Savage 340 .30-30 coming - any tips appreciated
- Thread starter Pistolero
- Start date
RicinYakima
High Steppes of Eastern Washington
The biggest difference is that they do not use "V" threads inside the action and outside the barrel and then rely on compression against a shoulder to create the same harmonics. By using the compression nut, the tension is over a greater number of threads. When I played with them years ago, they shot better, for me, with the barrel glass bedded and the action floating. There is a good discussion of how barrel thread forms affect shooting in Harold Vaughn's Rifle Accuracy Facts.
Ian
Notorious member
A Ruger 10-22 with a bull barrel and a nice walnut stock shoots better that way, too.
Sounds like I need to track down that book, thanks for mentioning it.
RicinYakima
High Steppes of Eastern Washington
Mr. Vaughn passed away several years ago: P-38 pilot, designer of the atomic bomb housing and atomic arty round, and great engineer. Book was published by Precision Shooting, now sadly gone also. You will never be sorry to buy a copy.
oscarflytyer
Well-Known Member
interesting stuff. got a 340C recently, in 22 Rem. Bought it w/o much inspection, as it was in a "$500" piece of wood! Just beautiful! And $200. Had to clean up some speckling. And the last 1 1/2" of the bore is questionable. It has been full bbl epoxy bedded. not sure about the action. Rear trigger guard screw is gawd awful and not original, but may be to accurize with the bedding... if it will put 3-5 into 1 1/2" at 100 I will be happy.
Not shot it yet. Put a Weaver mount/rings on it. and JUST bought a set of used Hornady dies
Not shot it yet. Put a Weaver mount/rings on it. and JUST bought a set of used Hornady dies
Bret4207
At the casting bench in the sky. RIP Bret.
I always felt Savage was a totally unrated company, like some others of the last century. The 99, the 250-3000, the 300, putting a 243 and 308, 284, 358 in a lever gun, the M 23 series and M24. No one else was innovating in those areas at that time, not in the US at least. Their barrels at one time were the cream of the crop and they came out with many other innovative designs in 22's and shotguns. The 340 and later 110 series were equally as innovative. What Savage lacked IMO was a good stock designer that had and eye for graceful lines after WW2. Just my 2 cents, but I've shot a lot of Savage products and outside of the wood and the obvious economy steps taken in finish I think most rank right up there with Win and Rem.
My point is, don't under rate those 340's. They may be butt ugly and have a pretty run of the mill trigger, but most I've seen are good shooters. Maybe not benchrest out of the box shooters, but reliable workingmans shooters that will stay with most other brands and designs of the same era. Often they do surprisingly well and those rifles seem to come along pretty regularly with the 340 series. Wrapping myself around that stock was always the hard part for me. I never did warm up to those stocks.
My point is, don't under rate those 340's. They may be butt ugly and have a pretty run of the mill trigger, but most I've seen are good shooters. Maybe not benchrest out of the box shooters, but reliable workingmans shooters that will stay with most other brands and designs of the same era. Often they do surprisingly well and those rifles seem to come along pretty regularly with the 340 series. Wrapping myself around that stock was always the hard part for me. I never did warm up to those stocks.
Pistolero
Well-Known Member
Thanks, Bret. I tend to agree, although I have limited experience. My engineering mind is mightily
impressed when I see a solution which is both cheaper to make and BETTER. I have seen a number
of these features on Savage rifles. For example, the pinned bolt head. It costs less, and eliminates
the need to lap bolt lugs for perfect match. With a rigid bolt, if only one lug touches, at the point of
60,000 psi applied to the bolt face, the bolt WILL flex until the second lug touches and carries load.
This bends the bolt body, putting a hammerblow to the rear of the receiver, ringing the whole action
and barrel, upsetting accuracy.
The Savage bolt head floats in a pin set perpendicular to a line between the two lugs, with
a wavy washer to center. As the pressure rises at firing, at some VERY low pressure, the bolt head
smoothly moves to contact, and is evenly in contact by the time full pressure is applied, avoiding
the hammer blow.....which can't happen anyway because of the bolt pivot point. Cheaper AND
better. Same thing with using the nut on the barrel. Perfect headspace on every single rifle. Likely
more uniform stresses on the threads during firing, too. Better AND cheaper. Look at their
Accutrigger, too. Great solution. A perfectly safe, very light and crisp, and AFFORDABLE trigger.
I love good innovative engineering.
Bill
impressed when I see a solution which is both cheaper to make and BETTER. I have seen a number
of these features on Savage rifles. For example, the pinned bolt head. It costs less, and eliminates
the need to lap bolt lugs for perfect match. With a rigid bolt, if only one lug touches, at the point of
60,000 psi applied to the bolt face, the bolt WILL flex until the second lug touches and carries load.
This bends the bolt body, putting a hammerblow to the rear of the receiver, ringing the whole action
and barrel, upsetting accuracy.
The Savage bolt head floats in a pin set perpendicular to a line between the two lugs, with
a wavy washer to center. As the pressure rises at firing, at some VERY low pressure, the bolt head
smoothly moves to contact, and is evenly in contact by the time full pressure is applied, avoiding
the hammer blow.....which can't happen anyway because of the bolt pivot point. Cheaper AND
better. Same thing with using the nut on the barrel. Perfect headspace on every single rifle. Likely
more uniform stresses on the threads during firing, too. Better AND cheaper. Look at their
Accutrigger, too. Great solution. A perfectly safe, very light and crisp, and AFFORDABLE trigger.
I love good innovative engineering.
Bill
Dick West
Member
Hi. i've owned 4 versions (really 3.5, because one, a .225 Winchester, was missing key parts) of the Sav. 340. First, I love the rifle--a light carbine in a great cast bullet caliber, i've had 3 30-30s in Stevens and Savage brands. I only shot one with cast and it did OK with a peep sight. (I shot Lee 175 flat points--sized to .311-- pushed by Red Dot or 2400.)
The only con--and it's a big one-- is the Sav. 340 trigger/sear. I could never get a reasonable trigger pull without the bolt flying out the rear because the bolt catch/trigger release are linked. Perhaps a competent and more-patient gunsmith than me could overcome this.
That said, If I see another one locally at a good price, I'll probably buy it and try again. I'm a sucker for them.
The only con--and it's a big one-- is the Sav. 340 trigger/sear. I could never get a reasonable trigger pull without the bolt flying out the rear because the bolt catch/trigger release are linked. Perhaps a competent and more-patient gunsmith than me could overcome this.
That said, If I see another one locally at a good price, I'll probably buy it and try again. I'm a sucker for them.
Pistolero
Well-Known Member
Not looking to make a perfect target rifle out of this. I need a reasonably powerful and reasonably
accurate rifle that I wouldn't cry too much if it was stolen, keeping it places where it is handy, but not
necessarily totally secure. Think "truck gun" but not exactly.
I will have some fun developing cast and jacketed loads for it. May make some effort to improve
bedding and trigger, I am a tinkerer. Bedding the bbl and floating the action seems to make
sense, but only after shooting it as is. Thanks for the advice, it makes a bit more sense now -
the repeated comments that "nothing much can be done with the trigger". OTOH, I am an
engineer and don't like being told something mechanical is impossible to improve. Not going
to beat my head against a wall, but will look and think about it. I enjoy learning about new
gun designs.
Thanks to all for their input. Should pick up the rifle in 3-4 days.
Bill
accurate rifle that I wouldn't cry too much if it was stolen, keeping it places where it is handy, but not
necessarily totally secure. Think "truck gun" but not exactly.
I will have some fun developing cast and jacketed loads for it. May make some effort to improve
bedding and trigger, I am a tinkerer. Bedding the bbl and floating the action seems to make
sense, but only after shooting it as is. Thanks for the advice, it makes a bit more sense now -
the repeated comments that "nothing much can be done with the trigger". OTOH, I am an
engineer and don't like being told something mechanical is impossible to improve. Not going
to beat my head against a wall, but will look and think about it. I enjoy learning about new
gun designs.
Thanks to all for their input. Should pick up the rifle in 3-4 days.
Bill
waco
Springfield, Oregon
This is my new go to bullet for my Savage 340 in 30-30 http://noebulletmolds.com/NV/index.php?cPath=30_319&osCsid=2oi40tfl96jqeaddrvkrf7boj1
My rifle was found at a local gun shop covered in surface rust and cob webs inside and out. For $159 out the door, I couldn't leave her there.
I got all of the rust off her and gave her bore a good scrubbing. It was mirror shiny!
It came with a steel Lyman receiver sight and a Dockendorff Front sight.
The magazine was pretty weak and didn't feed reliably so I found new ones at Numrich gun parts https://www.gunpartscorp.com/Manufa...340Series-39746/340LateModel-34019.htm?page=3
This rifle has also shot the Lee 180gr very well to using 28-30gr IMR4064
I shoot the RD bullet with 29gr H4895 using only BLL. It worked great!
I'll post some pics.
Waco
My rifle was found at a local gun shop covered in surface rust and cob webs inside and out. For $159 out the door, I couldn't leave her there.
I got all of the rust off her and gave her bore a good scrubbing. It was mirror shiny!
It came with a steel Lyman receiver sight and a Dockendorff Front sight.
The magazine was pretty weak and didn't feed reliably so I found new ones at Numrich gun parts https://www.gunpartscorp.com/Manufa...340Series-39746/340LateModel-34019.htm?page=3
This rifle has also shot the Lee 180gr very well to using 28-30gr IMR4064
I shoot the RD bullet with 29gr H4895 using only BLL. It worked great!
I'll post some pics.
Waco
RBHarter
West Central AR
Hey this might be helpful . The 312-155 Lee SP was amazing with 4198 . Pointed bullets in a stack magazine are no problem . I was shooting work ups in 3 shot sets with 2 more to verify a good load . Had I shot the 3 best loads into a single group they would have made a 15 shot group under an inch at 100.
waco
Springfield, Oregon
My rifle had trouble feeding this bullet from the magazine.
Pistolero
Well-Known Member
I have the RD 165 mold, never could use it - won't chamber in my Marlin or Win rifles.
I will try it if it will chamber. Also have Lee 150 and 180, multiple other .30 cal molds to try,
including 311291, 311041, some Lovering designs, and one each RCBS and LBT. Lots to
try. I am impressed that many have had good results at full power rather than lower
speed only. Of course, full power in .30-30 isn't like full power in .30-06, so more easily doable
with cast.
Mine has Williams peep, we'll see how my eyes can deal with it. Should be OK, I can
still use peeps generally. May need a bigger diam aperture.
Bill
I will try it if it will chamber. Also have Lee 150 and 180, multiple other .30 cal molds to try,
including 311291, 311041, some Lovering designs, and one each RCBS and LBT. Lots to
try. I am impressed that many have had good results at full power rather than lower
speed only. Of course, full power in .30-30 isn't like full power in .30-06, so more easily doable
with cast.
Mine has Williams peep, we'll see how my eyes can deal with it. Should be OK, I can
still use peeps generally. May need a bigger diam aperture.
Bill
Bill, I have both an actual 165 RD and the NOE version with regular grooves. The NOE was one of the first moulds they produce I believe. The NOE version is just a bit difference on the nose so I trim cases a bit shorter so I can crimp and still have them feed and chamber.
That is a great shooting bullet for me. Had a deer that learned up close all about it.
That is a great shooting bullet for me. Had a deer that learned up close all about it.
fiver
Well-Known Member
a 160-180 gr boolit at 2400 fps is still a 160-180gr boolit at 2400 fps.
don't body shoot grouse with that load unless they are way up in a pine tree and you wanna see feathers float down a canyon for 15-20 minutes.
I decided the pointier loverign design was probably a better choice for deer hunting than the flat point that afternoon.
don't body shoot grouse with that load unless they are way up in a pine tree and you wanna see feathers float down a canyon for 15-20 minutes.
I decided the pointier loverign design was probably a better choice for deer hunting than the flat point that afternoon.
Pistolero
Well-Known Member
2400 fps seems a bit faster than I would expect in .30-30, regardless of projectile material, for a 160-ish gr
bullet.
I just checked Hodgdon's online data, and they show just short of 2400 for LVR powder under a 160 jbullet,
several in the 2300 range, so I guess that isn't entirely out of line. More than I was expecting. I was
thinking more like 2100 or 2000.
Bill
bullet.
I just checked Hodgdon's online data, and they show just short of 2400 for LVR powder under a 160 jbullet,
several in the 2300 range, so I guess that isn't entirely out of line. More than I was expecting. I was
thinking more like 2100 or 2000.
Bill