AR-10 and Cast
- Thread starter Winelover
- Start date
Ian
Notorious member
Freebullet does make a good point about single-loading just to see what effect that has (go ahead and poke them home by hand and use the forward-assist to click the extractor over the rim). He's right, you're close at 2 MOA with loads that will cycle, time to eliminate some variables.
An M1A is also a nose-smashing, bullet-bending, brass-munching shredder of a machine that adds to the challenge of getting accuracy from cast bullets.
An M1A is also a nose-smashing, bullet-bending, brass-munching shredder of a machine that adds to the challenge of getting accuracy from cast bullets.
F
freebullet
Guest
There may be no cure or, maybe there is. Point being until you know if it's having an effect you might not move forward. It's just a method to help learn what's happening. If you want to improve the results from here learning every detail you can will help pick up clues about what variables to tinker with next.
I don't want my lr308's if they won't cycle either but, if doing a boring test might help me learn what's happening I do it.
Ian
Notorious member
You have an older one, then. They've been putting them on there for quite a few years now, hence my assumption. My old Colt AR-15 doesn't have one either, nor a shell deflector, which is very unfortunate for this southpaw.
I bet it feels good to get back home, take it easy and keep us updated on your progress.
F
freebullet
Guest
insert the round by hand. Then use the charging handle to close the bolt half way. Then release the handle it should close fine. Getting the bullet past the razor clawed barrel extention undamaged should learn us what's happening.
Ian
Notorious member
The AR-10 has a similar free-float pin, it just weighs less than an M1A's. You still don't want to slingshot the bolt home against a chambered round, ever, much less with soft-cup primers. Letting the bolt go from just far enough back to pop the extractor over the rim and rotate the bolt into battery is fine, like FB said, about halfway ought to do it. The AR-15 also can, will, and frequently does AD with Federal primers and someone who lets the bolt fly home unrestricted on a live round already in the chamber.
F
freebullet
Guest
I'm no expert on the subject but, iirc the ar fp does float but can't move forward in the firing position until the bolt is closed. I'll check next time I have the bolt out. Some rotating bolt autoloaders utilize that feature.
When I use the lr308 for hunting I sometimes close the bolt by hand with the charging handle then use the forward assist to close it quietly. Depends on how close I park to the spot.
I've slammed the bolt home on mine more than I'd admit with no issues.
When I use the lr308 for hunting I sometimes close the bolt by hand with the charging handle then use the forward assist to close it quietly. Depends on how close I park to the spot.
I've slammed the bolt home on mine more than I'd admit with no issues.
Ian
Notorious member
Some of Armalites had firing pin return springs, maybe all, not sure. I guess that means they aren't "free float" like I indicated above, what I was thinking is having no physical lock-out. The M1A has a true, floating firing pin but if the receiver is made correctly, there's a ramped catch that hooks the back of the firing pin and holds it off the primer until the locking lugs somewhat begin to rotate into battery. This serves the dual purpose of sorta kinda preventing slam fires and also cams the pin back as the bolt unlocks so the tip doesn't get broken off during the extraction/ejection event or hang the rim of a fresh case as the bolt strips one off the top of the magazine.
Winelover
North Central Arkansas
Well I guess I've been doing it wrong for thousands of rounds. But I do it the way the factory manual suggests. If the bolt is walked forward, round won't fully chamber and since there is no forward assist......I have to result to "pogo sticking" the action to open it. Again, I use CCI 200's and 250's never ever had a round go off chambering when letting the bolt close briskly. I have some Winchester LR magnums, on the way......we shall see. I have used CCI #34 military before and gave the last of couple hundred away to Rick for his M1A. Currently the #34 are @ $7 more per thousand. I will not spend the extra $$...if not necessary.
Last edited:
Does anyone make a single round follower for the AR10?
Common in high power competition. It goes on top of regular follower in magazine. Place round on top or insert into chamber a bit and release the bolt. It slows the bolt a little and let's you single load safely.
Common in high power competition. It goes on top of regular follower in magazine. Place round on top or insert into chamber a bit and release the bolt. It slows the bolt a little and let's you single load safely.
When I loaded some dummy rounds for the M1A to check if they cycle by manually operating the bolt handle they didn't cycle well. BruceB told me that wouldn't work, the same bullets that wouldn't cycle manually would cycle fine when firing. He was right. Seems strange but manually operating the bolt is a harsher cycling than when firing.
Ian
Notorious member
John, all we're saying is this:
1. Try manually placing a few rounds in the chamber to see if groups improve, to see if nose damage, front band shaving, etc. is affecting your groups.
2. We were discussing the necessary cautions regarding slamming a bolt home on a live round that you have already poked fully into the chamber, not how to chamber a round from the magazine. CCI primers of any flavor should be just fine. Letting a fully-retracted bolt slam freely home against a round already in the chamber, instead of stripping and chambering from the magazine, is not a great idea. Better if you let the bolt about halfway down and then drop it against the chambered round IF you decide to do some trials with pre-chambered rounds.
3. In addition, if I understand you correctly about having to pile-drive the gun to remove a live round from the chamber, I would suggest re-investigating your bullet fit. That is a function issue. If you're fine with it, fine, but I insist that all my ammo function as designed for the rifle, which means fall in, fall out of the chamber through gravity alone.
1. Try manually placing a few rounds in the chamber to see if groups improve, to see if nose damage, front band shaving, etc. is affecting your groups.
2. We were discussing the necessary cautions regarding slamming a bolt home on a live round that you have already poked fully into the chamber, not how to chamber a round from the magazine. CCI primers of any flavor should be just fine. Letting a fully-retracted bolt slam freely home against a round already in the chamber, instead of stripping and chambering from the magazine, is not a great idea. Better if you let the bolt about halfway down and then drop it against the chambered round IF you decide to do some trials with pre-chambered rounds.
3. In addition, if I understand you correctly about having to pile-drive the gun to remove a live round from the chamber, I would suggest re-investigating your bullet fit. That is a function issue. If you're fine with it, fine, but I insist that all my ammo function as designed for the rifle, which means fall in, fall out of the chamber through gravity alone.
Winelover
North Central Arkansas
F
freebullet
Guest
That's weird. Why do you think it's that way? Neck thickness?