I've been following the "You Do The Leg Work" and "Obsolete Cartridges" threads and now want to let my own doom and gloom shine. To keep the math simple lets say the kids born on or around 1990 were the first to really begin to grow up with computers. There now about 30 and having families of there own. These would be the second computer generation. And somewhere around 2040-2050 the third computer generation will begin. After that what happens when the "CLOUD' or what ever holds the worlds knowledge suddenly fails. The reason for the failure won't matter just the results. How much of the collective worlds knowledge would actually be lost if you don't know where else to look. How will they know to use a slide rule? A micrometer or anything else that would require reverse engineering to understand. If these individuals don't have instant access at there finger tips where do they look? In the original dark ages say between the years 500 and 1000 people weren't all dependent on a singular device and look what happened then.
The Next Dark Age
- Thread starter david s
- Start date
I'd say as long as kids have shop class, or automotive class... something hands on vs strictly virtual... there's a chance.
Additionally, mentors... someone who can show the ropes... pass it along to the next generation is essential. In ham radio, we have Elmer's... we need the Elmer equivalent for reloading and casting.
Additionally, mentors... someone who can show the ropes... pass it along to the next generation is essential. In ham radio, we have Elmer's... we need the Elmer equivalent for reloading and casting.
RicinYakima
High Steppes of Eastern Washington
It will have to be remade by the anthropologists, social and cultural, because they study and keep that information alive. There will always be some technical historians available. What will collapse is industry and transportation, it will be a very hard time for the temperate climate folks, but not so bad for those around the equator. After the population declines 90% in three years, it will start rebuilding. You have to remember that 60% of the food grown in the world is from the Haber nitrogen process, not natural nitrogen.
Ian
Notorious member
You guys need to ask yourselves how the knowledge to quarry, move miles over rough terrain with no road, and lay 1,300 TON stones to make the foundarions under the Temple of Baalbek was lost. Or how in just a few thousand years the knowledge of cutting and moving stone for the original foundations of the megastructures in the mountains of Peru, Bolivia, and elsewhere were made with Andesite boulders fitted together with gaps measured in microns was lost, or how nobody can explain how the 100-ton granite boxes were moved 500 miles from the Aswan quarry to the cramped underground tunnels of the Serapihm (sp?) and finished in place to perfect squareness and flatness in the dark and in a place no more than a few men could fit at a time was done without mentioning technology brought and taken away by aliens from another planet. Most of these feats are impossible today with the best modern equipment.
Technology and culture of entire civilizations have been lost to time, often in a very short time. I read a book by Brien Foerster where he outlines exactly how the technology and advanced knowledge of all the nations of the world could be lost in very short order; literally booted back to the stone age almost overnight (one generation, actually). Not a self-induced thing, but it could and probably did happen at least once already.....that's why historians and archeologists have jobs.
Technology and culture of entire civilizations have been lost to time, often in a very short time. I read a book by Brien Foerster where he outlines exactly how the technology and advanced knowledge of all the nations of the world could be lost in very short order; literally booted back to the stone age almost overnight (one generation, actually). Not a self-induced thing, but it could and probably did happen at least once already.....that's why historians and archeologists have jobs.
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Temple of Baalbek -- actually a Roman built structure. When you have a large community of workers with an 'assignment', things get done. The sphynx is a mystery though, as to why. But yes, the more we depend on technology the higher the risk of problems. Actually the kids in the 70s had the vid games that got them hooked. Dark ages were caused by a few natural events but really by Gov that destroyed the base of knowledge. Burning the Alexandria library, burning/destroying books by 'religious' entities. Attempts to control the peons and keep them poor.
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California's Central Coast Amid The Insanity
Though I'm not knowledgeable of the ancient building Ian mentioned, I've often wondered what knowledge was lost when the library at Alexandria, Egypt, burned. Plans of the pyramids and their methods of construction? It's very possible all that is electronically stored will be lost, but it'd take a world-wide Fahrenheit 451 society for all the printed knowledge to be lost.
I enjoy reading. A positive aspect of the Internet that I've come to rely on, is the ability to read books that were written in some era of interest and have been electronically reproduced.
Popper is a quicker composer than I. The mention of the Alexandria library.
I enjoy reading. A positive aspect of the Internet that I've come to rely on, is the ability to read books that were written in some era of interest and have been electronically reproduced.
Popper is a quicker composer than I. The mention of the Alexandria library.
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Ian
Notorious member
Nope. The Romans built on top of what was already there, just like they did many other places and just like the Inca and later Spanish did in South America. I don't care how many people you have at your disposal, there's no moving a 1300 ton chunk of bedrock limestone the size of a dozen Conex containers stacked together....with muscle and rope. It was done, and done fairly easily I'll wager, with some kind of technology which was so fantastic that it would seem impossible how it could be lost; but it was.
Libraries tend to be public in the States and require public funding. When no one cares or uses them because everything's online the libraries will disappear, they don't need to be burned just ignored. I work in precast concrete, buildings, stadiums, bridges that sort of thing. Can anyone give me an exact recipe for Roman concrete? You'll make your fortune if you can. By the way it's called Roman concrete because that's who invented it. When exactly the knowledge was lost isn't known. If there is only a single resource to store the worlds knowledge and everyone depends on that source what happens when the source disappears? Written text isn't going to disappear tomorrow or in the next hundred years, but they will become less common and less relied upon and lesser known. On old adage, "don't put all your eggs in one basket". I tend to feel were headed to a single basket. Next time the computer cash register stops at any store you're in pay attention to how everything comes to a standstill. Thats a single device that's easy to work around, as long as you can do simple adding and subtraction. It will bring everything to a stop however.
I can remember Pong, it took about ten minutes to master, then Space Invaders and Pac Man, in both cases it took a bit more to learn the patterns but once mastered the games became a bore. Haven't played any since. The reasons for the Dark Ages don't really matter, what matters is the lose of knowledge. It wont matter why there is a huge lose of what's stored on computers an electro magnetic pulse/sun spot Y2K (remember that one, didn't happen of course) or maybe some one spills an energy drink on the cloud and makes it rain, what will ultimately matter is the loss. I'll give another reason for the dark age. People weren't travelling as much or as widely. The exchange of knowledge wasn't as wide spread. When most people don't venture more than 15-20 miles from there home the world actually does become a small place.
RicinYakima
High Steppes of Eastern Washington
Ian
Notorious member
It will bring everything to a stop if for no other reason than the credit card interface no worky. Some $10/hr lackey on a backhoe dug up the single, 4" fiber optic bundle that connected about a dozen counties to the rest of the world. No phone, no internet, no nothing to hundreds of thousands of people for three days. Even the traffic lights and fuel pumps didn't work. limited cell phone service, but some which had the microwave repeater networks able to reach the ground beyond the physical cable breach. Nobody in the area could do ANYTHING except my company, which did most everything on triplicate paper and took cash, checks, or simply added charges to our customers to whom we extended monthly charge accounts. We got parts from the big city with a cell phone and word of mouth/notes with people we do business with traveling back and forth. That little event was a HUGE wakeup even for us Luddite/technology paranoid types.
The next event I'll predict that 20 years afterward will be called "The Greatest Depression" is what I think will be the next Dark Age and hand-to-mouth will supplant all luxury....including technology. Technology which doesn't directly enable the acquisition of the most basic needs will be discarded because it will be no more useful than it is in isolated, third-world countries now. I haven't read much "doomer fiction" and never watched any Living Dead episodes but no need if one studies even a little bit of world history.
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California's Central Coast Amid The Insanity
Duckduckgo, here.
fiver
Well-Known Member
the internets out curse followed me around town today.
i took Littlegirl down to the body shop to get an estimate for a new windshield for her car.
i'm pretty sure with my discount and her insurance she is getting it free, took 2 phone calls.
went to the post office and they couldn't mail a package or take a payment on my debit card because the internet was glitching off and on.
i finally threw cash on the counter and told the lady to mail it when it worked, and she could put the change in my PO box.
besides all the above talk is pointless.
Nostradamus says the world will descend into near nothingness in 2061.
i took Littlegirl down to the body shop to get an estimate for a new windshield for her car.
i'm pretty sure with my discount and her insurance she is getting it free, took 2 phone calls.
went to the post office and they couldn't mail a package or take a payment on my debit card because the internet was glitching off and on.
i finally threw cash on the counter and told the lady to mail it when it worked, and she could put the change in my PO box.
besides all the above talk is pointless.
Nostradamus says the world will descend into near nothingness in 2061.
Ian
Notorious member
My memory sucks. I could have SWORE he predicted teotwawki in 2000, and again in 2012. If we lived through that twice in a generation, we got it made.
fiver
Well-Known Member
2012 was the aztecs.
it was a bunch of hooey because their calendars run in cycles.
they sorta quit making calendars and 2012 just happened to be when the last one run out of pictures.
2-K was the oops we didn't use enough zero's and shortcut the date code for stuff.
i always figured the computer could care less if it was 2000 or 1900 it would just start counting over at 1 in another 365 days.
it was a bunch of hooey because their calendars run in cycles.
they sorta quit making calendars and 2012 just happened to be when the last one run out of pictures.
2-K was the oops we didn't use enough zero's and shortcut the date code for stuff.
i always figured the computer could care less if it was 2000 or 1900 it would just start counting over at 1 in another 365 days.