Cleaning fouling on some old war rifles
- Thread starter Bret4207
- Start date
oscarflytyer
Well-Known Member
I am a big Ed's Red fan. It has worked wonders for me with both lead and copper. I add the Lanolin. I make it by the gallon and share. All I use anymore.
Cleaned the leaded CVA barrel tonite, chore boy brush, #9, eds red and brake cleaner. Pretty clean but bore scope says nope. Need to get some 30 cal brushes, mine are worn out. IIRC, vinegar and ammonia will get the lead out but is hard on steel barrels. SS not so much.
Last edited:
fiver
Well-Known Member
Like Tomme i use the foaming bore cleaners.
put the muzzle down on a bundled up rag and push the nozzle down into the chambers throat and give it a squirt.
if the rifle is very badly coppered up the foam will come out blue instantly.
i lean the rifle barrel down and lit it sit while i go do something else.
come back and patch it out.
push a brush then an oiled patch or two through it.
then i give it a wet patch of sweets and a couple minutes to work.
same dry then wet patch.
if the sweets comes out blue it tells me i got more copper in there and i do the soak thing again with the foam if i know it's a rifle that's got a lot of goop in it.
if it's one of mine that i know the history on [IE 100-500rds.] i generally just do the foam cleaner, oil it just enough, and put it away.
put the muzzle down on a bundled up rag and push the nozzle down into the chambers throat and give it a squirt.
if the rifle is very badly coppered up the foam will come out blue instantly.
i lean the rifle barrel down and lit it sit while i go do something else.
come back and patch it out.
push a brush then an oiled patch or two through it.
then i give it a wet patch of sweets and a couple minutes to work.
same dry then wet patch.
if the sweets comes out blue it tells me i got more copper in there and i do the soak thing again with the foam if i know it's a rifle that's got a lot of goop in it.
if it's one of mine that i know the history on [IE 100-500rds.] i generally just do the foam cleaner, oil it just enough, and put it away.
RBHarter
West Central AR
It doesn't matter what you use if it's different than what has been used previously it will lift gobs of carbon and what ever is layered in it .........until it build it's own flavor of hardened carbon glue .
It's like changing oil brands in your car and washing the old scale out with the new/different detergents. You don't see much going from say Castrol to Penzoil but go the other way and it's insta black in about 100 miles.
I've been happy most of the time with Kroil . For what it's worth if Hoppes and/or WD won't break it out an overnight soak in Kroil will get stuff moving.
Bendix and Lycoming recommend Hoppes #9 as injector cleaner to remove carbon and tetraethyl lead deposits . Those can be cooked on at 300° so there's that .
I used an ultrasonic cleaner for a badly fouled 9mm barrel . The first 20 minute go curled up fouling that looked a little like the clay that cracks and curled up as it gets dry on a flat and brushed out looking about the same . The second go wasn't as big but just as dramatic. Then I scrubbed out carbon some more. It still has some super fine impacted copper in the push side of the lands . I wanted to build a 4×4 pan or a 3" tube that a whole barreled action could be dropped in and cleaned that way .
It's like changing oil brands in your car and washing the old scale out with the new/different detergents. You don't see much going from say Castrol to Penzoil but go the other way and it's insta black in about 100 miles.
I've been happy most of the time with Kroil . For what it's worth if Hoppes and/or WD won't break it out an overnight soak in Kroil will get stuff moving.
Bendix and Lycoming recommend Hoppes #9 as injector cleaner to remove carbon and tetraethyl lead deposits . Those can be cooked on at 300° so there's that .
I used an ultrasonic cleaner for a badly fouled 9mm barrel . The first 20 minute go curled up fouling that looked a little like the clay that cracks and curled up as it gets dry on a flat and brushed out looking about the same . The second go wasn't as big but just as dramatic. Then I scrubbed out carbon some more. It still has some super fine impacted copper in the push side of the lands . I wanted to build a 4×4 pan or a 3" tube that a whole barreled action could be dropped in and cleaned that way .
Petrol & Powder
Well-Known Member
ATF [automatic transmission fluid] is essentially 10 weight oil with lots of detergents and friction modifiers added. The red dye is mostly a marker. Like most hydraulic fluids, it is designed to work over a large temperature range and flow through ports, spool valves, check valves, etc.
There’s always been some sort of “magic” associated with ATF (likely due to the red color and all the different types) but it’s not all that mysterious. Take away all the extra stuff in there and it’s basically 10 weight oil.
ATF is a good penetrating oil and ATF + Kerosene is probably as good as any other penetrating oil you can buy.
CWLONGSHOT
Well-Known Member
I used to keep a baby jar in my bullseye box and soak my HiStandard and Smith41 Compensators in to de solve the coating deposited upon them. It fell off like mud.
CW
Bret4207
At the casting bench in the sky. RIP Bret.
Lots of interesting thoughts here. I use something like Eds Red for a lot of mechanical work. Might give that a try first and with Hoppes. Worth it to use Hoppes just for the perfume!! I think I'm going to have to get some new bore brushes though. Even my old stainless ones are pretty trashed! Ah well, time to get back in Brownells good graces I suppose!
Petrol & Powder
Well-Known Member
I’ll add this and shut up.
There are countless solvents that include ammonia in the formula. Ammonia attacks copper which is precisely why it is used to help remove copper fouling. There’s no great secret alchemy at work here, the ammonia simply helps to dissolve the copper fouling so that it can be removed from the bore. The foaming solvents, the “special” formulas, the super high-priced Tinker-Bell Fairy piss products are all just marketing gimmicks.
If you have a barrel bore that is pitted from rust and/or corrosion; there is no magic elixir that will put metal back where metal is missing. The best you can hope for is to clean up what you have. You can work to remove copper fouling, lead fouling, carbon deposits, rust, and whatever else is in there but there is no putting metal back where metal is gone. This doesn’t mean all is lost, but you have to have realistic expectations.
There are countless solvents that include ammonia in the formula. Ammonia attacks copper which is precisely why it is used to help remove copper fouling. There’s no great secret alchemy at work here, the ammonia simply helps to dissolve the copper fouling so that it can be removed from the bore. The foaming solvents, the “special” formulas, the super high-priced Tinker-Bell Fairy piss products are all just marketing gimmicks.
If you have a barrel bore that is pitted from rust and/or corrosion; there is no magic elixir that will put metal back where metal is missing. The best you can hope for is to clean up what you have. You can work to remove copper fouling, lead fouling, carbon deposits, rust, and whatever else is in there but there is no putting metal back where metal is gone. This doesn’t mean all is lost, but you have to have realistic expectations.
JWFilips
Well-Known Member
When you get it clean this far.....Start shooting Powder coated bullets and don't clean again! You will be surprised at how it fills the pits!
I have done this with 3 of my milsurps ( one, the 1916 Spanish was considered junk! Now it shoots like a target rifle!
What is it that is filling the pits, or is that still a mystery?
PC residue? Carbon, ironed over by the PC'd bullet?
So far, Ive only shot PC in a 357 rifle with a pristine bore, right from the factory. This is intriguing to me, because 1) I can't personally detect any residue being left by the PC (but it may well be doing it) and 2) my brother brought back my 7x57 dies, so now I have (almost) no excuse to not shoot the Rolling Block he gave me. The bore in that is not all that pretty.
richhodg66
Well-Known Member
Sweets will pit the bore. I wouldn't use it. Hoppes or Ed's Red, let it soak a long time then bronze brushes, repeat as needed.
I wonder...
What would an ultrasonic cleaner, long enough for a barreled action, do to old, neglected bores or leaded bores?
Fortunately, I haven't had one lead up very badly in many years, but I remember some some factory reloads in the eighties, which would completely obscure the rifling in a couple of my revolvers after very few rounds. Spent the rest of the weekend mining lead with a Lewis lead remover and a "lead remover cloth." That got very old, very quickly.
What would an ultrasonic cleaner, long enough for a barreled action, do to old, neglected bores or leaded bores?
Fortunately, I haven't had one lead up very badly in many years, but I remember some some factory reloads in the eighties, which would completely obscure the rifling in a couple of my revolvers after very few rounds. Spent the rest of the weekend mining lead with a Lewis lead remover and a "lead remover cloth." That got very old, very quickly.
Bret4207
At the casting bench in the sky. RIP Bret.
Huh, I figured that it was a good jacket fouling remover and thats what I'm sure I see in the '03 especially. I'll use caution before I try it, if I need to at all!