Powder for .45/70?

TXTad

TXTad

Active Member
I was going to title this "Best Powder for .45/70?", but then decided that might be more philosophical than I meant.

I've always loaded 405gr cast bullets for my Marlin over RL7. I don't have the data handy, but I loaded to something like 2/3 of the way between start loads and top loads according to a consensus of data extracted from a few manuals. I haven't loaded in a while, but intend to do more shooting with that rifle in the near future, but I only have a little bit of RL7 left.

I was trying to decide if I just want to hold my nose and pay what it costs for 5# of RL7 right now, or if I should look for something else. I always thought RL7 was about the best powder for that type of load, but looking at newer data, I see some surprising things. One that caught my eye was H335 for 400 gr bullets. I have a lot of WC844, which is similar to H335, so maybe I don't need to get anything, or maybe there's a better choice among other powders that might not be quite as expensive as the Reloders are right now.

The only bullets I'm likely to ever load are 400 gr cast, or 300 or 400 gr jacketed.

Thank you for any opinions!
 
TXTad

TXTad

Active Member
I should probably mention that I have plenty of Unique and BE-86, but I'm looking for 90% loads for Marlins.
 
TXTad

TXTad

Active Member
RBHarter said:
3031 is the most commonly recommended powder for nearly every weight and configuration of bullets up to 425 gr in all of my reading.

Unique will get you almost every Trapdoor lev
Click to expand...
Sadly 3031 is just as hard to get as RL7 right now and almost as expensive.
 
TXTad

TXTad

Active Member
This might be easier than I thought...I still have a jug of the old Accurate Data Powder 2200, and their more recent PDF says this:
1706822337108.png
 
RBHarter

RBHarter

West Central AR
There was more edited in but I fat pawed it .......size 14 ring on a phone ......

Probably almost any powder between Unique and 4831 over 50 yrs in production that's not a ball powder or touchy about<70% case volume and/or <35 kpsi will probably work well .

Ken Waters used 4831 like BP in one . 110% of case capacity compressed loads . It only made about 25-28kpsi but was more accurate than 4350 ......
That's a big window.
 
JonB

JonB

Halcyon member
If new powder prices are discouraging you, What powder do you have that you want to use up?
Loading cast bullets in 45-70 is pretty forgiving when it comes to powder choice.
I bought some surplus IMR 7383 for cheap, and kind of regret buying it due to it's quirkiness, but there have been a couple bullet casters that worked up loads for 45-70. If that quirky powder can be used for 45-70, I suspect most any powder could.
Disclaimer: I haven't loaded any of that IMR 7383 yet.
 
TXTad

TXTad

Active Member
I have plenty of 844, 846, 852, 244, some Blue Dot, BE-86, 872, and now more Unique.

But I'm going to start with the DP2200, I think, to see how that does.
 
CWLONGSHOT

CWLONGSHOT

Well-Known Member
I have three.

RX7
4198
5744

Reloader seven and 4198. Both will load from middle to heavy loads. And 5744. I liked for lighter loads to middle loads. Cast or jacket made no difference, all powders work really good.
 
JonB

JonB

Halcyon member
Here is a thread from the other forum that might help, one comment mentioned "Penny's"

Accurate Data Powder 2200 and Penny's

In the late 90's, a guy at my local gun club made a big buy of Accurate Data Powder 2200. I bought an 8 pounder really cheap. There was very limited load data on the label, but no published data was available. I never used any, as I was using Varget and ReLoader 15 for highpower. Now...
castboolits.gunloads.com
 
oscarflytyer

oscarflytyer

Well-Known Member
still working on 45-70 loads. Most has been @ 25 yds. Exception is the 38.5 grn 3031 w/ Lee 405 HBRN. I was shooting that in a previous Marlin 1895. Grouped well/sighted at ~70 yds. Dumped deer very well at 75-100 yds. Upgraded the 1895 with a Cowboy.

Marlin Cowboy/Repro Hi Wall
RL7
4198 (maybe)
3031 - used 38.5 gr (Waters Trapdoor load) with 405 gr Lee HBRN in previous 1895 Marlin with great accuracy and hunting success. Yet to try in the new to me Cowboy; iirc, Hi Wall doesn't care for it
2400
These will get 300 & 350 Grn bullets moving fwd - have to work a load. iirc, RL 7 showed a bit of promise with these bullets (Ranch Dogs)

RB custom
3031 - 38.5 w/ 405 HBRN seemed ok, but need to stretch distance
5744
4198
prob go with 26 grn 5744 moving fwd/same for Trapdoor; w/ 405 grn Lee HBRN bullet

For the Trapdoor
26.0 grn 5744 & Lee 405 gr HBRN - One and done!
no sense in pushing the envelope for it, and shoots well close in/need to test distance; For Fun/historical shooter

FWIW - Argentine RB 43 Spanish
same load of 26.0 grn 5744 as for Trapdoor, with ~400ish grn bullet - shot well close/need to stretch distance. May try 3031 in this one as well

Venturino recommended 26.0/5744 for Trapdoor. Tried sample load of it for Trapdoor and 43 Spanish with ~400 gen bullets with initial good results. Need to push out out further.
 
fiver

fiver

Well-Known Member
probably the only place 4895 doesn't work well,, it'll work it just doesn't generally give good results.
i'd stay somewhere between 3031 and bulls-eye, but if i had 50 lbs of 335 like anything i'd go ahead and try it.

i stay with the 2400 stuff, it's easy, and it runs through the Dillon... but i don't have a trapdoor either.
 
TXTad

TXTad

Active Member
JonB said:
If new powder prices are discouraging you, What powder do you have that you want to use up?
Loading cast bullets in 45-70 is pretty forgiving when it comes to powder choice.
I bought some surplus IMR 7383 for cheap, and kind of regret buying it due to it's quirkiness, but there have been a couple bullet casters that worked up loads for 45-70. If that quirky powder can be used for 45-70, I suspect most any powder could.
Disclaimer: I haven't loaded any of that IMR 7383 yet.
Click to expand...
One of my friends just gave me a figurative shake and told me to quit loading to 1,600 - 1,800 fps and instead use my Unique to load to about 1,100 - 1,200 fps.

Maybe those are wise words.
 
CZ93X62

CZ93X62

Official forum enigma
I used to LOVE running my Ruger #1 in 45-70 to ridiculous velocities. This was my way even into early retirement.

The tip-over point came not so long ago when I loaded 100 cases with sufficient fuel to enable 350 grain Hornadys to go 2100-2150 FPS. There was a time in my life when I found such pastimes entertaining, and those lasted into my mid- to late-50s.

Good sense finally dawned upon me when the sensation of my right shoulder blade colliding with its left-side counterpart hit home. 15-20 of those at the end of a range session was quite enough, and it took almost a year's time to ration that recoil out over several range sessions to unload them through the muzzle. Having been raised in the Roman Catholic faith, I was cognizant of penance--so I knew it when I saw/felt it.

Ahem.

For some time I had been messing about with the 45/70 and WC-860 milsurp powders. Duplexed atop 6.0 grains if IMR-4198, 48.0 grains of this 50 BMG ball powder gives blackpowder ballistics to the Lee 405 grain bullet with about 1/16" of compression. 5-shot groups would cluster into 1.25"-1.5" at 100 yards pretty reliably.

Assembled together, all of the above constitutes what we called a CLUE at my old job site. 1250-1300 FPS even in that featherweight No. 1 still gave all-day recoil.....about like a 12 gauge trap load. Accuracy is sufficient for the critters usually sought using 45/70 rifles. In my present Marlin 1895, they are docile. I still have about 12# of that old $3.50/lb. milsurp stuff, so I'm set for a while. It works scaled down in the 38/55, too.

I have yet to scale this 6/1 powder ratio of WC-860/IMR-4198 to the 44/40, 32/20, or 25/20 calibers yet. I have tried the late Ross Seyfried's black powder-equivalent formula (BP grains x 0.4 of IMR-4198), and it worked pretty well. We shall see.
 
RicinYakima

RicinYakima

High Steppes of Eastern Washington
Just got to throw my two cents in here, for my Handi 45 long Colt carbine rechambered to 45/70, 12 grains of Unique and the 405 bullet is just right. For the 1990's short barreled Guide Gun, 24 grains of 2400 if a good load. The Trapdoor gets 55 grains of GOEX FFF and a greased wad under the 500 grain bullet. All are fun to shoot and will kill any wolf at the door issues.
 
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