well-Known Member
I have shot allot of wadcutters in 32 & 38 in Bullseye. 50 yards I can pepper a golf ball and be LUCKY to hit a car door at twice that!!
Michael
Active Member. Uh/What
Why do long range shooters use projectiles with greater length and higher BCs, along with the appropriate twist rate. It not all just about shaving a few MOA off elevation. Think back to evolution of the 223 in high power competitions, early on 55 grainers did not cut it, why? Now 80grs and heavier are the norm at longer range. I don't shoot high power however several factors come into play, with my 45-70, a 457132 at 535grs does well out past 1100yds. Tried that with a Saeco 645 at 485-ish, the wheels come off not much beyond 600. Whether someone wants play around or get serious on any given day, it is good idea to select the appropriate bullet for what is trying to be accomplished.
CWLONGSHOT
Well-Known Member
Its simple ballistics. Longer more streamlined projectiles maintain velocity and energy. They require faster twist and simply have potential for better accuracy.
Snakeoil
Well-Known Member
Don't forget weight. The smaller calibers cannot buck the wind with tiny bullets. So, they have to be heavier. Making them heavier makes them longer. You have two ways to fight the wind, velocity or inertia. The current hot 1000 yd calibers do it with velocity at the expense of barrel life.