Absolutely incredible thing to see
- Thread starter Rick
- Start date
35 shooter
Well-Known Member
Wow, the one on the porch looks like he intends to homestead lol. The one in the garage does not look like a happy camper at all.
Pistolero
Well-Known Member
OK, looks like the cat or dog of the home is toast if it comes out. That would be a REAL shocker to
walk out into. Yikes!
What are the rules about shooting them when you find one on your front porch or
in your shop? the good news is that MOST of them seem to decide that large adult humans
are a bit too large, so rarely attack --- except kids and women.
Look up 'cougar attacks' on the web. There used to be a woman, Linda, IIRC who had put
up a web site cataloging cougar attacks and getting stories. She started when there were a
lot of tracks around her horse barn, and she was worried about dogs and horses, and herself.
Local cops and game cops (east of Ft. Collins, IIRC) just said that they were dog tracks, no big
deal, forget about it. Attacks are from above, trying to bite the base of the skull for
an instant kill. Usually fails on bigger humans, but frequently the fangs slice the scalp to the bone
across the rear of the skull. Multiple survivors report having to hold their scalp up out of their
eyes, with blood every where and fighting off a big cat. Several folks have managed to kill
or drive them off with a Buck knife or equivalent. I asked a friend who teaches anatomy
to MD students and he says that the scalp is stretched tighly over the skull, so if sliced, it
retracts, and drops your forehead and hair in your eyes... Fighting off a 100 lb cat with a Buck knife
on one bloody hand, while holding your scalp up so you can see with the other.... Not a nice
image in my brain! Thank goodness human attacks are still pretty rare.
Here is a link, she is Linda Lewis, looks like the pages are only partially up now, probably
$$. We corresponded via e-mail and she was doing out of her own pocket, and that was
at least 10 or 15 years back.
http://www.angelfire.com/co/KlueLass/lions/attacks2.htm
http://tchester.org/sgm/lists/lion_attacks_nonca.html
apparently some collaborator's site,
http://www.topangaonline.com/nature/lionatk.html
They are closer than most folks think. A friend in Fla; we went to college together, stayed
in G'ville. He does consulting in biology and water flows (we have done a good bit of cave
diving together, he is really world class diver, gets invited to be a support diver for Nat Geo cave
diving articles). He also just looks for cool stuff to do. He was assisting a UF researcher a
few years back who had captured and radio collared a few Florida panthers. He reported that
one that they were locating (they went out to locate them each AM) showed up on the edge of
town, and as they did crossing direction finding lines of position, eventually realized that it was
laying up on the palmetto patch in the front yard (sort of native shrubbery feature, left when
clearing out the underbrush) of a home at the edge of suburbia. The patch was about 8x10 ft.
The area had several homes under construction just down the street and they found tracks
along the back edge of the properties that were being built on, at the edge of the woods.
The casually asked the construction guys if they had "seen anything unusual around here",
and got all negative responses. The scientist decided not to freak out the family that had a panther
spending the hot part of the day in their shrubbery.
They are out there much more than most know, and we still rarely see them.
Bill
walk out into. Yikes!
What are the rules about shooting them when you find one on your front porch or
in your shop? the good news is that MOST of them seem to decide that large adult humans
are a bit too large, so rarely attack --- except kids and women.
Look up 'cougar attacks' on the web. There used to be a woman, Linda, IIRC who had put
up a web site cataloging cougar attacks and getting stories. She started when there were a
lot of tracks around her horse barn, and she was worried about dogs and horses, and herself.
Local cops and game cops (east of Ft. Collins, IIRC) just said that they were dog tracks, no big
deal, forget about it.
Attacks are from above, trying to bite the base of the skull foran instant kill. Usually fails on bigger humans, but frequently the fangs slice the scalp to the bone
across the rear of the skull. Multiple survivors report having to hold their scalp up out of their
eyes, with blood every where and fighting off a big cat. Several folks have managed to kill
or drive them off with a Buck knife or equivalent.
I asked a friend who teaches anatomyto MD students and he says that the scalp is stretched tighly over the skull, so if sliced, it
retracts, and drops your forehead and hair in your eyes...
Fighting off a 100 lb cat with a Buck knifeon one bloody hand, while holding your scalp up so you can see with the other.... Not a nice
image in my brain! Thank goodness human attacks are still pretty rare.
Here is a link, she is Linda Lewis, looks like the pages are only partially up now, probably
$$. We corresponded via e-mail and she was doing out of her own pocket, and that was
at least 10 or 15 years back.
http://www.angelfire.com/co/KlueLass/lions/attacks2.htm
http://tchester.org/sgm/lists/lion_attacks_nonca.html
apparently some collaborator's site,
http://www.topangaonline.com/nature/lionatk.html
They are closer than most folks think. A friend in Fla; we went to college together, stayed
in G'ville. He does consulting in biology and water flows (we have done a good bit of cave
diving together, he is really world class diver, gets invited to be a support diver for Nat Geo cave
diving articles). He also just looks for cool stuff to do. He was assisting a UF researcher a
few years back who had captured and radio collared a few Florida panthers. He reported that
one that they were locating (they went out to locate them each AM) showed up on the edge of
town, and as they did crossing direction finding lines of position, eventually realized that it was
laying up on the palmetto patch in the front yard (sort of native shrubbery feature, left when
clearing out the underbrush) of a home at the edge of suburbia. The patch was about 8x10 ft.
The area had several homes under construction just down the street and they found tracks
along the back edge of the properties that were being built on, at the edge of the woods.
The casually asked the construction guys if they had "seen anything unusual around here",
and got all negative responses. The scientist decided not to freak out the family that had a panther
spending the hot part of the day in their shrubbery.
They are out there much more than most know, and we still rarely see them.
Bill
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smokeywolf
Well-Known Member
When I was a kid, Dad had the hide of one of those big puddy tats* hanging above the saddle in his shop.
EDIT: *The hide that is.
EDIT: *The hide that is.
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smokeywolf
Well-Known Member
Timber just met Rocky Racoon. About 20 minutes ago we had a racoon on the deck just outside our front door. Door was open, but security screen reflects outdoor light. Rocky couldn't see in too well, but Timber heard him and saw him and rushed the screen. Rocky took foot bail. Oh well, there goes my coon-skin hat.
blackthorn
Active Member
Well---it seems to me one could shoot the cat with total impunity if the official stance is that there are no cats there. You can't shoot what does not exist!----What cat????
Interesting. The eastern mountain lion has supposedly been extinct for quite some time. Despite that, there numerous sightings in the Appalachians, and not of the tawny colored cats. The biologists claim that there is no black phase of the cats, but yet the reports persist. I was looking at a map somewhere on the 'net, and about 40% of the reports were black as opposed to juvenile or tawny. Most of the reports were in Virginia, but they also were in Pa, W Va, and Md at minimum.
The only large cat that I've seen was of the tawny variety at about 40 yards. I was in a ladder stand about 15' up looking over and through a mountain laurel thicket. With 7x binoculars, there was no doubt in my mind what I saw. I've had bobcats on cameras in the same area, and had a large one(for a bobcat) cross the road in front of my wife and I as we drove on a rainy day. Neighbors in the area have been seeing big cats for many years. More interesting is that I've spoken to (2) different women who have lived in the area (mountains of southern Virginia) all of their lives, and both have seen the long tailed black cats at relatively close range. One was an archery hunter, and the other routinely watches deer, bear, and bobcats on their farm. I believe both of them.
Back to the biologists. They know the Florida Panther exists, but no further north than Alabama or Arkansas. Black cats in the southwest are reportedly jaguars, but what are they in the Appalachians? Don't exist, never existed, no such color phase....except that the early settlers living and moving through the mountains wrote about them. Of course, they didn't know that black cats didn't exist.
The only large cat that I've seen was of the tawny variety at about 40 yards. I was in a ladder stand about 15' up looking over and through a mountain laurel thicket. With 7x binoculars, there was no doubt in my mind what I saw. I've had bobcats on cameras in the same area, and had a large one(for a bobcat) cross the road in front of my wife and I as we drove on a rainy day. Neighbors in the area have been seeing big cats for many years. More interesting is that I've spoken to (2) different women who have lived in the area (mountains of southern Virginia) all of their lives, and both have seen the long tailed black cats at relatively close range. One was an archery hunter, and the other routinely watches deer, bear, and bobcats on their farm. I believe both of them.
Back to the biologists. They know the Florida Panther exists, but no further north than Alabama or Arkansas. Black cats in the southwest are reportedly jaguars, but what are they in the Appalachians? Don't exist, never existed, no such color phase....except that the early settlers living and moving through the mountains wrote about them. Of course, they didn't know that black cats didn't exist.
I don't know if the cat is still hanging around this area because I haven't seen it again but again last night the dog (my brave hunting dog) would have no part of going outside. She got about two feet out the door and tucked her tail between her legs and couldn't get back inside fast enough. Just didn't have to tinkle quite that bad I guess. I've had her for 4 years and that was the 4-5 time the same thing has happened but I never knew why, perhaps now I know. The neighbor says that a couple of times a year her Lab does the same thing. Poor dog didn't/wouldn't go out again until this morning and she went very slowly and cautiously. Kind of a bummer to need to check your bathroom for Panther's every time you need to go at night.
.
.
Pistolero
Well-Known Member
Mtn lion smell is probably hard wired into the brains of dogs. Not kidding.
I was hunting deer, very slowly walking on foggy, dewy morning in N. central Fla. Wet enough
to be able to move quietly over the oak leaves, no crunch. This was about 1968.
Suddenly, I was at full alert, and it was like there was one of those electronic word signs installed
in my head flashing one word.....BEAR! Somehow, in the instant I was CERTAIN, zero doubt that
there was a bear nearby, yet no conscious, command-level brain understanding, just "WARNING"
from some way down there deep, hard-wired, ancient warning system. I looked at my buddy and
he, too, was frozen, and he silently mouthed "Bear". We looked around, walked on slowly (both
quite certain there was a bear, but equally certain that we had NO idea why we KNEW it) and then
20 yds away spotted bear tracks in the soft sand.
We then started talking about it, neither had any idea that we had smelled anything (also neither
was aware that we had ever previously smelled a bear (in a zoo??) but had no awareness of smelling it and
identifying it on a conscious level. It was definitely not, "Hmm, what is that smell?", "Gee,
I think it smells like a bear." It was INSTANT and CERTAIN, and subconscious.
VERY weird, but it convinced me that there are very deep seated, hard wired stuff down in the brain
that was put there generations back and still works, at least in some folks, some of the time.
I suspect that dogs are far closer to that sort of stuff than we are, and the dog KNEW that there
was a mtn lion out there and that it did not want to play with one.
Had to grin at your last line of your post, Rick. Yep.
Bill
I was hunting deer, very slowly walking on foggy, dewy morning in N. central Fla. Wet enough
to be able to move quietly over the oak leaves, no crunch. This was about 1968.
Suddenly, I was at full alert, and it was like there was one of those electronic word signs installed
in my head flashing one word.....BEAR! Somehow, in the instant I was CERTAIN, zero doubt that
there was a bear nearby, yet no conscious, command-level brain understanding, just "WARNING"
from some way down there deep, hard-wired, ancient warning system. I looked at my buddy and
he, too, was frozen, and he silently mouthed "Bear". We looked around, walked on slowly (both
quite certain there was a bear, but equally certain that we had NO idea why we KNEW it) and then
20 yds away spotted bear tracks in the soft sand.
We then started talking about it, neither had any idea that we had smelled anything (also neither
was aware that we had ever previously smelled a bear (in a zoo??) but had no awareness of smelling it and
identifying it on a conscious level. It was definitely not, "Hmm, what is that smell?", "Gee,
I think it smells like a bear." It was INSTANT and CERTAIN, and subconscious.
VERY weird, but it convinced me that there are very deep seated, hard wired stuff down in the brain
that was put there generations back and still works, at least in some folks, some of the time.
I suspect that dogs are far closer to that sort of stuff than we are, and the dog KNEW that there
was a mtn lion out there and that it did not want to play with one.
Had to grin at your last line of your post, Rick. Yep.
Bill
KHornet
Well-Known Member
Don't know if what you describe Bill is a 6th sense or what, but have had it occur a
couple of times. Sort of the hair on the back of your neck type of thing. Regardless
of what it is, there remains within us still, some trace of primeval instinct. Those of
us who hunt, are more prone I believe, to understand it.
Paul
couple of times. Sort of the hair on the back of your neck type of thing. Regardless
of what it is, there remains within us still, some trace of primeval instinct. Those of
us who hunt, are more prone I believe, to understand it.
Paul
F
freebullet
Guest
Rick do you have a trail camera?
smokeywolf
Well-Known Member
Rick is watching his dog's instincts and reactions. Can't go wrong doing that.
I used to spend a lot of time on horseback in the Hills North of Simi Valley or in the Santa Monica Mountains. Always watch your horses and dogs. They know what's coming before you do.
I used to spend a lot of time on horseback in the Hills North of Simi Valley or in the Santa Monica Mountains. Always watch your horses and dogs. They know what's coming before you do.
No but I am now considering it. I've lived here for 4 1/2 years and this was the only time I've seen this cat though the dog has been spooked a half dozen times. Trying to catch it with a game camera would be an exercise in patience.
Most big cats have a range that they patrol for food that could be 10 miles or more, no telling how long it could be before it comes back this way. This cat was obviously accustomed to the presence of both dogs and people. The dog inside the sliding glass door doing her best impersonation of a bad ass (behind the closed door of course) and me standing next to the dog with both of us in plain sight didn't spook the cat at all, it just wandered off like it was bored with the situation. The cat showed no fear at all much unlike he who was viewing it. That's kind of worrisome.
.
F
freebullet
Guest
I've got an old trail camera I could let you borrow. I can drop it in the mail for ya. Just send it back in 6 months or so.
I used it scouting for deer. I set it up over bait & caught bobcats, yotes, & fox up here.
I used it scouting for deer. I set it up over bait & caught bobcats, yotes, & fox up here.
35 shooter
Well-Known Member
I don't know for sure what the range of a big cat is, but i've heard more than once it can be as much as 150 miles and can take up to 3 months to cover.
What i DO KNOW is when i lived on what is called Big Swamp Creek in MS. we had one coming through our area about every 3 months.
The way we knew when it was there is that there was no mistaking the shrieking screams it would let out as it traveled along the creek bottom about 2:00am in the morning.
And also the dogs wanted to come inside. It would be like that for a day or two and things would go back to normal.
I never heard that sound in the daytime...only at night.
What i DO KNOW is when i lived on what is called Big Swamp Creek in MS. we had one coming through our area about every 3 months.
The way we knew when it was there is that there was no mistaking the shrieking screams it would let out as it traveled along the creek bottom about 2:00am in the morning.
And also the dogs wanted to come inside. It would be like that for a day or two and things would go back to normal.
I never heard that sound in the daytime...only at night.