Lyman 450 repair

oscarflytyer

oscarflytyer

Well-Known Member
The Lyman 450 I bought/cleaned up/rehab'd a bit has a crack in the press body. Just saw it yesterday when I mounted it. Crack is on the right side, along the lube tube portion of the press - about 1 - 1 1/2" long.

I am assuming 3 possible options. 1) leave it alone; 2) fill the crack with JB Weld/epoxy or the likes - just try to keep it from getting worse; 3) Have it welded - and I DOUBT this will work/assume it won't because the press is cast. But I am not sure.

Open to any ideas or recommendations. Thanx
 
KeithB

KeithB

Resident Half Fast Machinist
1. You might be OK just leaving it alone, but the flexing and resulting fatigue might cause the crack to spread.

2. Using JB weld might seal the crack but it will provide little strength against what is really a tension load. And cleaning all the grease out of the crack will be very difficult so how good a bond will you get?

3. You can weld or braze cast iron. If you can get the area really clean I'd try brazing as it doesn't melt the parent metal. This would minimize any post-brazing machine work necessary. I have welded cast iron and some high carbon content cast steels using an almost pure nickel electrode in a stick welder. It could probably be TIG welded with a nickel filler rod. Welding melts the base metal so the interior of the lude tube would need to be remachined well enough for the piston to seal.
 
Matt

Matt

Active Member
Does it leak under pressure? I had a 450 years ago with a crack at about 11 o’clock on the lube reservoir from the top that ran about 2 inches. With the soft black Lyman lube I was using it didn’t leak bad. Once the plunger was below the crack it didn’t leak at all. I sure made sure I backed the pressure off between sessions! I lived with it until I gave it to a friend. He’s gone now and I don’t know what happened to that 450. He used it for at least 20 years with a heater and “ hard” lube.

I’ve used JB weld on a bunch of stuff including a cast iron coolant expansion tank on a Ford Lehman diesel marine engine. After cleaning the crack thoroughly and warming the tank with a propane torch the JB Weld held for 20+ years and a thousand running hours. Was still plugging the leak when I sold the boat. I don’t know what the pressure was but the coolant was spraying out of the crack before I repaired it. The JB held up to pressure and heat. I’d give it a try. Or maybe it’ll work well enough as is.
 
KeithB

KeithB

Resident Half Fast Machinist
Ian - I like the liner idea. With a vertical mill or a lathe you could bore out the tube and glue in a pretty thin wall liner with the original bore size so you didn't have to mess with the piston or use smaller-than-normal lube sticks.

I wonder what caused the crack in the first place?
 
Ian

Ian

Notorious member
J.B Weld original will do amazing things. I've repaired many a radiator and both iron and aluminum castings with it. The trick to fixing a crack in cast iron is first to cut out the crack like you were going to braze or weld it with nickel or cast iron rods. I like to use a thin abrasive cutting wheel to slit out the crack all the way past the ends to it doesn't continue to propagate, then undercut the edges slightly. Fill the crack with J.B. starting at one end so air flows out as you go, then let it cure in place (if you can position the part horizontally) or hold it in place with tape. J.B. will fail at about 25-2800 PSI at room temperature, which is about ten times the pressure a lube reservoir would experience.

DO NOT use the "Kwik" version, it does not adhere nearly as well as the 24-hour original.
 
oscarflytyer

oscarflytyer

Well-Known Member
Keith - Have boiled it to clean it. But prob still has some grease in the crack. Thanx on the weld options!

Matt - The crack is @~1 o'clock. I don't think it leaks under pressure, as there was no leaking lube around the crack when I got it.

Ian - thanx.

I may just leave it alone and start using it and see if it cracks more. And, can also cut a short lube stick, which isn't THAT big a deal. I will try to get a cpl pics up. Thanx all!
 
Matt

Matt

Active Member
It occurred to me that this is the third or fourth Lyman 450/4500 I’ve seen or heard about that has a crack at either 11 or 1 O’clock at the top of the reservoir …
 
B

BudHyett

Active Member
To stop the migration of the crack, before welding, drill a small hole at the farthest progression of the crack. This is often done with welding, This has worked well with aluminum sheet in the bottom of a canoe. A crease from a bump that developed a crack in the center of the crease and progressed.

I am not sure that this will help with JB Weld. The JB Weld works well in lower pressure scenarios and bonds the separating parts.
 
Ian

Ian

Notorious member
Stress fracture induced from casting/curing. It actually goes way down, at least to the bottom of the "L". I'm wondering why it has a piston from a 45 in there? Maybe there was a transition period, or someone swapped it out before selling it?

I'd slot that out about 3/4 depth with a cut off wheel, blow it out good with brake parts cleaner, and fill it with JB Weld. Maybe clean it up on the inside with a brake cylinder hone if the metal is cracked through and the edges slightly offset. If it IS cracked all the way through at the top, put a piece of masking tape on the inside to keep the epoxy from leaking through.
 
Joshua

Joshua

Taco Aficionado/Salish Sea Pirate/Part-Time Dragon
Here is a cleaning routine that I have seen work many many times. Wipe once with acetone, heat above 400 degrees, cool & wipe again, and repeat one more time, heat and wipe.

You should now be ready to braze, or weld, or glue.

It’s very similar to the heat cycling/cleaning that we do when using a new mold.

As far as JB weld goes I know of a motor that had a casting flaw. Well that flaw eventually sprung a leak. The motor lost so much oil through that hole that it seized and had to be rebuilt. The hole was JB welded and that motor ran another 350k before it was sent to the junk yard because everything else was falling off of that old Datsun.
 
oscarflytyer

oscarflytyer

Well-Known Member
Ian said:
I'm wondering why it has a piston from a 45 in there? Maybe there was a transition period, or someone swapped it out before selling it?

I'd slot that out about 3/4 depth with a cut off wheel, blow it out good with brake parts cleaner, and fill it with JB Weld. Maybe clean it up on the inside with a brake cylinder hone if the metal is cracked through and the edges slightly offset. If it IS cracked all the way through at the top, put a piece of masking tape on the inside to keep the epoxy from leaking through.
Click to expand...

No clue on the 45 piston. And didn't know that's what it was til you posted! I posted something earlier on that 'cause I had never seen it before...

And thanx for the JB Weld/repair advice (now that pic has been provided!). This one is my second, so no big worries... And just got Keith's push thru set as plan B/C!
 
JonB

JonB

Halcyon member
Yeah, I am with Ian on the JB weld fix...slot that with a cut off wheel and clean it best you can...I like the acetone wipe/heat cycle suggestion by Joshua.
I have used JB Weld on various "Redneck" automotive repairs in the past and mostly have failed. In hindsight, my failure was due to not getting the area clean enough.
 
JonB

JonB

Halcyon member
I am 99% sure Lyman used the old style brass sleeve Pressure Nut on the early 450 units.

I've said this 100 times, I actually prefer the brass sleeve Pressure Nut...yeah it'll leak if you don't keep the Temp/Pressure well regulated, but I'd rather have that, then have to replace the o-rings occasionally.
 
Pressman

Pressman

Active Member
I have one that has a 3 inch split along one side. It was brazed at a welding shop with poor results, the heat from the torch warped the cast iron leaving an egged shaped tube. It's now junk.
Brownells Steel Bed could be used to fill a crack then reinforce the tube with radiator hose clamps. It should work, but no guarantees. that any repair will hold considering the quality of the cast iron.

Ken
 
oscarflytyer

oscarflytyer

Well-Known Member
"then reinforce the tube with radiator hose clamps"

First thought that came to my mind, but don't think the clamp could get nay kind of bite. And the weld might make worse. I will try the JB Weld, ala Ian's suggestion - had some very good results with that in the past.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.