7MM TCU rifle

RicinYakima

High Steppes of Eastern Washington
Rereading my favorite ever issue of Handloader, February 2010, I again read the 7 MM TCU in a rifle article. Does anyone have any real life experience with a rifle like this? Even a Contender? Thinking of a whitetail or coyote rifle for less than 200 yards.
 

Jeff H

NW Ohio
Rereading my favorite ever issue of Handloader, February 2010, I again read the 7 MM TCU in a rifle article. Does anyone have any real life experience with a rifle like this? Even a Contender? Thinking of a whitetail or coyote rifle for less than 200 yards.

Not the 7mm TCU, but I have Contender rifles in 223, 30/30 and 357 Mag, with an extra 357 Max barrel. They make marvelously handy little rifles. Each currently has a medium/low powered scope, but I would like to set one up with just sights, just to have something that much more sleek and light.

My goal was to make them as short and light as possible, especially the 357 Mag, which I use the most, but I found that with the shorter/lighter barrels the gun becomes balanced too closely to the center or even butt-heavy. With a 18" "bull" barrel on the 357 Mag and the plastic butt stock and fore end, the balance-point was right at the front edge of the trigger guard.

This makes it a little more difficult to shoot well and annoyingly awkward to carry. After threading it and adding a suppressor, it's a pinch heavier, but FEELS lighter because it handles better. It is also easier to shoot well this way. The 30/30 has a 24" "bull" barrel, which I got in a trade. The barrel was like new and made by MGM. With a "vintage" Redfield 2-7x32, this one weighs 6.5# and handles and shoots wonderfully. The 223 came with a 21" or 22" tapered factory barrel and skinny forearm - a lightweight little gem. both 357 barrels are MGMs, purchased new.

I'm sure the 223 would be fine for coyote at 200 yards or more, but I wouldn't personally use it for whitetail unless in a real pinch, but the 30/30 I would. The 223 is the only gun I still shoot jacketed in, but if I had to do more varminting with the 30/30, I'd not hesitate to load Sierra's 110 grain HP in it. They'll do over 2600 fps in a 30/30 - at 30/30 pressures and they are accurate. I shot a bunch of those as a kid, but I'm afraid to try them in this one, because I'd probably like them too much and start spending money on jacketed bullets.

If I were to add another barrel, I'd have a hard time not getting a 24" 375 Winchester and shoot cast at 38-55 levels with cast and mount a peep on the back with a post front. This would be superfluous to my needs, but it sure would be fun.

I'm really more of a Mauser bolt-action guy, but the Contender platform made more sense for my scaled down personal battery. I'm not much on switching barrels around, so I want an action/stock-set per barrel. That also assures that if one ever breaks, I can be back online quickly with a swap, until I can find, fix or make whatever broke. So far, so good though.

Sure is a shame they quit making these AGAIN! Mine are original "easy-open" Contenders, but I'd be as happy with G2s, and I'd want all the same version.
 

CWLONGSHOT

Well-Known Member
I often thought it would be a fun one. Years ago I worked up & loaded 6x45 in a Contender carbine for a friend. A 85g Partition and 4198 IIRC it accounted for quite a number of critters for its owner in Tenn. last I spoke he still had ammo. That was twenty five plus years ago i have a 25/45. Versions if the same. The 7 is starting some pretty big bullets for that powder cap. I had a 14" decades ago and enjoyed its accuracy immensely. Most of my T/C & S&W Collections was sold off in 2000 when I was laid off. I do miss quite a few of them.

CW
 

Kevin Stenberg

Well-Known Member
I have had 2 7tcu rifles, one in contender and one in axis. both were extremely accurate and easy to make loads for.
I am in the process of re-barreling an axis from 708 to 7tcu.
I am in complete agreement with Jeff H that the cartridge is not heavy enough to take whitetails consistently. PLease don't ask me why I have the opinion.
my interest in a 7tcu revolved around a small cartridge, heavy bullets and good accuracy.
 

Jeff H

NW Ohio
The Contender action is such a tiny little thing. Between that and the action design (break-open), there are limitations imposed on what one can do (should) with it. I personally find those limitations quite acceptable and comfortable, and they suit the way I hunt without the burden of a bunch of extra weight and bulk for the sake of improbable opportunities.

In other words, I focus on the 99% of what one could reasonably expect to encounter, and plan the arm/ammo for that. I see the Contender and cartridges appropriate for it covering 99% of anything I would need, even if I won the lottery. I'm not likely to run into a grizzly where I hunt, unless on escapes from the zoo. I'm not likely to run into a band of tweakers, cooking dope in a shack in the woods (thankfully), and I have always tended to sneak up as close as possible for any shot I take - not because I'm so good at sneaking, but more that I've never put as much faith in my field-shooting at extreme distance on an animal if I didn't have to.

My personal choices in chamberings are for the mundane - cartridges which are fairly common and aren't bragged upon for their amazing range, speed, flatness of trajectory or down-range thump. That's ME. I find that cartridges appropriate to the subject platform are "good enough" for what I do, and sometimes good enough is good enough. Anything anyone wants to put through a Contender that doesn't beat it up is fine with me, and the selection is wide. I don't get the point of trying to get more out of a Contender that rides the line on pressure. Get a bigger gun. Many who do that end up adding large, bulky scopes, massive, blocky laminated stock sets and long, heavy barrels.

I don't know much about the 7mm TCU and have never shot one. I think the most exotic thing I've shot out of a Contender was the 30 Herret and it wasn't mine. I think anyone who has hunted enough, and especially someone who has shot silhouette, would know his own limitations with anything that works in the Contender. I didn't pick the chamberings I did because I know better than others, or that they are better than other chamberings, I just prefer them. Of course, all of mine are very amenable to cast bullet hunting too, at least to a degree which my cast bullet skill and knowledge will support. The 223 excluded, as its sole purpose is to reach out there a bit further for predators who seem to know the limitations for my cast loads.

Two more things and I'll shut up for a while:

1) The trigger on the original Contender are pretty awesome, BUT for the shooting I do, and the quality thereof, I think it's wasted on me. I honestly believe that I personally could shoot as well with the G2 trigger after I've tuned it, as I can with the original. Some people CAN benefit from the original trigger, but probably not as many as who think they can.

2) Not to be a doomsayer, but these things are getting expensive. Three years ago(?), I got a very nice "easy-open" for $325 online. A guy I know who is into Contenders said I paid too much. A week after I got that one, I found a grimy, stainless 223 at a show with $550 on the tag. I watched it for two days and no one ever picked it up. As the guy was packing up, I approached him and offered him $500. "Yeah, beats packing it up again,..." Took it home and cleaned it up and it was like new under the dirt. I put a scope on it and zeroed it using the same load I've used in my last three 223s. The last three shots went into about 5/8" and I left it at that.

In April of 2020, I found what was advertised as a stainless easy-open for $325. I bought it from the guy, but it turned out to be chromed. He offered $25 back to avoid the expanse and hassles on both ends of a return and I accepted. Turns out it was pre-Armor-Alloy, done by JD Jones, at least according to the experts I talked to.

TODAY, they are suddenly up around $400 - for the action. There's a guy on Graybeard's offering a couple non-easy-open frames for $350. I've known him online for several years and have traded with him at a few local shows. Not an "old pal" I know well, but he's been decent with me and we've always haggled a bit. I'd stick my neck out and offer actual advice, in this case, to start shopping and shop diligently online and at shows. I'd also try to score two or three, since parts may become an issue - not that I know of any parts that break on them. Haus of Arms does offer limited, new-made replacement parts for these. Still no word on complete actions of the remake, but I'm staying on the list just in case.

I have several links to good information on these, which I could share if anyone is interested. I just went through them and deleted a bunch of dead links, but there are some left which still work.
 

Rick

Moderator
Staff member
I'll admit I have never fired a 7tcu in a rifle but in a 10" Contender? Probably upwards of 10,000 rounds over the years. Without looking up the rifle data I don't know the velocity advantage for the extra barrel length, but I would think twice about a whitetail shot at 200 yards with any 7tcu.
 

RicinYakima

High Steppes of Eastern Washington
Why am I looking at this? I have nice walking around rifles in 32/20, 357 and 7.62X39. While I bought a new Contender in 1976, and owned several others, the only one I have kept is a 32/20 ten inch on the original 1976 action. My fingers are so short, only the first model square Puma grip lets be reach the trigger with the end of my finger. The carbine stock just doesn't fit me at all.

That said I am looking more for a 250 yard varmint and 100 yard whitetail combo. A big whitetail out here in the desert is 100 pounds dressed and hanging.

7MM TCU in a 21 inch bolt rifle is listed at 2600 f/s with Speer 120 SP and 2300 f/s with the Sierra 140 SP.

Of course, I could just scope my 250/3000 that weights 5 3/4 pounds and call it good.
 

Brad

Benevolent Overlord and site owner
Staff member
Pick your shots and you should be fine At 100+ for deer.

7 TCU in a rifle would also be a great cast bullet shoots.
 

Jeff H

NW Ohio
.....

Of course, I could just scope my 250/3000 that weights 5 3/4 pounds and call it good.

Well, you could, but...

If one has the bug and the means, there's no reason to drag practicality into something we do for pleasure. Even for as much as I harp on about not having things I don't NEED, I still keep dainty, little 222 bolt-action, just because I love bolt-actions. If I were to be entirely practical about it, I would get a 222 Contender barrel, or forego the 222 altogether and shoot cast in the 223.

I know YOU know this, but maybe some budding shooter would read this post and get the idea that everything should be that practical.

Regarding how the carbine fits you - my own original preference for this general platform was for the H&R Handi-Rifle. The plastic and wood youth stocks fit me well and I liked the feel of them and how they "came up" so naturally and smoothly. I also preferred the action release lever and its location and MUCH preferred that I could modify it to EJECT, if it didn't as it arrived on my doorstep. It took me a while to get used to the Contender carbine fit and feel and I wasn't sure I would - or wanted to. This gun was to be my main long-arm for most situations and I really was not thrilled about the idea of the compromise usually involved in "getting used to" something.

That said, once I started using the Contender carbine more, I found it to be well-fitted and comfortable, even natural, particularly when I got a barrel on it which was long enough to enhance handling. I think it was more about getting UNused to the Handi-Rifle. Now, it fits me and feels very comfortable - no compromise there. I even use the stocks at full length and I almost always have to cut stocks down to fit me.

I can't promise that this would be the case for anyone else, especially not knowing what isn't "right" for you, but MAYBE it is of some use to you.

As a pistol, I shot it in 30 Herrett and 41 or 44 Mag. No thank you. It was the most unnatural-feeling handgun I'd ever handled. Everyone is different though. Oh, and I have SFS (short finger syndrome) too. No known cure, only work-arounds. Revolver DA grips drive me nuts trying to find what I need.
 

Rick

Moderator
Staff member
That said I am looking more for a 250 yard varmint and 100 yard whitetail combo. A big whitetail out here in the desert is 100 pounds dressed and hanging.

That would work. Pluses for the 7tcu, one of the easiest cartridges to load for, probably harder to find a load that doesn't work than one that does. Any of the powders around 4895 will work well. When forming cases be sure to use a rounded expander button, not one of the older, original square buttons.
 

RicinYakima

High Steppes of Eastern Washington
Almost all the whitetail hunting here is along the rivers or creeks, jump shooting, or around the fields and irrigation ditches. I'm old enough and patient enough to walk around the sage brush to get within 100 yards of deer, I like to hunt as well as shoot.
 

Jeff H

NW Ohio
One of my other personal criteria - must be "cast-friendly" on a level commensurate with my ability, and I bet that would be a fun one with cast.

You'll have to decide on a barrel length and profile eventually. Unless you already have that figured out.

If it helps, my 18" 357, with an adult stock, is 31.5" long, from the muzzle to the heel of the butt.

MY 30/30, with a 24" barrel is still only 37.5" long - barely over a yard. Still very portable and stowable without breaking it down. The balance point it about half the width of my palm from the front of the trigger guard, making it very handy to carry afield, while poking around ditches, creeks and rivers.

If I were to buy a new barrel in a similar cartridge today, I'd go with a tapered 24", even if the extra length isn't needed of your personal optimum velocity. If I ever do get a 375W, I'd do 24" "bull," because the TC bull diameter isn't that big and the hole down the middle would be significant. It would be lighter than my 30/30, but handling would be ideal - for me.
 

Jeff H

NW Ohio
DANG, MAN! Look what I just found in my inbox! 10% off everytyhing at MGM!


What I actually meant to post was a pic of something which makes the plastic stocks MUCH easier to handle. Wood stock sets are through the roof, but plastic is still around $125, but too smooth for my likes. While it IS a tedious process, it's well worth a little time with the soldering iron.:STIPPLED (Copy).jpg

Sorry. I don't mean to be pushy. I swear that e-mail JUST popped up and I haven't heard from MGM in ages. I've been very happy with the three MGM barrels I have. I know others have their preferences.
 

Wiresguy

Active Member
I had a 7mm TCU Super 14 barrel on my first Contender back in 1982. I shot the RCBS 145gr Silhouette bullet using 5744 powder. Didn't have a chrono, but it worked well for the shooting I did, which was mostly shooting steel chickens at a distance of around 100 yards.

My shooting buddy and I made the chickens in the metal shop at work and we shot during lunch time about twice a week. The CO allowed an extra 45 minutes for lunch if one were participating in sports. We figured that shooting was part of fulfilling our military Practical Factors, and no one seemed to mind ;)

As to the 5744 this was back when it was surplus powder and sold in gallon black milk jugs for $12 or so. Lots of shooting for not much cash outlay.

I can't speak to the use of 7mm TCU on game but it was a fun and accurate cartridge.
 

RicinYakima

High Steppes of Eastern Washington
heh Ric's looking for a 7 Mauser..:p
Got a nice 7X57 I built on a Springfield action that shoots jacketed bullets, 130 grain, very well. But it weights 8 1/2 pounds with scope and has a 26 inch barrel. Got a 275 Rigby built like Jim Corbett's with island sights and big ivory bead on a Springfield action. Weights seven pounds, but not very good for varmint over 75 yard with my 75 year old eyes.

Still looking for a less than six pound rifle I can carry over a couple of miles for "come what may" shooting. Arthritis in the hands and feet are making long walks harder to bear. I need to drive to the end of the road and walk for a couple of hours, slowly. Don't worry about bears, it is the wolf packs. A man was killed 5 miles from Seattle and partial eaten by a cougar because the wolf packs are taking over the state. Poor cougars are starving because the wolves are eating everything loose. 45 Colt SAA will work well for the wolf packs at close range if needed.
 

fiver

Well-Known Member
so synthetic, thin barrel, about 20-22 inches long.
easy to handle cartridge.
sounds like a win featherweight, charles daly [pre-remington] or something like a ruger american in 6.5 or X39.

the americans can be surprisingly light, the one i have in 300 BO would be about right with some 125gr. gold dots.
not quite a 30-30, but still 150yd. capable on a deer, chuck, yote type stuff, with a good stock design to help with recoil.
 

RBHarter

West Central AR
In the power , recoil , and weight class , I might suggest the 6.8SPC . It'll run a .277 130 gr pick a flavor 2300 fps MV and fits in any 223 chassis .
If you do a Savage stagger feed you can use the Nosler 22 brass with the 223 rim and 6.8 case it's kind of a 1/3 scale 284 win in 27 cal . In a interesting twist the reamer spec for the 6.8SPCII , the common use since 2000 , has a larger neck dia than the 7-30 Waters . Of you do it in 6.8 brass and either the custom relieved 223 bolt head or the cheat on the x39 bolt head you can put it in a 7mm barrel and all but S&B it's match fit . It is after all a huge .007 difference. The neck up of the Nosler removes any likelyhood of a tight neck .

The 7×6.8 Carcano only weighs about 6.5# with most of it living in the Boyds grey laminate stock .