43-287B

[Pistolero]

Good luck. The best I could ever do at the range I tested the most at was about 2" reasonably consistently
with 1.5" every once in a while, at 50 yds. I think that is just the limit of me holding. Probably need
better bench support method than what I have. Used to be able to do about that either way, scope or
open. Probably have to have the scope nowdays. 6.5" Powerport 629.

This is interesting to "watch". I never spent much time or effort trying to recover bullets.
Probably should have.

Bill

 

[Brad]

Shot 50 rounds this morning.
Finally got the low extreme spread Rick is asking for. The 445 brass and 21.5 gr of H110 gave an extreme spread of 16 fps for 10 shots. The load clocks just over 1300 fps.
No spectacular groups but I got a lot of my setup figured out. Lowered the front rest and learned to keep my hands entirely off the bottom of the grip.
The last group was the best, it was 21 gr of H110 in 44 brass. I had figured out some of my grip issues and it paid off. I still had some out of the group but this is 5 of the last 10.

No recovered bullets, they went really deep in the wet clay today. Also had to share the range so limited time for bullet searching.

Need to final trim the 445 brass. Next loads will focus on the lowest extreme spread with 445 brass and the 21 gr load in 44 mag brass.
Will see about mixing a little of a richer alloy this weekend. I will be out of bullets soon and might as well try a new alloy for the next go around.

 

[Ian]

Did you test the hardness of the bullets this morning? I wonder how they're doing since aging some more, do you have any left over from loading the batch you shot this morning so you can check hardness again?

 

[Rick]

Yeah I would be interested in how they did with more aging time also. My revolver testing indicated that too hard, going past the point the load liked best would open up groups some. Sort of too much of a good thing kind of thing.

I'd also be interested in the chrono results of all the tests you did today.
.

 

[Brad]

Tested one last night. It went 23-24 BHn. This batch was cast, heat treated, sized, and lubed all as a single batch.

I have some left for future use/reference. I find that I get pretty stable hardness numbers after a few days when heat treating. That is one of the things I kind of like about it.

 

[Brad]

All loads H110, CCI 350 primer, new Starline brass, same batch of bullets.

445 cases
20.5 gr average 1273 fps, ES 33, SD 12
21.0 gr average 1294 fps, ES 34, SD 10
21.5 gr average 1318 fps, ES 16, SD 5

44 cases
20.5 gr average 1249 fps, ES 41, SD 13
21.0 gr average 1280 fps, ES 45, SD 13

 

[gman]

Maybe a question for Rick. Should one rest the bottom of the grip frame on a bag or use the bag to support the wrist leaving the grip clear of the bag? Nice to see it start coming together Brad.

 

[Brad]

If I can get my wife to come shoot with me I will see if she can get some good photos of how I hold my revolver.

 

[Rick]

I don't rest the grip on anything cause it will bounce and it will not bounce the same each time. Absolutely identical grip and follow through on each shot. Minor variations in either will cause big variations in shot placement.

 

[Brad]

That is something I verified today. Even having a small portion of my palm under the edge of the grip gave bigger groups with flyers. Keeping my off hand on the sides of the grip and in a very consistant place gave better groups.
As much as Rick preaches grip he still understates the importance.

 

[Rick]

The best 44m brass load is nearly 3 times the extreme spread as the best 445 brass test.

For the next 44m brass test try 20.0 gr.

Trim the 445 brass and continue with the 21.5 gr load to see if it repeats consistently. That there is 45 fps increase in velocity for a full 1.0 gr increase in powder is a suggestion that 21.5 gr is pretty close to where it will shoot best. Perhaps not max safe pressure but where it will shoot best.
.

 

[Brad]

Got it. The small extreme spread of one load tells me it is a good place to look for more.
Do you suggest I load up 50'rounds or so of a single load and see what they do or should I start trying some different primers? Different alloy?

I think more practice is a good start tarting place. Use a decent known load and see if I can learn to get consistant accuracy from it.

 

[Rick]

That is something I verified today. Even having a small portion of my palm under the edge of the grip gave bigger groups with flyers. Keeping my off hand on the sides of the grip and in a very consistent place gave better groups.
As much as Rick preaches grip he still understates the importance.

Grip and follow through with a revolver at long range cannot be overstated. Change either one slightly and you have changed the position of the muzzle at the instant the bullet exits. A difference in muzzle position of only a few thousands may not sound like much and at 25 feet it isn't but at 100 yards it's several inches. My money on a shot several inches out is well out of your group. At 200+ yards those few thousands of an inch and you may not even hit the target. In a revolver barrel time is so slow and it is so easy to not have the muzzle in exactly the same place on bullet exit from shot to shot. Hold the grip slightly firmer, slightly looser, hand a bit higher or lower on the grip, hand slightly left or right on the grip and you have changed the muzzle position. That level of consistency of grip and follow through doesn't come naturally or at least it didn't for me. Tons and tons of practice with concentration on grip cause it is that important if long range groups are the goal.
.

 

[Rick]

Do you suggest I load up 50'rounds or so of a single load and see what they do or should I start trying some different primers? Different alloy?

Were it me I would concentrate on what appears to be working well. Lot's of time to try stuff that may or may not work well. Truth is that the only thing you really know at this point is that it appears that your on the right track so why start changing stuff now? But that's me and what I would do.
.

 

[Brad]

I agree. Load up a bunch and work on the grip and bench set up. Once I get to a point where I get groups instead of patterns I can try different components and really know what caused the change.

 

[Brad]

445 brass is final trimmed to correct length. End of bullet will be .015 short of end of cylinder. This gives me some safety room in case of a long round or bullets being pulled even a little under recoil.
Cases were then chamfered on inside, primer pockets reamed, and cases sized just enough to reach base of bullet. Cases then got a minimum flare so bullets don't get shaved on seating.

I forgot how much I detest trimming brass.

 

[Ian]

First-world problems...

 

[Brad]

First-world problems...

True, but we need something to bitch about.

 

[fiver]

try making 375 super from 375 win.
you end up with more brass in the bucket than you have left to shoot.

 

[Rick]

Turning 414 Super Mag into 41 mag.