Ok, What's wrong with Lyman moulds?

[fiver]

what's really bad about it is the molds still have the quality waiting there to come out.
having some new cherries cut would really make the difference.

I like many of Lyman's older designs and use a ton of their molds still to this day just because they fit and they function the gun as they should. [model 92 lever guns]
the last mold I ordered from them was also on the same day I purchased lapping compound in anticipation of the molds arrival.
I think they have dropped more designs than they make and they haven't had a new offering since Washington designed the round ball mold for the brown Bess's he captured from the British.
that is a huge part of their problem too, they have no clue that the inside of many of today's guns have changed dimensions.

 

[Ian]

The principle problems with Lyman's moulds produced since about 2006-2007 are this:

1. Undersized. Chronically. This is due to worn cherries and a result of operator error, see next problem...

2. Operator error when boring cavitites on the mill. Operators are not clearing chips frequently enough and are not making enough final passes to ensure that the blocks fully close with no chips caught in-between the block faces. This causes elliptical cavities because the cherry cuts in the faces are not made to full depth (full 1/2 diameter of the cherry).

3. Worn or mis-adjusted boring vise ways. This causes chronic cavity misalignment, sometimes more than .005". Reason is the blocks push in opposite directions under the torque of the cherry, and with failure to clear chips as above, the "finished" cavities do not align when the block's alignment pins, which exacerbates the eccentricity issue.

Here's an exaggerated top view of how the cavities are off, viewed from the top:

(
. )

 

[Lost Dog]

Well gentlemen, I've looked at a couple of the custom mould makers stuff. Pretty impressive. Some talented machinists there to be sure. And might get one someday. I'll have to set up a trust fund to buy one though! Ha!

 

[JWFilips]

Last I looked Al's custom Moulds From NOE are Competitive with the random pick of a New ( inferior ) lyman's
I wouldn't waste my money...especially with Al 's great custormer service....... At least if you have a problem you will be talking to the guy that made the mould!
The big mould companies have slipped in the mud but they don't want you to know! A foolish purchase now -a -days

 

[Lost Dog]

To be brutally honest I have all the moulds I'll ever really need. There's about two oldies I'd like to have, but I'd be lying through my teeth if I said they were "must haves". I'm good and no wife telling me this either.


But thanks for the rapid and numerous responses. I'm sorta "brand loyal" in some ways. Like S&W DA revolvers. Marlin rifles . And 90% of my loading tools are old Lyman and Ideal gear dating back to 1903 up to 1962. Do have some RCBS carbide dies for the .357 and .429 stuff and a RCBS Jr press I bought in 77 so I'm flexible..

 

[quicksylver]

LD ...I understand where you are coming from.

Think of it like pre and post '64 Winchesters.

Incredible and dang near worthless.

 

[fiver]

I have had a few from the mid-70's that were very good rifles. [and I like the XTR series]

but yeah lyman molds and much of their other stuff is just like winchester going from pre to post 64 Winchesters.
it's all bottom line stuff and we have seen the results so many times it's predictable what's gonna happen next.

 

[Lost Dog]

What happens next? Get bought out by Remington and all the tooling goes to a Remington plant and the Lyman people all get fired? Then crank out garbage? Sounds like the "Marlin story" huh? Just speculating on a possible scenario.

 

[Brad]

Lyman may well just piddle along. Who knows?

What I know is that unless they get their act together I won't buy a new mould from them.

 

[fiver]

well I been seeing a lot of griping about their products and their customer service. [and not just here]
it's not just their mold issues but their attitude in general.
they don't carry little parts to make small repairs to their equipment and the quality is becoming marginal.
this worries me because I use a lot of their equipment, like their electronic powder dispenser and case trimmer.

I don't like being told I have to buy a new 300.00 tool when a 50 cent part [they don't have in stock] will repair the one I have.

 

[Ben]

What I know is that unless they get their act together I won't buy a new mould from them.

DITTO ! ! !

Ben

 

[Lost Dog]

Well that's ok. I wouldn't own a new Marlin if you GAVE it to me! So I understand the prejudice of brands that one used to favor, but no longer do. And boy howdy do ya'll got it in for poor 'ol
e Lyman! Sure glad I don't work for them!

 

[Rick]

I don't know if "got it in for Lyman" is the right way to put it. More like folks relating personal experiences with the company and it's products in recent years.

 

[RBHarter]

I like their VLD inside/outside chamfer tool, it came with pocket reamers too.

 

[Lost Dog]

Well Rick, I have not seen one single positive post here yet. Everyone that spoke here stated either dissatisfaction, mistrust, or down right disgust with Lyman. I sure don't call that affection or approval.


Now when I was interviewing witnesses, some were right there and actually did see the incident. Others, who spoke of the incident, were simply repeating what they heard but did not actually witness. I'm curious as to the actual shrunken bullets being possibly exaggerated by "hearsay" rather than personal experience. Just speculating on the matter. Making no accusations to be sure. Sorta like a roomful of people say a man is drunk and better go lay down. Wouldn't it help if there was an odor of alcohol to reinforce that statement? Like I said, just curious.

 

[S Mac]

My personal collection I only have one that casts undersize. But 99% of mine are 20+ years old. My comment that a few duplicates I own are all a little different from each other, same #.

 

[Brad]

Well that's ok. I wouldn't own a new Marlin if you GAVE it to me! So I understand the prejudice of brands that one used to favor, but no longer do. And boy howdy do ya'll got it in for poor 'ol
e Lyman! Sure glad I don't work for them!

Less a case of having it in for Lyman than deciding that a slightly more expensive yet far higher quality mould is a better buy.
Yes, Marlin is a good example. Like Lyman they let quality slip and it will take years to undo the harm done to the brand. It is yet to be seen if they got the message or not.

Here is a prime example.

For a mere $3.51 more I can get a mould that I KNOW will be of excellent quality and that the manufacturer will stand behind 100%.

I call that peace of mind.

 

[Ben]

And boy howdy do ya'll got it in for poor 'ol
e Lyman! Sure glad I don't work for them!

Let's see now.....You tell a tree by the fruit that it bears.

 

[RBHarter]

My Lyman moulds are all older as well . The 454424 single comes in dead on at 454 ,the 454 RB drops 2 at 453 of pure or 1-20 . I have a 431426 that drops at 448 but it was adjusted . The other 5 or so RB singles drop +-.001 the 2 maxi ball moulds seem to fit as intended but the newest is old enough to drink.

I have several die sets with out any complaints and a press but again dinosaurs of 40+ years.

 

[Rick]

Well Rick, I have not seen one single positive post here yet. Everyone that spoke here stated either dissatisfaction, mistrust, or down right disgust with Lyman. I sure don't call that affection or approval.


Now when I was interviewing witnesses, some were right there and actually did see the incident. Others, who spoke of the incident, were simply repeating what they heard but did not actually witness. I'm curious as to the actual shrunken bullets being possibly exaggerated by "hearsay" rather than personal experience. Just speculating on the matter. Making no accusations to be sure. Sorta like a roomful of people say a man is drunk and better go lay down. Wouldn't it help if there was an odor of alcohol to reinforce that statement? Like I said, just curious.

I've been reading the posts of most these members for many years, here and other forums. I think it's a safe enough bet to take these witness's to the DA for a reasonably certain conviction.

Again, it's not being "out for Lyman". Experience is a great teacher and you can't blame people for posting their dissatisfaction.