Stuck here in the lead-free progressive paradise of Kalifornistan wanting to hunt with my front stuffers and a couple of old black powder cartridge rifles shooting 50-70 Gov. Can anyone share any information concerning these projectiles terminal performance on big game? FWIW, I use Rotometals Bismuth/tin shot in my muzzle loading shotgun and it works just fine on turkey and waterfowl.
Rotometals Lead Free casting alloy results?
- Thread starter THBailey
- Start date
RicinYakima
High Steppes of Eastern Washington
Get with Ian, as he did a complete work up on this stuff!
JonB
Halcyon member
here is 8 pages of reading.
www.artfulbullet.com
Lead-free bullet casting alloy
I want to continue the "Condor Cuddler" thread here but more to the point of attempting to find a lead-free substitute for cast bullets rather than resorting to the usual Barnes et alia solution for hunting in areas which no longer permit the use of lead bullets. As mentioned on the other...
www.artfulbullet.com
Ian
Notorious member
I think there's only one data point so far on live game and it was from a .223 Remington.
The .75% Antimony version we put together is significantly more malleable and cohesive than the shot and survives my sawdust trap very well. The challenge that will be faced when making a black powder projectile out of it is the relative brittleness to pure lead and how the lead-free alloy responds to black powder inside the gun. I would definitely try making patched round balls and paper patched cartridge bullets from it if I were to go that route, or possibly even a lubricated bullet with a stack of wads with a hard card, cork wad, and heavily-lubed felt wad on top of the powder in the compressed stack to help cushion and seal the bullet inside the barrel. A round ball or anything with a flat nose is going to be effective on game. Think of the Rotometals Lead-Free alloy (with the .75% antimony) as a lightweight Linotype metal but not quite as hard, and adjust your black powder loading techniques in that direction.
The .75% Antimony version we put together is significantly more malleable and cohesive than the shot and survives my sawdust trap very well. The challenge that will be faced when making a black powder projectile out of it is the relative brittleness to pure lead and how the lead-free alloy responds to black powder inside the gun. I would definitely try making patched round balls and paper patched cartridge bullets from it if I were to go that route, or possibly even a lubricated bullet with a stack of wads with a hard card, cork wad, and heavily-lubed felt wad on top of the powder in the compressed stack to help cushion and seal the bullet inside the barrel. A round ball or anything with a flat nose is going to be effective on game. Think of the Rotometals Lead-Free alloy (with the .75% antimony) as a lightweight Linotype metal but not quite as hard, and adjust your black powder loading techniques in that direction.
CZ93X62
Official forum enigma
There has been no deer hunting with the 87/12/>1 alloy yet, but some Lyman #311316s have connected with jackrabbits with fine effect. The jacks would view it differently, I'm certain, but they don't get a vote. To about 50 yards in my Marlin 94CCL the aim points between conventional cast and Roto Condor Cuddler Metal are very close, but past 50 yards they start hitting lower than conv. alloy. Accuracy holds to 100 yards, but hits are 2"-2.5" lower at same start speeds (1600 FPS). Bullets hold up to being shunted down the tubular magazine, but crimping must be light and into a groove. I haven't tried taper crimping (yet). At these velocities I've tried both Carnauba Red and 50/50 Xlox lubes, and I can see no difference between the two. grouping at 50 and 100 yards is much like that with conv. alloy, 2 MOA-2.5 MOA. It's a levergun with full-length tube mag, two straps holding the assembly together. It is what it is.
I am sticking to iron/steel mould blocks for now, I'll tackle aluminum mould blocks sometime later. There have been a number of medical challenges for me over the past 2-3 years that restrict my ability to do things, and I am striving to gain function in fits and starts. I'll quit when I'm dead, but that doesn't mean that tons of work isn't required--by both myself and Marie.
I had an earnest talk with the local game warden and his lieutenant a few months back. Their policy locally is to enforce the non-toxic bullet statutes if violations are encountered as an adjunct to general fish & wildlife enforcement, but it is not a priority per se. In their view, the state did not think things through when drafting the legislation. The same GCMS analysis is required to test bullet metal content as is required for drug analysis, and GCMS testing is not cheap. GCMS testing is ALWAYS backed up due to demands placed upon Cal-DOJ and local labs for drug analysis. Zealous enforcement of these non-toxic bullet and shot statutes is fiscally upside-down, it costs a lot more to prosecute than the fines or bails collected down the road. Trace amounts of lead in a bullet will not cause elements of the crime to be present--if the material used in the bullet substantially consists of non-lead metals, then it's good to go. There is case law on the books to that effect.
The "expanding point" requirement in CA law is more legalese getting in the way of common sense--its meaning is that FMJ non-expanding jacketed bullets are unlawful for large game.
The wardens in CA DO NOT LIKE these ticky-tack laws that dissuade people from fishing and hunting, a thing near and dear to the hearts of the Hard Left that infests River City. DFW's budget is tied to license sales revenues, and the fewer people out hunting and fishing = smaller and shallower revenue streams for their enforcement, research, and environmental mitigation projects. Lib/progs are at their best when they shoot themselves in the foot.
I am sticking to iron/steel mould blocks for now, I'll tackle aluminum mould blocks sometime later. There have been a number of medical challenges for me over the past 2-3 years that restrict my ability to do things, and I am striving to gain function in fits and starts. I'll quit when I'm dead, but that doesn't mean that tons of work isn't required--by both myself and Marie.
I had an earnest talk with the local game warden and his lieutenant a few months back. Their policy locally is to enforce the non-toxic bullet statutes if violations are encountered as an adjunct to general fish & wildlife enforcement, but it is not a priority per se. In their view, the state did not think things through when drafting the legislation. The same GCMS analysis is required to test bullet metal content as is required for drug analysis, and GCMS testing is not cheap. GCMS testing is ALWAYS backed up due to demands placed upon Cal-DOJ and local labs for drug analysis. Zealous enforcement of these non-toxic bullet and shot statutes is fiscally upside-down, it costs a lot more to prosecute than the fines or bails collected down the road. Trace amounts of lead in a bullet will not cause elements of the crime to be present--if the material used in the bullet substantially consists of non-lead metals, then it's good to go. There is case law on the books to that effect.
The "expanding point" requirement in CA law is more legalese getting in the way of common sense--its meaning is that FMJ non-expanding jacketed bullets are unlawful for large game.
The wardens in CA DO NOT LIKE these ticky-tack laws that dissuade people from fishing and hunting, a thing near and dear to the hearts of the Hard Left that infests River City. DFW's budget is tied to license sales revenues, and the fewer people out hunting and fishing = smaller and shallower revenue streams for their enforcement, research, and environmental mitigation projects. Lib/progs are at their best when they shoot themselves in the foot.