Using Bullseye in the .30-'06 Without Blowing Yourself Up!

[Outpost75]

Years ago when the Marines started fooling with the "Special Application Sniper Rifle" or SASR using the Cal. .50 Browning cartridge, I went to CT to interview Col. Brophy at Marlin and discuss his experiences with a rebarreled PTRD in Korea. He still had the rifle, and Maj. Bruce M. Wincentsen had asked if we could borrow Brophy's rifle for test. This was done and in one of the Quantico "O" Club dinner conversations the Cal. .30 Guard Cartridge came up and Col. Brophy indicated that the Bullseye charge was carefully developed at Frankford Arsenal; and tested at Springfield Armory to ensure that an inadvertent double charge would not blow up an '03 Springfield.

While a charge of 16 grains of Bullseye is certainly NOT recommended, and will indeed blow the primer and expand the pocket, a sound cartridge case and rifle will hold, and just be frozen shut! Again, not recommended, but as long as you do as Harris says and use a penlight to make a 100% visual inspection of every case for correct powder fill, and to check for any spilled powder in the loading block, you will be OK. Patience and caution....

 

[Brad]

Hey, if it is good enough for Harris it is good enough for me.

As for those 2400 loads not in the manuals, I'm not concerned at all. Looking at the huge number of people using loads in the 16-20 gr range for many 30 cal cartridges there must be something good about it. It just works. I wouldn't be without 2400.

 

[JWFilips]

Not sure if you guys have a copy of these old ones
http://www.jimfilipski.com/forumphotos/IdealHandbook38.pdf
http://www.jimfilipski.com/forumphotos/Lyman Ideal #40-1955.pdf

Save them to your computer as pdfs

I have more but not on my site (yet) & I can't upload those big files directly to this forum.
So I would gladly add more to my site for those that may like to have these old reloading guides but you need to let me know

 

[Brad]

JW, that is awesome. Lots of good info in those old manuals. Lots of data for powders like 2400.

Thanks for posting the links.

 

[JWFilips]

I guess if those folks blew them self up we wouldn't be here to post!

 

[Brad]

That is one way to look at it.

Many hobbies/sports fan cause major injury if you fail to follow some basic procedures and rules. Shooting isn't really any different.

 

[KHornet]

I am another one who by choice will never be out of 2400!

 

[HM8485]

I have used bullseye in rifles sparingly on rare times in ctgs up to and including 06, however I do not like to use it by choice, as double charging is ALWAYS possible. Mostly, I have used it for fire forming cases, K'ing hornet brass in particular, but have used it in formed 8MM from 06, and 243 from 308 brass, and way back some 270 & 35 Whelan, from 06 brass because as stated a little goes a long way, and I am cheap. My rules of thumb are as follows when doing same: All cases must be the same mfg, and preferably the same batch number and or weigh within 1 grain of each other. Regardless of how careful I am I know that a double charge is possible, AND I once blew up a good 06 because of that (I believe)!

Accordingly, after I seat the bullet, but before crimping (if I need to crimp) I weigh each loaded ctg. I expect to be within 1 grain +/- on the loaded case. Any variance above that and I pull the blt, to discover my error. Since adopting this procedure (which takes a lot of extra time), I am much more comfortable that I have minimized the danger potential, and maximized the safety potential. Feel that there is also the potential for increased accuracy with this procedure, but that may be just me. I do this with all of the fast shotgun type powder loads in cast rifle loads. Also, that said, I have made it a point with all cast loads of 2400 and slower powders that fill less than half the case to weigh the loaded case. By half of the loaded case, I mean that I fill the case to the mouth, weigh the powder, and divide the charge by 2. I shoot a lot of Ed Harris' loads for initial testing of new bullets, and have yet to find any problem with his recommendations. Being an old codger and retired allows me the time to be able to use my these procedures. It is kind of like the old saying "measure twice cut once"!

My rule is "When in doubt, dump it out. I do so directly into the weigh pan on my balance beam scale." Electronic scales tend to pick up a tare just sitting there, including expensive one's. I was employed as a scientist for almost 30 years and had analytical scales that measured to the nearest 0.1 of a microgram. I use a Lee powder measure and as long as I keep the hopper at least half full, and my use of the handle consistent it throws within 0 to 1/10th of a grain pretty consistently. I LOOK IN EVERY CASE TOO. I May be slow, but I have been reloading for over 25 years and even I mess up every once in a while. Better safe than sorry. Thanks for the tip about determining case capacity, I never thought of that! Volume is the same, but powder is different, flake, ball, or extruded, and will have different weight!

 

[Charles Graff]

I read Ed's info on using Bullseye in 30-06 rifles some years back and it certainly has worked for me. As the Mexicans say; "Es puro manteca (it is pure lard) which oddly enough means it is pure truth. About 1961, I was given about 80 rounds of USGI Guard Ammo. I really enjoyed firing it in my 03 Springfield. I like the concept and ability to duplicate or approximate the loading.

 

[CZ93X62]

Like others above, I have yet to use Bullseye powder in any rifle case. When Ed Harris says or writes something, I pay attention.

Now, 2400.......LOTS of that in rifle cases.

 

[dannyd]

I have used Unique in about 5,000 300 winchester magnum and 308 Winchester rounds. Don't see why BE would not work. As for me every time I go to the rife range the other people say cast bullets don't work I say "Okay" shoot 50 to 100 and go on my way. Stopped trying to explain years ago.

 

[Wallyl]

I have found one is better off using Red Dot or Promo as they are fluffier and fill the case better. When charging cases keep one block of cases inverted, rotate the case when charging and place in another loading block. When the cases are charged, check the level in them with a flashlight.

 

[JWFilips]

I have Not shot a 30-06 light load but I will tell you that I have shot plenty of 8mm Mauser with 170 gran and 130 grain with 2.5 to 3 .5 Red Dot and Bullseye! You are not gong to blow yourself up unless you are careless and multiple load or stick a bullet in the bore then fire another one!....I do not believe in the "detonation thing" Now light loads with slow powders and you will risk that!
I have shot "low node" ...."light loads under the speed of sound" accurately, for years in all my rifles and I mean all. From 223 Rem to 358 win It is safe ...as safe as your reloading procedure!
The crap that scares me is the "Ultimate Military load" of 13 Grains of Red Dot in Mil cases.... That my friends is scary crap and I have done it once! But never again.... ( But it was accurate as all heck!)

 

[L Ross]

I have Not shot a 30-06 light load but I will tell you that I have shot plenty of 8mm Mauser with 170 gran and 130 grain with 2.5 to 3 .5 Red Dot and Bullseye! You are not gong to blow yourself up unless you are careless and multiple load or stick a bullet in the bore then fire another one!....I do not believe in the "detonation thing" Now light loads with slow powders and you will risk that!
I have shot "low node" ...."light loads under the speed of sound" accurately, for years in all my rifles and I mean all. From 223 Rem to 358 win It is safe ...as safe as your reloading procedure!
The crap that scares me is the "Ultimate Military load" of 13 Grains of Red Dot in Mil cases.... That my friends is scary crap and I have done it once! But never again.... ( But it was accurate as all heck!)

I played with the 13 grains of Red Dot in the .30-06 for awhile. As I recall it gave me 1,630 fps with the RCBS 30-150 flat point gas check bullet and I killed one doe with it. Yes it was accurate indeed. Mostly I use 2400 and 4227 today.

 

[USSR]

I played with the 13 grains of Red Dot in the .30-06 for awhile. As I recall it gave me 1,630 fps with the RCBS 30-150 flat point gas check bullet and I killed one doe with it. Yes it was accurate indeed. Mostly I use 2400 and 4227 today.

I just loaded up some .30-06 with 11 and 12 grains of Red Dot using a RCBS 150gr non-gas checked bullet. Hopefully the velocity will be somewhere between 1400 and 1500 fps. Agree that Red Dot is a better powder for this purpose than Bullseye.

Don

 

[JWFilips]

Watch Your pressure! I do not feel that it is safe! Those miracle loads are too hot for my liking!
You can cut them back by 2/3rds and put bullets in the same hole! Subsonic!

 

[RBHarter]

I woke up this morning and cobbled some 25-06' together , 257312(?) over 9.0 Unique . The rifle has never had a cast bullet in it and I hadn't actually fired it since 1982 , but Dad loved it . Anyway , soft rest , 50 yd dollar sized groups . The more I shot the closer together the shots got . The rifle doesn't like the pointed 25-80 Herters , 257388 .
In any case I've never had best results with the 10.0 Unique wonder load , usually 5-6 in 30-30 , 8-9 in 06' , 45-70 and 264 WM liked 12 gr .

 

[L Ross]

Watch Your pressure! I do not feel that it is safe! Those miracle loads are too hot for my liking!
You can cut them back by 2/3rds and put bullets in the same hole! Subsonic!

But can you break the left front leg, shoot through a rib, punch the lung, the heart, the off side lung, break the last rib on the far side and exit with subsonic?

 

[Missionary]

And sometimes those very quiet subsonic shots are the very reason to have a few loaded up and at hand. Most neighbors never need to know what is going on in my backyard.

 

[MW65]

That bullseye load is a lot of fun! Use it in 30-06, 7.62x54R, 303Br, and more.... Don't know what it'll do to a deer, but I know what it does to steel silhouettes out at 100yds.