Petrol & Powder
Well-Known Member
I know SPG is a superior bullet lube for black powder cartridge loads but I generally keep 50/50 on hand. Can NRA 50/50 be used as a subsitute or is that just asking for trouble in a black powder cartridge load?
SPG v. NRA 50/50
- Thread starter Petrol & Powder
- Start date
L Ross
Well-Known Member
After several years of making my own BP lube, and using commercial lubes, I ended up trying Bullshop's NASA lube and never looked back. In BPCR you are often blow tubing or even wiping between shots, but when you are shooting revolvers and leverguns until the barrels are too hot to touch, NASA could keep me running, especially if the bullet held a bunch. Dick Dastardly's Big Lube bullet moulds simply work when running black. Coupled with NASA I have gotten as many as 50 rounds through a SAA clone. Almost as many as a B Western cowboy got without reloading.
Petrol & Powder
Well-Known Member
My requirements are minimal, so I would prefer to not change out the lube in the lubersizer. I could just pan lube for the small number of bullets needed but they will likely still need to go through the sizing die. In a perfect world……..I could just leave the 50/50 in the sizer.
JonB
Halcyon member
I've found Finger lubing goes better for me with a soft lube, than pan lubing...I HATE pan lubing.
Petrol & Powder
Well-Known Member
Yep, I agree.
However, if 50/50 is adequate for say, less than 10 shots now and then, that would simplify things.
I would greatly prefer to keep the logistics simple.
50/50 is certainly not ideal for this application but is it adequate ?
JonB
Halcyon member
I just ain't gonna answer that one.
Petrol & Powder
Well-Known Member
Yeah, but if I'm going to run them through the sizer, it sure would be nice to just get away with the 50/50 lube and be done.
RicinYakima
High Steppes of Eastern Washington
While it works, it does in my experience require wiping the bore every five shots for decent accuracy. My thought is that it holds the black powder residue in the bore much more than the thinner lubes. FWIW
Or don't lube the bullet with anything and just run a damp clean patch after every shot. This work fine off the bench or off hand.
Rockydoc
Well-Known Member
In my experience those purists were the ones who got in character by dressing in buckskins and having nothing in their camp that didn’t exist in that period. E.g. no plastics etc. They used animal fat, beeswax etc. for lubes.
I don’t believe it was because petrochemical lubes were actually inferior.
RBHarter
West Central AR
From an anything but purist .......me .
I used Darrs exactly once on some 45-200s for a 58' and a run of Maxiballs , 5 , in a TC Hawkin .
Olive oil wads , olivebee wads , olivebee mouth or groove lube , or just plain old Crisco is what I'll use from here on out .
It took about an hour to get the carbon scale out of the Hawkin . The 58 wasn't as bad but I had Crisco over the mouths as well .
I used Darrs exactly once on some 45-200s for a 58' and a run of Maxiballs , 5 , in a TC Hawkin .
Olive oil wads , olivebee wads , olivebee mouth or groove lube , or just plain old Crisco is what I'll use from here on out .
It took about an hour to get the carbon scale out of the Hawkin . The 58 wasn't as bad but I had Crisco over the mouths as well .
Petrol & Powder
Well-Known Member
OK, how about the other direction. I clean out the lubersizer when I need to lube & size a batch of bullets for BP loads. Put just enough SPG in the lubersizer for that batch. And then go back to 50/50 when that job is done - There will undoubtly be some SPG left in the lubersizer when I switch back to 50/50. Will SPG work for low velocity smokeless rounds?
It depends on the application, but in general petroleum-based lubes result in build-up of hard fouling over multiple shots. Quality of the powder seems to be a factor in this, but the fouling build-up is there even with the best powders, and gets worse with lesser-quality powders (like some lots of Elephant from the '90s).
Using neatsfoot oil, jojoba, bear oil, or tallow, I can shoot my flintlock all day (75-100 shots, Douglas .54 barrel mic'ing about .541" IIRC, 110 grains FFg, .019" patch, .535" round ball) w/o cleaning. Using a petroleum-based lube (mineral oil, vaseline, etc), I'm doing good to get 10 shots before the fouling build-up makes loading almost impossible.
In an ML bench rifle I played with that used a bore-sized lead slug and a 2 piece paper patch lubed with a wipe of mineral oil, wiped after every shot, there were no problems with fouling buildup. From pulled loads, the combination of wiping the bore and the effects of the paper patch basically eliminated the fouling. The same thing seems to have occurred with breech-seated rifles with the bullet loaded from the muzzle (from my very-limited tests, greaser or paper-patched didn't seem to matter).
On a good day my trapdoor will put 40+ rounds of 45-70-405 into about 4" at 100 yards. On the same day, changing only the lube (to NRA formula), resulted in a load that wouldn't keep 20 rounds in 24".
Many of the lubes recommended by serious target shooters back around 1900 contained petroleum waxes or oils, and they reportedly performed well. I've not had good luck with them with straight BP. From what I've read, a lot of them were using duplex loads (smokeless/black or black/smokeless)--maybe this was a factor, or perhaps it was some of the other ingredients.
L Ross
Well-Known Member
I almost exclusively pan lube the NASA. Melt in a double boiler. Stand bullets in a shallow black plastic deli tray. Pour to desired dept. Allow to cool and push the bullets out of the hardened cake with my thumb. Grease groove(s) perfectly full, bases clean, shot as cast of course.
RicinYakima
High Steppes of Eastern Washington
I have used SPG with standard "special" pistol cartridges and it works just fine. Also for GC rifle bullets up to about 1500 f/s. My only complaint is that it cost four times as much as any other lube. Since I only plink with BP, I just don't have that much experience with it. The flintlock gets a pint of water at the range, the brass cases go into a milk jug of soapy water. A wet wool mop down the bore is good here in the desert. But again I have never shot matches with BP.
JonB
Halcyon member
I guess you are not gonna try the finger lubing thing.
The "rule of three" makes me mention it one more time.
That should sit in your mind for the rest of your days, and one day many years from now, when you accidently get some soft lube on your fingers and then just wipe it off with the closest thing (a bullet groove) ...you'll say to yourself, ..."Huh! JonB was right."
Michael
Active Member. Uh/What
The purpose of lube for BP in addition to providing lubrication is also to assist in keeping the BP fouling soft. If one is patching between shots, the softness issue is not as important as it is to those who use a blow tube between shots. You can use SPG for smokeless, but 50/50 or other lubes intended for smokeless being used, for BP I don't. Also SPG is sold in bulk, i.e. 1/4, 1/2 pound, etc blocks, just melt and fill the lubersizer. Might try to find another sizer and use two, I know several shooters who do.