Why hunting gets such a bad rap, or, "Thing that just get me PO'd beyond belief!"

[Bret4207]

Was in our local Tractor Supply Sat afternoon picking up more feed for animals I don't own, (long story), and over hear a conversation between some dude in camo and the stockboy. Mr Camo from head to toe is standing in front of the pallet of feed plainly marked "Deer Feed". Feeding deer is illegal in NYS, and baiting deer most assuredly is and has been forever. Then Mr Camo ask's the boy, "Okay, I'll take 10 bags! Now, what have you got for salt?" This is not a hunter. This is an outlaw, a criminal, a low life scum sucking piece of trash. I know, I'm sugar coating it, but that's the fact. His next stop was likely at the rack where they keep the million candle power spotlights! It was all I could do not to wait for him to leave so I could get his plate number. But hey, I'm not a LEO anymore and I suppose it's none of my business. But these are the "hunters" that people see way more than the real hunters that would never think of anything like this. Steams my beans!

Rant off.

 

[CWLONGSHOT]

Yup I know your feelings and agree.

When I was a steward of some 800acres I made a couple feeders and fed the animals year round. But mostly started late summer and tapered off as the temps warmed after first groth. But it was not NY state either. Baiting Illegal here as well


No one could hunt this property. But many folks walked the woods trails we kept clear. I had a few cameras on each of the feeders. We really enjoyed watching the horns grow!

I did not always use corn But sometimes it was all we could get plus we took donations and Corn is easiest to get.

Good luck with the coming season!

cw

 

[fiver]

I dunno.
maybe he is just doing what all the hunting shows on TV show that they do, it seems to work for them every week just fine.

 

[Bret4207]

I dunno.
maybe he is just doing what all the hunting shows on TV show that they do, it seems to work for them every week just fine.

Yeah, the same killing shows where the great white hunter is taking a "wild" something or other inside a 10 acre fenced enclosure. The pride they feel must be immense...

 

[RBHarter]

Maine specifically names the 25 ACP as a minimum cartridge for deer.
Georgia says some big game may be taken with a hafted spear .
Nevada allows a 58" 25# 32" full draw recurve for big game , personal test of tech limits . It says must cast a 400 gr arrow over 100 yd in the hands of the user .

I've seen a lot of apple scented salt blocks way the ..... and gone off out in the sticks over the years in Nevada . Range cattle are a thing and they have to be off by rifle opening of deer so leftovers are there and usually not far from spring heads .

I was raised fair chase also . I'm not even going to go down the "other than normal agricultural activity" hole , suffice it to say that I've seen everything but actual food attractants including a few slews full of "wild" rice , celery , and random unlikely beans .

Feeders , food plots , scents , 500 yd rifles , satellite mapping , real time satellite maps , GPS , tree stands , box stands , glass coatings , Shepard Scopes ........it's all a long , long way from a braded , twisted fiber strings on scrapped long bows and volcanic glass points hafted to fire/pitch hardened shafts with rawhide . There's no reason to bait anything but it makes rodent control and fishing a lot easier .

I guess the point is there are extremes on both sides of everyone's field ethos and a lot of that comes from how and where we learned the hunt .

 

[Brad]

Everyone hunts for different reasons.
While I enjoy a nice trophy as the next I hunt more for the experience and to spend time with family/friends in the field.

Best trophy ever is the memories

 

[Ian]

I hunt for the table, fair chase or ambush from natural concealment. Blind "hunting" over bait isn't hunting, it's something else which has its place I suppose but I wasn't raised that way.

 

[35 shooter]

I’ve always loved getting out early before the deer season and start my scouting routine. Find the trails, bedding grounds, and early rubs, and what they’re feeding on.
Later in the season, the feeding spots, and what they’re eating changes, plus the scrapes appear.
I may sit on the ground or in a tree in some instances, or spot and stalk, use calls or rattling horns, or just slip slowly through their feeding and bedding areas.
In other words, I like the feeling that when success finally happens that I earned that shot.
I’ve just never liked the idea of artificially baiting them with corn or salt blocks, etc.
I suppose using mouth calls and rattling horns is baiting in a sense, but it’s appealing to their natural instincts in those instances and can give some fast and exciting action sometimes.
I’ll sit over a natural food source such as an acorn flat, or hollow, but only a natural food source in the woods.... but that’s just me.
Baiting is illegal here, but some folks do it anyway... makes all hunters look bad when they get caught.
Besides that, just seems like a boring way to hunt to me....but again, that’s just me.

 

[Bret4207]

35, the difference is ethical hunting vs illegal killing. I have much more respect for a guy jacking a deer out of season to feed his family than I do for a guy shooting a rack over a bait pile for bragging rights. The guy coming into a store and laying $150.00 for "deer food" isn't hurting for $$$ and trying to feed his family. Ethics, character, rule of law, you know...outdated ideas from a time long ago and far away.

 

[Joshua]

35, the difference is ethical hunting vs illegal killing. I have much more respect for a guy jacking a deer out of season to feed his family than I do for a guy shooting a rack over a bait pile for bragging rights. The guy coming into a store and laying $150.00 for "deer food" isn't hurting for $$$ and trying to feed his family. Ethics, character, rule of law, you know...outdated ideas from a time long ago and far away.

The title of this thread was about giving hunting a bad name. Poaching out of season is inexcusable. It will end up in the newspaper. Crimes like this will sway public opinion, which in the long term endangers our access to public and private lands.

Also, I don’t buy the needing food argument. There is a Food Bank in every town in my area. Poaching for food isn’t necessary today.

Illegal baiting is wrong. In my state the laws have changed. Ten gallons of bait is legal. I met a trophy bow hunter recently who started with ten trail cams, that he was baiting with windfall apples. He was hiking 9 miles a day, three days a week. He quickly reduced his cam coverage to three sites once he found the antlers he was looking for. He harvested that buck.

Did this archer follow the law. Yes. Did he work hard. Yes, I think he did. Did he leave a gut pile/boned out carcass in front of the DNR gate, for the soccer mom’s to see. No, he didn’t. (Pet peeve of mine.)

There are ethical ways to bait. There are no ethical ways to poach.

Josh

 

[popper]

Not really a hunter, not from a hunting (anti-gun) family. IMHO the bad rap comes from soccer mom's (and Gov) that don't want Bambi shot. Some hunting rules to protect the public from idiots with a gun, some to prevent wanton killing for killing sake. I don't have a problem with baited hunting, do you really need to fill all your tags? Poaching is BAD for several reasons. Some of the restrictions on what is legal are kinda silly, many aren't. Hunting is primarily a 'sport' now, we don't outlaw baseball or football.
I got a hunting licence in Ar yrs ago, had a bear tag too. Warned to call every day to make sure the 'quota' was still open. If I were to shoot a bear it would be in protection. Pretty much the same with deer, processing $ are more than burger at the super. Now hogs are fair for anybody, leave the guts for yotes, buzzards & hogs.

 

[Winelover]

Baiting here is legal. Some restrictions in CWD areas. Over the years, I have found baiting, unproductive. IME. My buddy in Michigan, put out carrots, sugar beets and apples. The only thing that came to the bait piles were small young deer...........just before nightfall. Trophy deer don't. That's why they live long enough to become trophies. This area was also plagued with poaching.

The very first deer I took off my Arkansas property was a eight point, during archery season. We moved in September and barely had time to scout and put up a tree stand. When I field dressed it, it was filled with corn. There isn't a corn field for miles. Locals bait to bring deer in. That's why I put in a food plot............need to compete with the area corn feeders. I also give them something different (turnips) to keep them interested in my acreage. I have yet to shoot one that came in to dine. Just off the eastern end of the plot, is the meeting tree. Scrape there every year. I have a tent blind set up to watch that spot. Tree stands are on trails that approach the food plot. Hardly get up in them anymore. Cindy won't let me hunt out of them when she's not around..........that's about four days a week. She has her own activities, kayaking and hiking.

Just posted a video, today, on what you doing today. That 8 point didn't come in to eat. Went right to the meeting tree, checked for fresh scent and then went on his way. This was the sixth buck that visited that tree, while I was out in the field, this season. You might have seen the videos. I took a ten point on October seventh. The rest got a free pass, except for getting their pictures taken. I still go out daily, for a couple of hours, but leave the bow and take a camera. Modern Gun starts next Saturday. I'll take a carbine, just incase I see a coyote.

This is my idea of paradise. YMMV.

 

[popper]

The area I was at was west side of Bear creek, top of the hill was plenty of corn fields. Lots of track up the hill from the creek. GK would have gotten a shot if he'd adjusted his scope right. Heard shots all night long.

 

[Bret4207]

The title of this thread was about giving hunting a bad name. Poaching out of season is inexcusable. It will end up in the newspaper. Crimes like this will sway public opinion, which in the long term endangers our access to public and private lands.

Also, I don’t buy the needing food argument. There is a Food Bank in every town in my area. Poaching for food isn’t necessary today.

Illegal baiting is wrong. In my state the laws have changed. Ten gallons of bait is legal. I met a trophy bow hunter recently who started with ten trail cams, that he was baiting with windfall apples. He was hiking 9 miles a day, three days a week. He quickly reduced his cam coverage to three sites once he found the antlers he was looking for. He harvested that buck.

Did this archer follow the law. Yes. Did he work hard. Yes, I think he did. Did he leave a gut pile/boned out carcass in front of the DNR gate, for the soccer mom’s to see. No, he didn’t. (Pet peeve of mine.)

There are ethical ways to bait. There are no ethical ways to poach.

Josh

There aren't "food banks" available in every place across America. I've known a few poachers that were what I'd definitely put in the category of good, honest people in a place they didn't want to be that had a choice to make- car or rent payment vs meat on the table. No, they aren't the anything near the majority and it wasn't a regular thing. Back when police officers used to actually be expected to know their patrol area and the people in it, I helped a few of those types with car killed deer on occassion. I'd rather see a good man stay out of trouble that be forced into a bad situation. And this was some years back in a place where being on welfare or assistance was not just frowned on, but openly ridiculed. Times ahve changed.

 

[Joshua]

There aren't "food banks" available in every place across America. I've known a few poachers that were what I'd definitely put in the category of good, honest people in a place they didn't want to be that had a choice to make- car or rent payment vs meat on the table. No, they aren't the anything near the majority and it wasn't a regular thing. Back when police officers used to actually be expected to know their patrol area and the people in it, I helped a few of those types with car killed deer on occassion. I'd rather see a good man stay out of trouble that be forced into a bad situation. And this was some years back in a place where being on welfare or assistance was not just frowned on, but openly ridiculed. Times ahve changed.

Many believe that my state is only populated by Subaru driving Patagonia clad hipsters. This is in fact not true. We have serious rural poverty all across the state of Washington.

I know men that ate horse meat growing up because their dad could get old nags for free.

I also knew a man (he has passed) that was forced to poach by his father in the the late fifties and early sixties. Because back then a boy caught poaching was often let go, or at least the consequences where less.

What is sad about this story is that man’s father worked for the same mill that we worked for many years later. His dad made him poach not because he couldn’t afford food, it was because food money cut into his drinking money. His father was a raging alcoholic, his wife would complain about there not being enough food in the house. He’d hit her, and then tell his boy not to come home unless he had meat.

Poaching is still a problem here. These days I don’t hear about very many what I would call “subsistence” poaching cases. It is almost always a selfish crime. It is a greedy crime, or a crime of resistance to the system.

Breaking the law is breaking the law.

I don’t like to pay taxes. But I do because today I don’t break laws. I haven’t always lived this way. I understand the frustration we all have living under an overly burdensome bureaucracy. But today I accept the world as it is. I can’t change the law. I obey them.

I knew another man in California who was caught poaching abalone. He was illegally using scuba tanks, and had 150 plus abalone when he was arrested. Was he unemployed, yes. Was that a valid excuse for his actions, no.

It is a sad culture indeed where a man‘s pride forces him to break a law instead of asking for help.

Josh

 

[Petrol & Powder]

I know people that have hunted for food because they had to and their actions were not always to the letter of the law. Those types of poachers are by far the minority of poachers. They never killed something for bragging rights and they would kill a deer to feed their family but they would never steal.
They knew what they were doing was illegal but they accepted the risk. Their crimes consisted of not buying a license, taking doe out of season and not checking the deer in. They didn't hunt from the road in vehicles, they didn't shoot their neighbor's cows or houses at night and they didn't kill more than they needed.

Now the vast majority of poachers are just criminals. And like most criminals, they are hated by those that obey the law.

It is important to maintain some perspective on game law violations. Most violations of game laws involve VERY minor consequences. In my state the vast majority of game laws only carry a fine and not a very big fine. Even when judges have jail time at their disposal, jail time is never given.

Most law abiding people will obey the law even if the consequences of violating the law are minor. Good hunters, like good citizens in general, tend to obey the law.