How Are Your Knife Sharpening Skills???

L Ross

Well-Known Member
One thing I can not figure out is this. I can make an axe that is razor sharp but a knife only so so sharp. I think it has to do with how stiff the axes are??? I use files, grinders, belt sanders to remove the damage on most of them then stones, sandpaper, buffing wheel and strop to get them the way I like.

I also like to use OLD axes. The new ones are not the same steel anymore. Maybe thats what it is? The older axes use a better quality steel?
I certainly think so Tomme. Steel made from virgin iron ore and the various additives to attain certain desirable qualities should be better than an amalgamation of recycled scrap. That is just my opinion of course.
When I played at blacksmithing as a spin off of our Historical Reenacting hobby I sought out old farm junk piles. Some of the items I wanted to recreate needed wrought iron, some carbon steel, some just plain old mild steel.. When it came to making fire strikers old files were far superior to anything make after the 1960's.
Tomme, have you ever run across an axe blade that had a tool/carbon steel cutting edge sandwiched between mild steel or even wrought iron sides. If you look very carefully you can see the forge welding lines. I have a couple of hewing hatchets made like that and they are a delight.
 

JustJim

Well-Known Member
I watched a video of a guy dressing and butchering a buffalo in a different historically correct way...with rocks. He had killed it with a stick and a rock, too, in a very expert way.
Around 2000 I took 3 semi-free-roaming bison (escaped from a ranch the spring before): one with a spear-thrower, one with sinew-backed bow, one with a cut-down Brown Bess. In field-dressing and processing I compared repro tools based on artifacts recovered from some kill sites in the area with an original "I Wilson" butcher.

If you make the initial cut and from there work from the inside, skinning a recently-wallowed cow with a stone tool isn't much of a problem (once you wrap the stone "handle" with a clump of the longer hair from the neck, otherwise the fluids make the tool slick). WIth a little re-touching I could skin with one or two tools. Bone tools were a solid "fail" cutting the hide, with the edge quickly lost. Steel required frequent re-touches for the same amount of work in hide covered with dried mud.

Processing was another matter. Here the bone tools were great: the very coarse "toothy" edge and longer blade made boning and cutting the meat go much faster than the shorter stone tool. The advantages of steel were that it didn't require importing the stone for tools, and that it could be sharpened in less time than making and grinding a bone tool. I'd have to dig out my notes to be sure, but as I recall the steel knife was about 50% quicker than bone when slicing the meat for drying. All in all it was an interesting project.

As for older steels, I'm still working on that. I've gathered bog iron and refined it in a bloomery, worked it into wrought iron, made blister steel and forged that into shear steel and double-shear steel, and experimented with crucible steel. I'm one the fence with the crucible steel; my wrought isn't refined enough to match the stuff from Sweden that Huntsman was using. My end results (carbon content) aren't as consistent with the crucible steel as I get with the double-shear steel. OTOH, there are no slag stringers in the crucible steel.

Still working on the test blades. I'm working on copies of a knife (actually several) recovered from a village that was occupied around 1780-1795. The knives are of the French pattern but that late were probably English-made. In that period, British trade knives would have been double-shear steel at best, which is consistent with the one original blade (a surface find from the area) that was sacrificed for analysis.

As for Tomme Boy's question about older steels, I wonder if the issue isn't that back then once they had optimized their refinement and heat-treating they focused on perfecting the form for the intended purpose. Today, similar tools seem to lack the same refinement in form and function, probably because we don't use them with the same intensity. I have smoothing planes that are wonderful--far better than most of the modern offerings--but today we are more likely to use an electric planer or wide-belt sander with the same end goal in mind.
 

seagiant1

Active Member
Hi,
Most old Axes were made of Wrought Iron with a Steel Bit...

Usually or a lot of times old files for the edge.

The same technique is used today with mild steel as the base, but real Wrought Iron...

Forge welded easier!

 

Tomme boy

Well-Known Member
I certainly think so Tomme. Steel made from virgin iron ore and the various additives to attain certain desirable qualities should be better than an amalgamation of recycled scrap. That is just my opinion of course.
When I played at blacksmithing as a spin off of our Historical Reenacting hobby I sought out old farm junk piles. Some of the items I wanted to recreate needed wrought iron, some carbon steel, some just plain old mild steel.. When it came to making fire strikers old files were far superior to anything make after the 1960's.
Tomme, have you ever run across an axe blade that had a tool/carbon steel cutting edge sandwiched between mild steel or even wrought iron sides. If you look very carefully you can see the forge welding lines. I have a couple of hewing hatchets made like that and they are a delight.
I have 2 ace heads that I found metal detecting a early 1800's farm. They are still in rust. I have not got around to getting the rust off yet. My last battery charger took a crap for putting them through the electrolysis to remove it.

I still have 2 old 1800s school yards to detect. One the building is still standing.
 

StrawHat

Well-Known Member
How sharp is sharp enough? Other than shaving with a straight razor.
Oh certainly planes and tools, but a belt knife or a pocket knife?


This! How sharp is sharp enough? Every day I get requests for “razor sharp”. For some reason, only guys ask for this. I ask if they use this knife for shaving? Because if so, then yes, I am happy to make it razor sharp but it will not work in the kitchen. If the knife is a kitchen knife, a razor edge will defeat the purpose of its purpose. A kitchen knife needs a good, toothy edge that will withstand repeated contact with a cutting board.

One thing I can not figure out is this. I can make an axe that is razor sharp but a knife only so so sharp. I think it has to do with how stiff the axes are??? I use files, grinders, belt sanders to remove the damage on most of them then stones, sandpaper, buffing wheel and strop to get them the way I like…


If you are expecting a polished edge to cut as well as a toothy edge, good luck. A good kitchen edge needs some tooth to cut efficiently.

Kevin
 

Jeff H

NW Ohio
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If you are expecting a polished edge to cut as well as a toothy edge, good luck. A good kitchen edge needs some tooth to cut efficiently.

Kevin

Cannot disagree on kitchen knives. A knife that will shave cleanly and comfortably can slide around on a tomato skin.

But, I get where Tomme is coming from too, because a finely polished edge on a wood-working tool will stand up longer and keep cutting. A toothy edge WILL cut for a while, but the microscopic "teeth" will beak down. Works as well on an axe edge as a plane-iron to polish the edge as finely as possible, requiring little more than an occasional strop to keep cutting WOOD cleanly.
 

StrawHat

Well-Known Member
Cannot disagree on kitchen knives. A knife that will shave cleanly and comfortably can slide around on a tomato skin.

But, I get where Tomme is coming from too, because a finely polished edge on a wood-working tool will stand up longer and keep cutting. A toothy edge WILL cut for a while, but the microscopic "teeth" will beak down. Works as well on an axe edge as a plane-iron to polish the edge as finely as possible, requiring little more than an occasional strop to keep cutting WOOD cleanly.
And a razor requires a different edge, so does an axe, so does an adze, a scorp and a myriad of other tools.
It strictly depends on the tool and its intended purpose.

Kevin
 
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Tomme boy

Well-Known Member
I like watching this guy forging. He makes some really cool stuff. And historical and his take on it.