Another horrible day with the 1894 44 mag.
- Thread starter Will
- Start date
Targets haven't been photographed yet. The zombie HPs Ian sent were fired first. They were strung vertically in a bad way. Like 8 inches at 50 yards.
Second up was the NOE 503. They showed a two group target.
Next up was the 265 RD. It also showed a desire to form 2 groups.
The 2400 loads show lots of promise. Certainly less recoil than H110 which means less velocity too. That isn't a major concern to me.
What I dis learn is that the forearm cap being tight or loose makes a world of difference. It was tight when I fired the zombie HP and it strung badly. It was loose as a goose at the end and groups got bigger but still showed 2 groups with the other bullets and loads. Somewhere in the middle is right even though 2 groups form they are tighter groups.
I need to take the rifle apart and see what is rubbing or binding. If I can figure a way to keep it in the condition that gives snug groups and eliminate the variation leading to 2 groups forming I will be quite happy.
The loads show promise, I just need to figure out the rifle.
Second up was the NOE 503. They showed a two group target.
Next up was the 265 RD. It also showed a desire to form 2 groups.
The 2400 loads show lots of promise. Certainly less recoil than H110 which means less velocity too. That isn't a major concern to me.
What I dis learn is that the forearm cap being tight or loose makes a world of difference. It was tight when I fired the zombie HP and it strung badly. It was loose as a goose at the end and groups got bigger but still showed 2 groups with the other bullets and loads. Somewhere in the middle is right even though 2 groups form they are tighter groups.
I need to take the rifle apart and see what is rubbing or binding. If I can figure a way to keep it in the condition that gives snug groups and eliminate the variation leading to 2 groups forming I will be quite happy.
The loads show promise, I just need to figure out the rifle.
F
freebullet
Guest
That sounds discouraging. 
I got 48 pounds of range scrap? That was a bonus for me.
I feel like the binding is causing me troubles. I had huge vertical with the jacketed rounds I tried. The forearm cap was tight for those. At least now I am seeing a pattern and that helps me diagnose the problem and fix it.
Discouraging in a way but at least I learned something today.
I feel like the binding is causing me troubles. I had huge vertical with the jacketed rounds I tried. The forearm cap was tight for those. At least now I am seeing a pattern and that helps me diagnose the problem and fix it.
Discouraging in a way but at least I learned something today.
F
freebullet
Guest
48lbs is nothing to sneeze at for sure. I'd be happy about that. It's tough picking our dirt berms. Need a few feet of sand dumped on them, would make collecting/cleaning the berms much easier.
I don't know about the rifle, no experience with it. I'm learning with you, thanks for sharing the results.
I don't know about the rifle, no experience with it. I'm learning with you, thanks for sharing the results.
Our berms are best when dry and dusty. A gentle wipe of the hand un covers lots of bullets. My fingers are pretty well calibrated and I can tell a rock or clay fragments pretty quick. A large caller handgun digs up lots of buried bullets too. No need for heavy loads, a 200 swc at 750 fps from a 1911 does quite well.
Someday we need to meet up at the range and I can show you some tricks and secrets. Knowing a few of them makes it far quicker to get a good haul.
Today I shot a rubber reactive target from Cabelas. Fire 30-40 rounds then go collet what I dug up. Repeat until 200 rounds are fired.
Someday we need to meet up at the range and I can show you some tricks and secrets. Knowing a few of them makes it far quicker to get a good haul.
Today I shot a rubber reactive target from Cabelas. Fire 30-40 rounds then go collet what I dug up. Repeat until 200 rounds are fired.
F
freebullet
Guest
I'd like that, Brad. We've taken 70lb in an afternoon with the 2 of us. Haven't found the time this year. May have to buy lead at some point if I don't wrap up some of our projects.
Binding doesn't sound helpful. Will be interesting when you get a chance to check it out/ test more.
Binding doesn't sound helpful. Will be interesting when you get a chance to check it out/ test more.
Ian
Notorious member
Well I'm late to the party.
Yeah, you can go up a lot higher with the powder than the charge I recommended, but like Lamar said the PC will boost the velocity a bit and that's my revolver pet load that puts the same bullet into 2" groups @100 with a 4 MOA red dot and my weak, shaky self behind the trigger. It should be close to a good load, the main thing was to step down from 296 with the slippery PC and lighter bullet and see if the barrel twist liked that combination better. If the vertical string was more narrow than the heavier bullets, you might try going up a half grain or so and having another go with it after you get the forearm and mag tube mess fixed. My experience keeps indicating that if the rifle is squared away and you get a tight but tall vertical string, you have found a powder it really likes, but need just a small boost in powder charge to move the vibration node into the sweet spot.
Yeah, you can go up a lot higher with the powder than the charge I recommended, but like Lamar said the PC will boost the velocity a bit and that's my revolver pet load that puts the same bullet into 2" groups @100 with a 4 MOA red dot and my weak, shaky self behind the trigger. It should be close to a good load, the main thing was to step down from 296 with the slippery PC and lighter bullet and see if the barrel twist liked that combination better. If the vertical string was more narrow than the heavier bullets, you might try going up a half grain or so and having another go with it after you get the forearm and mag tube mess fixed. My experience keeps indicating that if the rifle is squared away and you get a tight but tall vertical string, you have found a powder it really likes, but need just a small boost in powder charge to move the vibration node into the sweet spot.
gman
Well-Known Member
Anyone read the Brian Pearce article in the recent Rifle magazine about this very subject? Swapped to a 1-16 twist and had the action worked over to allow feeding of up to 340 grain bullets. Accuracy chart before and after shooting same loads. Marlin just needs to change the twist rate on these.
fiver
Well-Known Member
yeah that forearm cap needs some work.
it's a little odd too that my 2400 load is only .3 grs away [19.3] .
it seems to work in both the 44 and the 45 colt.
back when I was doing some load development in my 44 my 45 and the BIL's 45 [all rossi 92's with 24" octagon barrels]
we started at the very bottom using clay's [run it from low to high] and kept on working upward with slower and slower powders.
we never changed the boolit [alloy/lube size] we just kept on going with more and more gas volume.
eventually we ended up with a low end light load, a medium high [do all load] and a just about top end all we really will ever need load.
it's a little odd too that my 2400 load is only .3 grs away [19.3] .
it seems to work in both the 44 and the 45 colt.
back when I was doing some load development in my 44 my 45 and the BIL's 45 [all rossi 92's with 24" octagon barrels]
we started at the very bottom using clay's [run it from low to high] and kept on working upward with slower and slower powders.
we never changed the boolit [alloy/lube size] we just kept on going with more and more gas volume.
eventually we ended up with a low end light load, a medium high [do all load] and a just about top end all we really will ever need load.
Took the rifle apart and loo at what I found!
Follow the cut in the bottom of the barrel. Right at the pointy end you can see a small shiny spot.
This is the top of the magazine tube. See where that spot on the barrel is rubbing?
I filed a small amount off the bottom of the barrel. I will interpose a small amount of RTV silicone there to reduce movement and vibration.
I just can't believe that rubbing wasn't a large part of my vertical groups. Probably part of my 2 group issue too.
Follow the cut in the bottom of the barrel. Right at the pointy end you can see a small shiny spot.
This is the top of the magazine tube. See where that spot on the barrel is rubbing?
I filed a small amount off the bottom of the barrel. I will interpose a small amount of RTV silicone there to reduce movement and vibration.
I just can't believe that rubbing wasn't a large part of my vertical groups. Probably part of my 2 group issue too.