How does one lighten the trigger pull on a 1911?
- Thread starter JWFilips
- Start date
Ian
Notorious member
One acquires the correct fixture from Brownells and polishes the sear and hammer engagement surfaces to a mirror while maintaining precisely the correct angles. Also, make sure the trigger stirrup isn't binding anywhere in the frame or with the magazine under load and that there are no burrs anywhere in the raceways. Check the trigger return spring finger and make sure it isn't too stiff, but they rarely are. I wouldn't mess with the hammer spring.
Charles Graff
Moderator Emeritus
Here is what I do:
Using 1600 grit Emory paper, I polish all contact points on the hammer, sear and disconnector. I back up the Emory with needle files. No need for a jig with this fine a grit, because it won't remove enough metal to change any angles. The idea is to remove any burrs and micro-high points so the parts can interact with minimum resistance as possible.
I use a square ceramic stone to polish the grooves in the frame where the trigger runs.
I polish the trigger stirrup sides until it slides in the frame groove with zero resistance.
The factory coil mainspring runs 22-23 pounds. I change to a 19 pound mainspring. This gives plenty of oompf to pop any primer in the known world and will drop the trigger pull. I also polish the inside of the hole in the mainspring housing where the spring rides.
You will still have some trigger creep and overtravel, but the trigger will now be very controllable for anything but serious target shooting.
Addendum: You can get very, very fine Emory paper from places that sell auto body repair and painting supplies.
Using 1600 grit Emory paper, I polish all contact points on the hammer, sear and disconnector. I back up the Emory with needle files. No need for a jig with this fine a grit, because it won't remove enough metal to change any angles. The idea is to remove any burrs and micro-high points so the parts can interact with minimum resistance as possible.
I use a square ceramic stone to polish the grooves in the frame where the trigger runs.
I polish the trigger stirrup sides until it slides in the frame groove with zero resistance.
The factory coil mainspring runs 22-23 pounds. I change to a 19 pound mainspring. This gives plenty of oompf to pop any primer in the known world and will drop the trigger pull. I also polish the inside of the hole in the mainspring housing where the spring rides.
You will still have some trigger creep and overtravel, but the trigger will now be very controllable for anything but serious target shooting.
Addendum: You can get very, very fine Emory paper from places that sell auto body repair and painting supplies.
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CZ93X62
Official forum enigma
The Gold Cup is about 3.5#. My Glock 23's OEM bang-switch is a 5#er, the 23 with the 1.5kg assembly lives with a daughter living in a RTC state. It is HARD to keep a 10/22 or a Glock with all of these daughters conducting gentle depredations into the kit room. Rotten kids--and now the grands are getting in on that act, too.
Petrol & Powder
Well-Known Member
Getting back to the OP's question.
Lots of good information already provided in this thread.
The bottom line is you want the contact angles between the sear and hammer to remain the same, but you want all of the sliding surfaces to have as little friction as possible.
Al brings up a good point when he writes, "I leave mine alone. They work." When you get right down to brass tacks, you really don't need to do anything.
Most of the resistance to the hammer release occurs where the sear is sliding off the hammer hooks while the parts are being forced together by the hammer spring. Therefore, polishing the sear contact surfaces (without altering the angles) yields the most results in reducing trigger pull weight.
Once you get the sear nose and hammer hooks polished so that there is little friction between those surfaces, the next step is to reduce the friction in all of the other parts involved.
Starting at the trigger, the trigger and trigger bow should slide in the frame with no resistance. Once that is taken care of, we move our attention to other parts.
The sear spring acts on the disconnector and sear. Those contact points should also be smooth. The spring itself is usually heavy enough and doesn't need to be altered.
The sides of the sear should be polished, so it doesn't drag on the frame.
The last step is to place a tiny bit of white lithium grease on the nose of the sear. Because the sear and hammer are being forced together by the hammer spring, that sliding force is relatively heavy. A tiny bit of grease will help to keep that friction to a minimum.
Reducing the weight of the hammer spring is a double edge sword. While that can reduce the pull weight a little because it reduces the force needed to slide the sear out of engagement with the hammer, it also increases lock time and can reduce reliability of primer ignition. So, tread carefully when reducing hammer spring weight.
Lots of good information already provided in this thread.
The bottom line is you want the contact angles between the sear and hammer to remain the same, but you want all of the sliding surfaces to have as little friction as possible.
Al brings up a good point when he writes, "I leave mine alone. They work." When you get right down to brass tacks, you really don't need to do anything.
Most of the resistance to the hammer release occurs where the sear is sliding off the hammer hooks while the parts are being forced together by the hammer spring. Therefore, polishing the sear contact surfaces (without altering the angles) yields the most results in reducing trigger pull weight.
Once you get the sear nose and hammer hooks polished so that there is little friction between those surfaces, the next step is to reduce the friction in all of the other parts involved.
Starting at the trigger, the trigger and trigger bow should slide in the frame with no resistance. Once that is taken care of, we move our attention to other parts.
The sear spring acts on the disconnector and sear. Those contact points should also be smooth. The spring itself is usually heavy enough and doesn't need to be altered.
The sides of the sear should be polished, so it doesn't drag on the frame.
The last step is to place a tiny bit of white lithium grease on the nose of the sear. Because the sear and hammer are being forced together by the hammer spring, that sliding force is relatively heavy. A tiny bit of grease will help to keep that friction to a minimum.
Reducing the weight of the hammer spring is a double edge sword. While that can reduce the pull weight a little because it reduces the force needed to slide the sear out of engagement with the hammer, it also increases lock time and can reduce reliability of primer ignition. So, tread carefully when reducing hammer spring weight.
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Charles Graff
Moderator Emeritus
Random thoughts on the 1911 main/hammer spring. A 1964 vintage Colt Gold Cup was my main handgun for about six years, back in the day. I used it for everything from target shooting, to plinking, for hunting and of course for self defense. I put many, many thousands of rounds through that pistol almost all were handloads with nary a misfire. All, I did was put in a new 16 pound recoil spring from time to time.
The pistol came from Colt with a weaker main/hammer spring than the Colt Government Model of 23 pounds. The hammer, sear and disconnector in the Gold Cup would interchange with the GM without noticing a difference. So, I deduced that a 23 pound main/hammer spring was excessive for reliability and 56 years later, I still hold the same opinion.
The pistol came from Colt with a weaker main/hammer spring than the Colt Government Model of 23 pounds. The hammer, sear and disconnector in the Gold Cup would interchange with the GM without noticing a difference. So, I deduced that a 23 pound main/hammer spring was excessive for reliability and 56 years later, I still hold the same opinion.
Just one other thought, what about the quality of the sear and hammer to begin with? I have a S&W 625 that has MIM trigger and hammer. Despite what I've heard and seen on the internet these parts took and held a very respectable trigger job. A 1911 clone in 22 long rifle that came with a SIG 1911 45 Auto has very poor quality parts and took more than a little effort to get anything resembling a decent trigger. Parts matter.
Petrol & Powder
Well-Known Member
Parts do matter and I'll give an example that has nothing to do with a 1911.
I've tuned up many a Ruger Standard and MKII pistols. There are a lot of tricks to improve that action, but the most productive improvement comes from replacing the factory hammer and sear. A Volquartsen hammer and sear will greatly improve the action. While the factory parts are serviceable, no amount of honing and polishing can match the finish that the Volquartsen parts come with. The Volquartsen hammer and sear are made from A2 tool steel and are finished by EDM (electrical discharge machining). Not only are they very hard and durable, but the finish on the contact surfaces is also nearly perfect right out of the bag.
I've tuned up many a Ruger Standard and MKII pistols. There are a lot of tricks to improve that action, but the most productive improvement comes from replacing the factory hammer and sear. A Volquartsen hammer and sear will greatly improve the action. While the factory parts are serviceable, no amount of honing and polishing can match the finish that the Volquartsen parts come with. The Volquartsen hammer and sear are made from A2 tool steel and are finished by EDM (electrical discharge machining). Not only are they very hard and durable, but the finish on the contact surfaces is also nearly perfect right out of the bag.
The 1911-22 (GSG , made?) that came with the SIG 1911 in 45 is mostly a zinc alloy I'm guessing by how fast it clogged a file. The hammer, sear, safety and other major parts are not a whole lot better. A bit of an extreme example. A lot of 1911's today have the cast MIM hammers, sears, as well as other parts. I've not done a trigger on a 1911 that has these MIM parts. I do have a few firearms that contain various MIM parts and so far they haven't been a problem. Is it worth the trouble to do a trigger job on a 1911 that has these MIM parts as hammer and sear components? Or would it be better to swap these for machined parts?
I have a SIG 1911 and a Kimber 1911 both with MIM parts as well as 2 1/2 S&W revolvers (a 329, 625 and the trigger on a 696) with MIM parts. These MIM parts haven't been any more trouble than forged or machined parts. But there seems to be a real prejudice against MIM parts. I was wondering if maybe I was enjoying some good luck and didn't know it. I never did any trigger work on the SIG or the Kimber as they weren't broken and both have really nice triggers from the factory.
Petrol & Powder
Well-Known Member
The advantage of MIM parts is the precision in which they can be made and the relative lack of cost to produce complex parts that require little or no fitting.
In today’s world, manufacturers must find ways to remain competitive and keep costs down. When done correctly, MIM parts allow for large cost savings during manufacturing.
There were some growing pains when MIM parts started appearing in the firearms world. Whenever there is new technology and some failure related to that new technology, it doesn’t take much failure for the reputation to spread like wildfire. Sometimes that bad reputation spreads even when there are NO failures because people hate change.
In the early 1960’s Ruger set up a subsidiary known as Pine Tree Castings and led the industry in the use of investment cast steel. Their cast steel frames, and other parts were extraordinarily strong and yet traditionalist whined and wailed incessantly. MIM and investment casting are different processes but they both attracted their share of unwarranted negative reputations.
When used in the correct applications, MIM parts allow for significant cost savings, particularly in assembly time.
And not for nothing – every time the federal minimum wage goes up or some local “living wage” initiative takes hold, businesses must find ways to reduce costs OR raise the price of their goods & services. There’s no free lunch.
In today’s world, manufacturers must find ways to remain competitive and keep costs down. When done correctly, MIM parts allow for large cost savings during manufacturing.
There were some growing pains when MIM parts started appearing in the firearms world. Whenever there is new technology and some failure related to that new technology, it doesn’t take much failure for the reputation to spread like wildfire. Sometimes that bad reputation spreads even when there are NO failures because people hate change.
In the early 1960’s Ruger set up a subsidiary known as Pine Tree Castings and led the industry in the use of investment cast steel. Their cast steel frames, and other parts were extraordinarily strong and yet traditionalist whined and wailed incessantly. MIM and investment casting are different processes but they both attracted their share of unwarranted negative reputations.
When used in the correct applications, MIM parts allow for significant cost savings, particularly in assembly time.
And not for nothing – every time the federal minimum wage goes up or some local “living wage” initiative takes hold, businesses must find ways to reduce costs OR raise the price of their goods & services. There’s no free lunch.
Charles Graff
Moderator Emeritus
I hesitate somewhat to mention this, but here goes. Every handgun of mine gets a "door jam" trigger job at the outset, unless the trigger has already been worked on. The hammer is cocked and placed on the bench top and considerable pressure is put on it and the trigger pulled against the pressure. This is done three times. Oh yes, unload the gun first!!!!
This will help mate the trigger and sear or hammer notch and will result in a noticeable difference in the trigger pull. No, I have never harmed a handgun by doing this. I didn't invent this, as it is a very old trick.
This will help mate the trigger and sear or hammer notch and will result in a noticeable difference in the trigger pull. No, I have never harmed a handgun by doing this. I didn't invent this, as it is a very old trick.
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RicinYakima
High Steppes of Eastern Washington
I first read about this in a Skeeter Skelton article in the 1960's. I also saw it done by company armorers on 1911A1's just back from higher rebuild facilities with the required 7 pound trigger pulls. As long as the surfaces are bone dry, it does a fair job of smoothing.
Rick H
Well-Known Member
I have done this with S&W revolvers too. We called it "Mating" Press on the back of the hammer as you pull the trigger. We didn't use the bench top nor door jamb, just our fingers, but it does smooth things out. Not sure how much it lightens things.
A smooth consistent trigger that breaks cleanly at 5# is preferable to a gritty 3.5# with creep, to me.
A smooth consistent trigger that breaks cleanly at 5# is preferable to a gritty 3.5# with creep, to me.