My white whale...

[Bret4207]

I've mentioned this one before. The "30 Plinker" GB mould. Ran onto a bag of TL'd examples today. They drop at .311 and they drop from the mould easily. You can make "mounds and mounds" of them, if you recall the old "Ronco Kitchen Magician" commercial. Only problem is they don't seem to shoot for beans! Tried them in the 30-30, 30-06 and 308, all with standard Red Dot or 2400 charges. Anyone else ever mess with this one? Sorry for the odd lighting and sideways pic. They don't actually have that color, but those were lubed a good 10 years back. I guess Mule Snot doesn't hold up over time

 

[Dimner]

My start with those would be in your fav non-marlin 30wcf. Put in 5 grains of Unique and see if they do any better. Unique is my goto 30 plinker powder and it's right halfway between your red dot and 2400 in burn rate.

5.5 grains and the lyman 3118 give me around 1225fps.

What weight is the bullet? If over 140, add 0.5gr or go upto 6.0g

 

[popper]

Just add more mule snot or BLL and shoot. Kinda lite load for weight. Red dot is pretty fast for heavy bullets.

 

[Bret4207]

IIRC it weighs in at 160-ish. I'll have to put them on the scale. IIRC I used 13.0 Red Dot and 16.0 2400, in the 308 and '06 those being my 2 go to loads for cast. In the 30-30 I believe it was 8.0 Unique, but I'd have to look at the note book.

I suppose I could have been just pushing them way too hard. By "Don't shoot for beans" I mean 4" patterns at 50 yards. Not at all what I'm used to, and the '06 was real bad but I put that down to a '03 barrel that probably hadn't ever been cleaned since 1948! Jacket fouling don'tchaknow.

Honestly, pretty much everything I shot cast in a rifle was doing at least 1400. I never got down into the "Low Node" area, maybe I should rethink that. I just saw this as a great alternative to the RCBS 30-180FN, or so I hoped.

 

[Tomme boy]

Get some plain base gas checks or powder coat them

 

[Bret4207]

Well, that's surely an option, but the idea was to have a PB/TL design for plinking that dropped 6 at a time. I shot up 100 or so of these and the results were unsatisfactory. I ran out of time but the concept appeals to me yet. This is the one bullet I've played with that just wouldn't cooperate. The comments above make my think I may have just been asking too much of it, speed-wise. I still have a mess left and I'm short on 308 cast ammo. Wouldn't take a lot to relube and drop the 2400 charge significantly, or try Unique or another powder. Perhaps something more in the 11-1200 fps area is where I should have started. This one just failed completely for me from the get go, pretty unusual IME.

 

[richhodg66]

I think your load is way too hot for success using a plain based bullet. In fact, in my experience, Ed Harris' "The Load" of 13 grains of Red Dot is too hot for best accuracy even in the '06 and 11 grains or so was a lot better.

I've been shooting a lot of bullets my Dad had lubed with LLA which has developed that look and kinda dried out, but haven't experienced leading. None have been anything I really put to an accuracy test. I like the liquid alox as lube and seem to be using it more lately.

 

[Spindrift]

I have my own white whales, and know how frustrating it is.
I think you're on the right track, with load reduction. Lower load intensity will reduce the consequences of a fit problem. In the .308-06 kinda case, I'd try 7-8 grs of something that will burn well at this level.

 

[Missionary]

Well if all that does not work cut them in half and use in a wrist rocket.

 

[Bret4207]

I think your load is way too hot for success using a plain based bullet. In fact, in my experience, Ed Harris' "The Load" of 13 grains of Red Dot is too hot for best accuracy even in the '06 and 11 grains or so was a lot better.

I've been shooting a lot of bullets my Dad had lubed with LLA which has developed that look and kinda dried out, but haven't experienced leading. None have been anything I really put to an accuracy test. I like the liquid alox as lube and seem to be using it more lately.

I imagine you and Spindrift are right. To be honest, this one was so bad right off the bat that I just shoved it to the side in favor of designs that shot so much better, even PB, at 14-1600 fps that I didn't take the time to bother with it. I should aim for something 22LR speed and try it again I think. It's always stuck in my craw though, I suppose because it was the first design I ran into that just didn't work at all!

I've used the 13 RD load, or something close to it, with PB in 35 cal rifles and it worked pretty good. But that was with a relatively lighter for the cal design and one with much stronger driving bands and one that wasn't TL'd.

Tell ya one thing- I wish I had kept better records of what I've done, what I loaded, what I found that worked or didn't. I lost a lot of info to simply getting sidetracked with life and forgetting stuff. Then someone mentions something and it tickles a memory. Be better if we'd all write everything down, but that isn't likely to happen. So now I find myself using the "IIRC" caveat!!!

 

[462]

Bret, do you recall if you tried Unique?

 

[Matt]

I’ve had good performance with 8 to 10 grains of Red Dot in .308 and .30/06 and plain based bullets particularly the Ideal 308241 and my plain vases NOE copy of the Saeco #315. Green Dot, PB and similar powders work well too.

 

[fiver]

yep,, back them down.
1200 fps would probably be the too fast line.

 

[Dimner]

This is out of a 30-30, a savage 350 or a savage 24, I cannot recall which. I really think 22LR speeds and Unique is the key to success.



For 30-06: 8.2 grains of trailboss and a 3118. Might be worth a look at trailboss. I think it worked better for me because of the greater case capacity.

 

[RicinYakima]

Tell ya one thing- I wish I had kept better records of what I've done, what I loaded, what I found that worked or didn't. I lost a lot of info to simply getting sidetracked with life and forgetting stuff. Then someone mentions something and it tickles a memory. Be better if we'd all write everything down, but that isn't likely to happen. So now I find myself using the "IIRC" caveat!!!

Me too, I only have the last 30 years and wish I had kept the 20 before that !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Tomme boy]

Powder coat them and run them where they are at.

 

[Glaciers]

Yeah powder coating the TL design would strengthen the drive bands and maybe try .312 if they would fit. But even .311 with PC might be enough.
But you can’t PC a bullet that’s been previously lubed. Got to start clean and use a clean sizer.

 

[richhodg66]

Throttle that load back to about 7 grains of Red Dot, load in .30-30 as close to the lands as you can, crimp as little as possible and have fun. I'm certain you're gonna see a marked improvement in accuracy. No need to over complicate this one.

 

[Bret4207]

Well if all that does not work cut them in half and use in a wrist rocket.

It's NY! Wrist Rockets and machetes are illegal, which is why you can still buy Wrist Rockets and machetes just about anywhere...I guess...wait...how come.........................................aw, never mind. I'll never figure NY out!!!!

 

[Bret4207]

Bret, do you recall if you tried Unique?

In the 30-30 I'm sure I did. I want to say 8-10 grs, but I'd have to see if I wrote it down or dissect a loaded cartridge if I have any left. I'd bet it was 10.0 as there is something else I was using that in, again, if I wrote it down. I'll have to go through the loaded ammo, I usually stick a note in the baggie or box outlining what the heck the ammo is!