Bret4207
At the casting bench in the sky. RIP Bret.
It's funny how some PB stuff shoots faster with no issues and then others won't have it at all. Fit Bret! FIT!!!! You'd think I'd know that after all the times I've said it to others!!!!
My white whale...
- Thread starter Bret4207
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Bret4207
At the casting bench in the sky. RIP Bret.
With the lighter bullets, the 311316 to be specific, I've had little issues at 32-20 revolver speeds out of 32-20 rifles. I owned a 311316 for years before I ever applied a GC! My groups weren't that nice, but they did fine for plinking. But I think that basic design is pretty easy to work with. These "Microband" designs, they are even smaller and weaker than Loverin designs, are something else altogether.
I will cut my Unique loads about in half and see what the gun says! Thx!
Bret4207
At the casting bench in the sky. RIP Bret.
Come on Tom! That's witchcraft to my old head! You are right though, I bet it would make things a lot easier. Just gotta find a giant sized bucket of TIME!!!
Bret4207
At the casting bench in the sky. RIP Bret.
They drop right at .311 as designed in my old WW alloy. You guys keep talking this PC stuff, I may have to try it down the line. This many guys that know cast can't be wrong!
Bret4207
At the casting bench in the sky. RIP Bret.
Overthinking things is my #1 most used skill!!! It really helps with my #2 skill, which is procrastination.
I'll try your advice! Thx!
Glaciers
Alaska Land of the Midnight Sun
Missionary
Well-Known Member
Historically was that not a BP design... Case full of Goex 3F is the solution.....
quicksylver
Well-Known Member
WELL!Looks to me like those should shoot lights out. right off the bat I can tell ya that 13 grains of RD with a GC bullet in the 30/06 is too hot. Got to drop to 12.5 -12.7 forGC bullets and way too hot for a .308 drop to around 8-9grs Unigue the .30/30 will probably like 7.0-7.5Unique the savage and .308 will probably like a .310 bullet better and the Spingfield.311-.3,312. don't try 2400 with any PB relube and resize and try these loads they all produced sub .75" groups @100 yds with my guns using iron sights. you're looking for around 1100-1150 FPS.
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richhodg66
Well-Known Member
Yep. Nothing to do with alloy, or even gas check or powder coat, 13 grains of Red Dot is just plain too hot.
quicksylver
Well-Known Member
Wow, you still got Red Dot and 2400!!!
Bret4207
At the casting bench in the sky. RIP Bret.
That might well do it! No, that was a GB on The Board Which Shall Not Be Named. I don't remember who drew up the design, but it was one of the more trustworthy designers over there. The TL/Microbands were kind of a thing then and the hope was they'd work for this one. IIRC, and again, my rememberer sux, no one had stellar results with this design at the time. Maybe someone who is still allowed to enter over there can look up "30 Plinker" and gather some info.
Bret4207
At the casting bench in the sky. RIP Bret.
I think it's more like the design isn't up to the charge I was using. The alloy works great in all sorts of stuff using RD without issue. I think it's the quirks of that design.
Bret4207
At the casting bench in the sky. RIP Bret.
Have to sort of disagree. 13.0 RD shoots great with a variety of bullets in 308, '06, 7.65x53, 8x56R, 8x57, 35 Rem, 35 Whelen and several others. I switched to 16.0 2400 after people reported the RD powder had a real high, but real short, pressure peak. PB has never been a problem with 2400 for me. Sounds like you've got a system that works for you though!
RicinYakima
High Steppes of Eastern Washington
Hercules 2400 has a shelf life of more than 100 years if stored well.
fiver
Well-Known Member
13 of red dot is kicking up near 50-k in some cases and down around 45 in the bigger ones.
part of the issue isn't so much the pressure as it is the kick in the pants the powder provides.
now this is maybe gonna sound off after that statement, but i'd really be looking at using lower amounts of red-dot rather than trying to walk the 30-30 line with unique.
unique burns okay but it will start getting velocity variations right about the time you start hitting the lower speed you want.
probably not so noticeable at 50yds.
part of the issue isn't so much the pressure as it is the kick in the pants the powder provides.
now this is maybe gonna sound off after that statement, but i'd really be looking at using lower amounts of red-dot rather than trying to walk the 30-30 line with unique.
unique burns okay but it will start getting velocity variations right about the time you start hitting the lower speed you want.
probably not so noticeable at 50yds.
Bret4207
At the casting bench in the sky. RIP Bret.
I was thinking cutting the RD in about half and seeing what the gun says. I know RD has quite a spike but it worked so good. 2400 is another option and then there's Unique and the other Dots and a mess of other stuff in the powder locker. I appreciate all the observations and thoughts guys. This one just didn't want to play nice and I don't think it's just the PB. I think it's the bands too. Anyone who has messed with the Lee TL designs knows they can be a hit or miss affair, I think this design has some of that in play.
On reflection, the cast shooting I've done in rifles, which runs from 800-2200+, has generally been a pretty easy ride to meet my requirements, which aren't 1/4" groups at 100! A nice round inch-ish group at 50-75 yards is pretty decent shooting for my eyes with open sights these days. 5, 6, 8 inch groups though?!! I've not had too many issues where that cropped up. I think I was fortunate to work with good designs in cast friendly guns for the most part. IOW, I got spoiled! My intention is to see this one work in the FR-8 Mauser 308. I'd like to see it take the place of the RCBS 30-180FN for close in work, stuff under 50-75 yards. The 30-180FN is a very good and reliable shooter in that rifle, which sees a lot of duty in winter as a tractor gun. But GC's aren't exactly falling from the sky here. Anyhoo, that's the general idea.
On reflection, the cast shooting I've done in rifles, which runs from 800-2200+, has generally been a pretty easy ride to meet my requirements, which aren't 1/4" groups at 100! A nice round inch-ish group at 50-75 yards is pretty decent shooting for my eyes with open sights these days. 5, 6, 8 inch groups though?!! I've not had too many issues where that cropped up. I think I was fortunate to work with good designs in cast friendly guns for the most part. IOW, I got spoiled! My intention is to see this one work in the FR-8 Mauser 308. I'd like to see it take the place of the RCBS 30-180FN for close in work, stuff under 50-75 yards. The 30-180FN is a very good and reliable shooter in that rifle, which sees a lot of duty in winter as a tractor gun. But GC's aren't exactly falling from the sky here. Anyhoo, that's the general idea.
Missionary
Well-Known Member
I have always thought the TL design is just a modified Louvern from the popular BP Shutzen days.