shooting skill

[todd]

Handgun shooting is the hardest skill in all of shooting. There is a reason that the winners of handgun matches at Camp Perry are almost always in their 40's and 50's with 20+ years experience.

back when i was 20yo, i owned a Ruger Super RedHawk with a 7.5" stainless steel barrel in 44 Rem mag. i was deadly out to 125 yards. WAS is the correct word!!! lol the Ruger SRH "fit" my hands as if God made it. back then, i did have any mono, bi or tripod as i have now. it was off hand shooting or a long stick. i had a garden (bow) rake wooden handle without the rake was my stick. i shot untold numbers of 200 and 240gr Hornady XTPs and a warm (most likely hot) load of Win296. i could do 1 1/2 - 2" groups at 100 yards (5 shots/bench). i could do (rarely) under 1 1/2" groups if the stars lined up with the planets and the sun didn't get in my eyes and the shooting gods smiled upon me. off hand with a rake handle, i could do 3-4" groups at 100 yards (5 shots). i loved that gun, but later, i was in a divorce and the lawyer needed paid, so i sold it, along with some other guns.

years go by, i bought another Ruger SRH 7.5" barrel in 44 mag and my shots from a bench are..... well, average, 3 - 4" group at 100 yards(5 shots/ bench). i don't have a rake handle, but a monopod. i could do 4 - 5" group at 100 yards(5 shots). i tried different powders and bullets, but a medium charge of Win296 under a 240gr Hornady XTP will do 4 - 5" groups with a monopod.

i had a stroke and the use of right side, well i am disabled. i can't make my right arm do anything. i'm a left eye/right hand dominate....errrr, left hand dominate, lol. i have a hard time doing a sheet of paper group at 50 yards with a bench!!!!! so i sold the SRH and bought another rifle. then 2 years later, i buy a Ruger Super BlackHawk with a 4 5/8" barrel in 44 mag. i decided to use cast boolits only and only at low - medium velocities. i use 280gr WFN with unique in my mag, in my 44 spl it's a 255gr Keith-type boolit with a Skeeter load of unique. when i first tried to shoot it at 50 yards, it was dismal. 1 out of 5 shots hit the paper. i had to re-train myself with the weak hand. i put my target paper at 15 yards and eventually i will do 2 - 3" group from my tripod. 20 yards, then 25 yards, then 30 yards.....all the up to 50 yards. i'm still training at 50 yards to do 2 - 3" group with my tripod. i can do a 4ish" group at 50 yards, but no 2 - 3" groups. i have killed 4 or 5 deer with it, but i only did the low 30ish yards.


back in the day (lol), i used Beretta 40 S&W and 1911 Rem 45 ACP in semi pistols. 8', 15' and yards and 25 yards was good fer me. 3-4" groups were average, but i don't shoot them now. it may just be me, but i have had no problems with semis. i have a big problem with shooting REVOLVERS!!!

 

[Rick]

i have a big problem with shooting REVOLVERS!!!

Very possible to solve that problem with one word . . . Grip.

Sure, grip is important with anything you shoot but many times more important with a revolver. 100% consistency is the key. If you squeeze slightly more or less, hold the grip slightly higher or lower, hold it slightly left or right in the palm of your hand . . . No groups.

Key word in all that is "slightly". Revolvers have a slower lock time, slower barrel time. Do anything that alters the recoil before the bullet exits the muzzle and you have altered the shot placement on target. Takes much practice, at least it sure did for me but work on consistency of the grip.

 

[todd]

Very possible to solve that problem with one word . . . Grip.

Sure, grip is important with anything you shoot but many times more important with a revolver. 100% consistency is the key. If you squeeze slightly more or less, hold the grip slightly higher or lower, hold it slightly left or right in the palm of your hand . . . No groups.

Key word in all that is "slightly". Revolvers have a slower lock time, slower barrel time. Do anything that alters the recoil before the bullet exits the muzzle and you have altered the shot placement on target. Takes much practice, at least it sure did for me but work on consistency of the grip.

that's what they tell me. you would have thunk by now.......lol.

it's either i squeeze it too much or a little bit. i think it's my weak hand that does it. i can't do the right hand because of my stroke. the left hand really needs to practice every day. my right hand didn't need no practice...lol.

 

[Petrol & Powder]

I consider myself to be an average or maybe slightly above average marksman with a handgun. But I have no problem maintaining my humility. I have seen plenty of people that could shoot FAR better than me and few that could shoot better than 99% of the population.

I remain humble because: there’s ALWAYS someone better than you, in any endeavor.

I’ve shot on pistol ranges with guys that could make nice little groups but in a gun fight I would likely have killed them every time. They were slow even when they tried to be fast.

I’ve shot with people that were fast but not consistent. I shot with people that seemed to always be fighting with the gun rather than working with it.

I have shot with people that were incredibly talented. Fast, Accurate, Consistent. They are amazing to watch and serve to keep me humble.

It’s training and practice but there must be some innate skill there as well. On my best day I couldn’t even come close to that level.

Training will separate the unskilled from the skilled but there’s another level beyond that. It’s probably the same reason that not every fighter pilot will be the ace, not every quarterback makes the first string in the NFL and not every trumpet player is first chair.

 

[RicinYakima]

So true. Not all have the same natural material to work with. I always wanted to be a great pistol shot, but my coach after seven years told me to take up golf. I never made it above marksman.

 

[Bret4207]

Very possible to solve that problem with one word . . . Grip.

Sure, grip is important with anything you shoot but many times more important with a revolver. 100% consistency is the key. If you squeeze slightly more or less, hold the grip slightly higher or lower, hold it slightly left or right in the palm of your hand . . . No groups.

Key word in all that is "slightly". Revolvers have a slower lock time, slower barrel time. Do anything that alters the recoil before the bullet exits the muzzle and you have altered the shot placement on target. Takes much practice, at least it sure did for me but work on consistency of the grip.

IMO that's why people spend $ trying different grips on their handguns. For my hand, back in the day, the fugly Houge Mono's on a 681 Smith were the ticket. Especially for hip shooting. They just fit. I have a Colt Officers Model that has the factory grips. Might as well give me a greased piglet as far as the gun sitting in my hand correctly!

Thats a really tough break Todd. I fear stroke, a whole big bunch. Kind thoughts and prayers man!

 

[todd]

well, i don't have to get up and go to werk anymore. lol!!! AND i'm allowed to shoot deer from my truck, to hunt early doe muzzleloader in a rifle, i can ignore the 3 or 4 pt per side of the buck and shoot a spike....it's the little things that comes from being disabled.

i think it was Hogue or Pachmayer with wood grips are very comfortable.

https://th.bing.com/th/id/R.1b5ba4cb15d1f926e627efcf54c85070?rik=9rtwbtSgGIOMRw&pid=ImgRaw&r=0

i should try and find them with a ruger sbh.

 

[quicksylver]

had my stroke two years ago, quite a learning process. I can alomost do everything I youst to but differently. I'm right handed lost the use of my left ( it's just there for looks now), can't rack a slide W/O swaping the gun around, you DEFINETLY DON'T WANT TO PASS ME ANYTHING YOU'Re FOND OF. . going to get one of those gym pads to stand on before I try hand guns again. got a couple of thumb hole stocks for my rifles. relearned to cast and reload ammo with one hand( I'm happy!) I can't, drive but fortunate to have a great searvice, just a bitch to quafy for,( Dial Aride Transit. $1.50each way to and back from the club. I put my rifles in a soft case then into a bag ment for light and mic stands, range gear in a wheeled back pack, I get dropped of at the head of the clubs enterance hike my stuff about 300 yards to the tables.god bless them all, when they see me comming some one will stop their shooting and give me a bench if it's full. they also help meset up. I don't feel sorry for my self as I shoot with a lot of viet- vets who are not much better off than me, YUP, strokes suck and change your life instantly. but there's hope with a good atitude. thanks for letting me ramble. Dan

 

[BudHyett]

At the age of twenty, I was caught in a fire and burned over thirty percent of my body including arms and fully my hands. Hospitalized for a month, my hands were bandaged and I did not use them. Returning home, I squeezed a big green eraser to regain usage of my hands.

My uncle suggested since I wanted to learn to shoot a pistol, getting a target .22 LR and mastering the grip and alignment would be a productive way for rehabilitation. A trip to GIl Hebard's in Knoxville, Illinois and I returned with a slightly used Ruger MKII Bull Barrel and 5,000 rounds of CCI standard velocity ammunition.

My uncle started me on Slow Fire calling each shot for grip training. Then Timed-Fire for trigger control and advancing to Rapid-Fire for sight concentration. This was a journey that has continued through my life.

At the age of 77, I am challenged by cancer. The chemotherapy is devastating to my strength and coordination. Again, I am now working through air pistol, then to .22 LR and on to .45 ACP. My rehabilitation therapist was first dismayed at my suggestion of pistol practice, but now is supportive. If I could only get a doctor's prescription for ammunition.

 

[Bret4207]

Jeeze guys! Kind thoughts and prayers to all of you! I watched my FIL when he was hit with a stroke in his early 50's, lost complete use of the left side and became absolutely miserable for another 30 years. That scared the crap out of me and I'm not at all ashamed to admit it. I do what I can to avoid it and take the aspirin regime for the arthritis anyway. All of you have a better attitude than I fear I might have!

My prayers are with you all.

 

[RicinYakima]

"You got to know when to hold them. and when to fold them."
You deal with what life gives you, Bret. Live every day like it was your last. It may be.

 

[todd]

i had my stroke when i was 39yo. the doctor gave me 10-15% chance of survival if they can get some clots out of my brain. if i don't have the new thrombectomy surgery (new back then), then i die. in the hospital, i was unconscious for 4 or 5 days and then they sent me to a rehab for 4 or so months. i couldn't talk or walk or chew my food. the Occupational and Speech Therapists did an awesome job on me. i remember US Army Basic Training and the Drill Sergeants quite vividly. whenever i did physical exercise that the therapist did, (i could still hear the DS telling how bad i am and what they are going to do to me) i would go one more step and another and another...

it's amazing that i can recall what the Drill Sergeants said, but i couldn't remember what i had for supper.

another thing i tell myself is it doesn't matter what i did, someone else has a real harder chance will do it with a smile on their face.

yes, sometimes i do get disgusted with myself and the stroke, but these are the cards i was dealt, so do the best i can with them. i was just told about a month ago, my dad (RIP) had coronary artery disease. he got it from his dad and mom and the rest of his family. i have it too. i have an appointment with my heart doctor and i have to do an echocardiogram next week. two weeks after that, then it is a heart angioplasty and stent placement. that also happens to be the first week of deer rifle season!!! that will make me angry!!!! lol !!!!

 

[RBHarter]

I've been fortunate I guess .
There was a lady that I worked with that had a , by comparison, minor stroke . She had good motor function and mostly everything but the vision in her left eye back in about 3 months . I saw her a couple of times at work , end of the day thing she worked in a second floor office and was carefully guided down the stairs . While I don't have any experience with loss of motor function I can relate to vision loss and I was raised by a guy that lost an eye .

I asked if she had a minute which of course at that moment she did . "Its none of my business and if I'm intruding say so . I understand that you lost the vision in one eye ? " Yes my left side is still weak and I have no vision in that eye . They say I probably won't get any of it back and if I do it won't be of a useful level ." My Dad lost an eye as a child and had a book in the 70s that explained why he did/does things the way he does them and how to use those tools ." Does he drive ?" Yeah he was into drag racing before I came along . Has a pilot's license too." With one eye he flies , and
drives ? " Sure . He even played a little fast pitch softball , pitcher . " What's the name of that book ?" .
I guess the thing about it was that she knew there were limits but she had come so far . But had a list of things that wouldn't be the same . "You've lost half your vision, you won't be able to judge distance because you don't have any depth perception with only one eye ." Well yes that's true , but there are tools to get around that . I'll bet it took y'all weeks to figure out how to fill a glass in the sink , been there chased that fawcet all over the sink . Swing the barrel though the bird and slap the trigger when lead and speed match up ......only you move your head until the fawcet covers your hand then back up to the stream . The book was full of things like relative motion and tools to tell the difference between a step and a line for example.

Not long after that she quit and went to work for Rite of Passage .....from handicapped at a desk to a youth coach in a minimum security youth detention facility....... I saw her about 2-1/2 yr later . How's the vision ? Zero about 90% light and the other 10% . Looks like you've mastered the tools . Everything but those damned drinking fountains . I don't ever remember my Dad using one . " I want to thank you for the book , but also for telling me that I could do everything I had ever done before. The doctors and PT never did that they only told me what wasn't going to work and what I'd lost . "

You had that DI , and whatever other device to drive you . I really believe that's the key to making the most of any misfortune and recovery is to find a way around or through the limits of the missing parts . I might be wrong or just too stupid to know I can't do that .

 

[CWLONGSHOT]

Nearly a 40 year Bullseye shooter here. 25+ Year Pistol Instructor as well. I still carry a Master lever card and have ranked High Master in Bullseye.

There are FIVE BASICS for accurate shooting.

1) Sight Alignment

2) Breathing

3) Trigger Squeeze

4) Body Position

5) Follow Through

Slack on any of these and groups suffer. But there is a slight order.
Dry fire can help you build muscle memory.
WATCH THAT FRONT SIGHT!
Breath normally do not excessively hold your breath. Try to hold about 1/2 lungs capacity.
Squeeze slow and easy it should surprise.
Re alighn the sites on the target AFTER the shot.
Find a comfortable repeatable body position without excessively squeezing the firearm.

Most of all, Good practice off and ON The range.
Best advice I can offer is to find a good instructor and spend some time with a refresher and some range time.
For years I did almost as many of these, as I did classes. I still have more than a doz students, who want a hour or more on the range, every year or three. To brush up!
I haven't done a Class in about five years now. My teams has a few younger instructors with more time and drive. (Two of them I trained.)

CW

 

[Bret4207]

I used to coach a few of the people on the job that had trouble qualifying. I found everything came down to getting to concentrate on that front sight! Of course that's not BE shooting, but that took people from having to run the range 3-4 times to once!

A strong attitude and spirit are no doubt vital tools in recovery from any issue. I'm amazed at the positive attitude some folks have that have allowed them to live much fuller lives that others with less challenges. Bless you all!

 

[richhodg66]

Nearly a 40 year Bullseye shooter here. 25+ Year Pistol Instructor as well. I still carry a Master lever card and have ranked High Master in Bullseye.

There are FIVE BASICS for accurate shooting.

1) Sight Alignment

2) Breathing

3) Trigger Squeeze

4) Body Position

5) Follow Through

Slack on any of these and groups suffer. But there is a slight order.
Dry fire can help you build muscle memory.
WATCH THAT FRONT SIGHT!
Breath normally do not excessively hold your breath. Try to hold about 1/2 lungs capacity.
Squeeze slow and easy it should surprise.
Re alighn the sites on the target AFTER the shot.
Find a comfortable repeatable body position without excessively squeezing the firearm.

Most of all, Good practice off and ON The range.
Best advice I can offer is to find a good instructor and spend some time with a refresher and some range time.
For years I did almost as many of these, as I did classes. I still have more than a doz students, who want a hour or more on the range, every year or three. To brush up!
I haven't done a Class in about five years now. My teams has a few younger instructors with more time and drive. (Two of them I trained.)

CW

I wish someone could tell all of this to a few of my air rifle shooters, some it just doesn't seem to sink in. Especially the follow though part. I do it out of habit every time I shoot anything, but they just don't seem to get how much their brain actually records what happened if they just pause a second or two.

I have to admit to not being a real good shot with a handgun. Rested or two handed, I'm passable, I suppose, but never got as good as Dad or my brother did who both competed a lot. When I shoot handguns now, I try to always do it one handed, unsupported (target stance). I need to make a regular practice regimen.

My CCW piece is a five shot .38 snub. If I need to use that outside of fist fight distance or a bit more, I guess I'm in trouble.

 

[richhodg66]

Pistol makes a difference. Dad was a big time bullseye competitor in the 70s and 80s. He shot Gold Cups and Match Target Woodsmans. He was always very badly near sighted and eventually detached a retina that ended his competition days, but as his eyes got worse and he messed with other guns, he built up a target gun on one of the AMT Long Slides. He was a fair pistol smith on 1911s and replaced a lot of parts, did trigger work etc. and it turned out he could shoot better with the longer sight radius. NO WAY is an AMT even close to being the equal of a Gold Cup, but if one can shoot it better...

 

[CWLONGSHOT]

Follow Thru is of utmost importance in air rifle as that pellet dwell time (time in barrel) is longer.
I shot air gun matches for a couple years but popularity dwindled so bad we stopped shooting them.

 

[Rick H]

I learned more, improved my shooting more, with dry firing than any other single thing. I had to learn to shoot a double action revolver at the academy and I sucked at it. Dry firing while concentrating on the front sight did more than all the live firing to help me master that skill. The noise and recoil of live fire masks what is going on when the hammer falls. Dry fire, watch what happens to the front sight as the hammer falls. Dry fire some more. I dry fired so much going through the academy that my finger was raw, blistered, and bloody. (Then I got smart and took a file, stone, and emery to remove about 2/3 of the grooves in that Model 66's trigger.) I qualified as expert and maintained that throughout my career.

I remain convinced that dry firing is more important than live fire and to this day probably dry fire 50-100 times for every live round I fire.

 

[todd]

I remain convinced that dry firing is more important than live fire and to this day probably dry fire 50-100 times for every live round I fire.

i with you there!!!