CW's favorite handgun

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obssd1958

Well-Known Member
I have a Ruger NMBH convertible in 10mm/40 S&W. I have scoured the internet for a couple of years, looking for the 38-40 cylinder. I've seen a couple for sale, but always a day or two late (they go fast!). I found Borchardt Corp., which does Ruger cylinders, and called them about the 38-40. They sent me paperwork detailing which measurements they needed from my existing cylinders, and how to properly measure them, which I sent back to them with all of the required measurements. That was the first of this year. When I called them in June or July, they didn't have any record of my order. Not sure where it went astray, but I resubmitted the info, and I'm currently waiting for them to get to my cylinder.
By the way, no money has changed hands yet.
 
CWLONGSHOT

CWLONGSHOT

Well-Known Member
The Buckeye was a Ruger Blackhawk 38/40 with 10mm cyl. 40 would be a natural addition.

I feel extra cyl is fine. I mean why mot it works and folks have allot if these calibers. But to chamber it specifically or ONLY for one is where I draw the line.

CW
 
L Ross

L Ross

Well-Known Member
I wish I had a .40 S&W cylinder for my Uberti SAA .38 w.c.f. People that sell brass for reloading don't even pick up .40 S&W. I could use the same 180 grain mould, probably 4.5 gr. of Bullseye for a fun cheap shooting revolver. But I fear I'd have to get a .357 cylinder and have it re-cut and just thinking about it make my butt tired. That and I have about 600 sticks of .38-40.
 
fiver

fiver

Well-Known Member
it won't be too long till the regret of not picking up that 40 brass sets in.
i used to find it here real frequently, it was for a number of years about 40% the amount of 9mm. so much so i spent the money to buy a swage set to make 44 mag bullets from the stuff.
the last couple i don't hardly even see it laying around even when there's a big pile of cases to be had.
 
Tomme boy

Tomme boy

Well-Known Member
I don't see much of it either anymore. But it still goes into the scrap bucket. Its one cartridge I will not own even if someone gave me one
 
Tomme boy

Tomme boy

Well-Known Member
At the start of the bat flu, Springfield sold my dealer ALL of their 40 cal ammo. They stopped getting in 40cal guns as they were not selling them at that time. They sold the ammo under cost to get rid of it. They recently have since started to import them again. But not in any 1911 they do
 
TXTad

TXTad

Active Member
When the Marshal service switched from .40 to 9mm, my Marshal buddy gave me a good deal a large number of OEM Glock magazines for the G22. There were a number of unopened standard capacity magazines and a number of 'stendos that he'd only used a little bit. He thought he had a bunch of their duty ammo that he was going to give me, but that never happened.

I have no intention of selling my .40s, so more for the stash. I'm not buying any new ones, though. Well, not planning on it.
 
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Petrol & Powder

Well-Known Member
The 40 S&W is not dying off by any stretch of the imagination, but I believe its glory days are over.

The 45 ACP and the 9mm Luger cartridges were both introduced in the early 1900’s and about 3 years apart (1905 and 1902 respectively). While the 40 S&W proved to be popular, it occupied a space between two immensely popular cartridges, the 45 ACP & 9mm Parabellum. That’s tough competition.

The diameters of the 9mm and 45 ACP are roughly 35 caliber and 45 caliber (give or take a little), which puts the midpoint right at 40 caliber. On paper, the 40 S&W looks like the sweet spot in that middle ground. However, the 9mm Luger and 45 ACP operate under entirely different methods. One being a high-pressure cartridge with relatively low bullet weight and the other being a low-pressure cartridge with a bullet of greater mass. In fact, using 115 grain and 230 grain bullets as yardsticks, the typical 45 ACP projectile is exactly twice as heavy as the typical 9mm bullet.

At first glance the 40 S&W appears to sit right between the 9mm and 45 ACP, but the data is misleading. Some would say the 40 S&W projectile is faster than the 45 ACP and heavier than the 9mm while others would say the 40 S&W is slower than the 9mm and lighter than the 45 ACP!

Ultimately, the gap between the 9mm Parabellum and the 45 ACP wasn’t nearly as great as it seemed, or at least not big enough to make room for a third serious competitor in that arena.
 
TXTad

TXTad

Active Member
Petrol & Powder said:
The 40 S&W is not dying off by any stretch of the imagination, but I believe its glory days are over.

The 45 ACP and the 9mm Luger cartridges were both introduced in the early 1900’s and about 3 years apart (1905 and 1902 respectively). While the 40 S&W proved to be popular, it occupied a space between two immensely popular cartridges, the 45 ACP & 9mm Parabellum. That’s tough competition.

The diameters of the 9mm and 45 ACP are roughly 35 caliber and 45 caliber (give or take a little), which puts the midpoint right at 40 caliber. On paper, the 40 S&W looks like the sweet spot in that middle ground. However, the 9mm Luger and 45 ACP operate under entirely different methods. One being a high-pressure cartridge with relatively low bullet weight and the other being a low-pressure cartridge with a bullet of greater mass. In fact, using 115 grain and 230 grain bullets as yardsticks, the typical 45 ACP projectile is exactly twice as heavy as the typical 9mm bullet.

At first glance the 40 S&W appears to sit right between the 9mm and 45 ACP, but the data is misleading. Some would say the 40 S&W projectile is faster than the 45 ACP and heavier than the 9mm while others would say the 40 S&W is slower than the 9mm and lighter than the 45 ACP!

Ultimately, the gap between the 9mm Parabellum and the 45 ACP wasn’t nearly as great as it seemed, or at least not big enough to make room for a third serious competitor in that arena.
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That's a very good analysis, and I especially like, "Some would say the 40 S&W projectile is faster than the 45 ACP and heavier than the 9mm while others would say the 40 S&W is slower than the 9mm and lighter than the 45 ACP!"

I think another part of the problem with .40 is not unlike what happened to .41 Magnum, which is that 9mm is just about the most that an average, non-shooter can handle. Most police officers, especially in some area, are just about the oppose of gun people.
 
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Petrol & Powder

Well-Known Member
TXTad said:
I think another part of the problem with .40 is not unlike what happened to .41 Magnum, which is that 9mm is just about the most that an average, non-shooter can handle. Most police officers, especially in some area, are just about the oppose of gun people.
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I'm not sure I completely agree with that, although there is some reality to part of that.

I think what happened was the increase in performance from the 9mm to the 40 S&W just wasn’t great enough to justify the switch, particularly when correct 9mm loadings are applied to the equation. It took about 30 years for the players to realize this but like all dogma, beliefs die slowly.

A while cops aren’t necessarily “gun people”, a 40 S&W isn’t a difficult cartridge to master. The recoil of a 40 S&W isn’t significantly more than a 125gr +P 9mm load. I’ve seen a few small statured people that struggled with pistols chambered for 40 S&W, but truth be told, they struggled with similar pistols chambered in 9mm. You could probably give those people a .22 and they would still struggle. Likewise, I’ve seen very small woman that could operate a 1911 in 45 ACP with extreme skill. It’s popular to attribute the LE switch back to 9mm from 40 S&W on poor shooters but the reality doesn’t bear that out. The reality is that the increased performance of the 40 S&W just isn’t that significant in the real world.

Yes, the 40 S&W has a bullet with a larger diameter than a 9mm and yes that bullet is heavier, but the 9mm is no slouch. The American attitude that bigger is always better is very prevalent but not always true.

As for the 41 Magnum, a couple of factors hurt the acceptance of that cartridge. The first was the two loadings, one very appropriate for LE (210 grain bullet and about 900 fps) and another that got lumped into the assessment of the cartridge in general. The fact that the guns were built on the N-frames gave little incentive in terms of overall size and weight of the revolver and the nail in the coffin was the word “Magnum” in the cartridge name (Yes, there were politically correct morons back then too).

In any event, the gap between the 9mm Parabellum and the 45 ACP appears large, but it clearly wasn’t large enough to make room for a third big player in the sandbox. It’s not that the 40 S&W is bad (it clearly is not) it’s that the 40 S&W just isn’t as awesome as originally touted.
 
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CZ93X62

CZ93X62

Official forum enigma
I love the 40 S&W, make no mistake. But if American ammo companies loaded the 9mm to European specs, the 40 S&W might never have been conceived. Add in that miserable FBI-pimped 147 grain JHP sub-sonic ammo post-Miami.......there was a thirst for something that worked, and the 40 works. It's a 10mm Short & Weak, but it works.
 
CWLONGSHOT

CWLONGSHOT

Well-Known Member
fiver said:
bout a hundred years behind.
hard to work around the 4 trillion guns already sitting in the closet especially with something that only does the same thing.
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Universally understood... BUT that means exactly what to factual cartridge preformance? Speaking within context of ballistics 9vs40vs45...
 
Bret4207

Bret4207

At the casting bench in the sky. RIP Bret.
Har! Some here would "never own a 40" and I can think of no reason to own a 9mm!!! If I ever do it will be solely because it's an old Browning Hi Power, not because the 9mm is anything special. I got a pretty bad taste in my mouth during the time we had to use that 147 gr sub sonic FBI garbage load, an idea I should have expected to be trash considering where it came from. What a ridiculous idea- "Lets reinvent the 38 Special RN and give to people who may need to defend themselves with it!!!" I don't see anything wrong with the 40 S+W, anymore than there was anything "wrong" with the old 38-40. I suppose if you are a spray and pray type the 9 might appeal but that's about it in my book.

What really baffles me is the 9mm lovers that scoff at the 380! Where do you draw the line?!!!
 
Winelover

Winelover

North Central Arkansas
Bret4207 said:
Har! Some here would "never own a 40" and I can think of no reason to own a 9mm!!! If I ever do it will be solely because it's an old Browning Hi Power, not because the 9mm is anything special. I got a pretty bad taste in my mouth during the time we had to use that 147 gr sub sonic FBI garbage load, an idea I should have expected to be trash considering where it came from. What a ridiculous idea- "Lets reinvent the 38 Special RN and give to people who may need to defend themselves with it!!!" I don't see anything wrong with the 40 S+W, anymore than there was anything "wrong" with the old 38-40. I suppose if you are a spray and pray type the 9 might appeal but that's about it in my book.

What really baffles me is the 9mm lovers that scoff at the 380! Where do you draw the line?!!!
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Velocity and bullet weight. The nine starts where the .380 ends.
 
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