I've never seen a barrel like this.
- Thread starter Rockydoc
- Start date
Ian
Notorious member
That's what happened with my AR-45. It delivered shotgun patterns with everything I tried except jax and Berry's plated, even PC lead at first. After I resigned myself to it just not being a cast shooter I ended up shooting a bunch of PC through it checking magazines, holding off cases of marauding bean and soda cans, and punishing gongs at handgun ranges. Then I took it along to a friend's range for a shooting day and tried it offhand at the 6" 100' yard gong after saying it wasn't accurate enough for that. Clang. Hmmph. Clang. Clang. Hmmm? I'll be darned. We all took turns and ran several boxes of PC handloads through it to good effect. I haven't cleaned the barrel since but continue to shoot the bejeebers out of it and clean the rest and it's a solid 2-3 MOA shooter.
My nicer guns don't need the buildup and get cleaned after shooting PC just to keep them from getting etched. I've found through multiple tests that a clean, cold bore puts the first dead center of the group while a cold, fouled bore will throw the first one to the edge or just out of the group, so cleaning after shooting is doubly good.
My nicer guns don't need the buildup and get cleaned after shooting PC just to keep them from getting etched. I've found through multiple tests that a clean, cold bore puts the first dead center of the group while a cold, fouled bore will throw the first one to the edge or just out of the group, so cleaning after shooting is doubly good.
fiver
Well-Known Member
I had a little Ruger 223 walk around varmint rig [I never should have got rid of] that was a pain for the first little while.
I finally sat down with it and a bunch of ammo and decided I was just gonna burn the barrel out and get rid of the thing.
as I sat there shooting a round about every 10 seconds for the first 15 minutes I noticed the center of the target was starting to look a bit ragged.... hmm.
I hung a new target and started to simply burn the little orange dot out of the center,, 50 rounds later I had a hole that was under an inch, with a few ragged edges from the 'fliers'.
that thing was a damn good shooter after that, and I even took a pretty decent little Buck with it.
I'd be scared to death to look down that throat,,, but I guess that's what it needed.
I finally sat down with it and a bunch of ammo and decided I was just gonna burn the barrel out and get rid of the thing.
as I sat there shooting a round about every 10 seconds for the first 15 minutes I noticed the center of the target was starting to look a bit ragged.... hmm.
I hung a new target and started to simply burn the little orange dot out of the center,, 50 rounds later I had a hole that was under an inch, with a few ragged edges from the 'fliers'.
that thing was a damn good shooter after that, and I even took a pretty decent little Buck with it.
I'd be scared to death to look down that throat,,, but I guess that's what it needed.
RicinYakima
High Steppes of Eastern Washington
The simple solution is to wipe the bore with Lee Liquid Alox and never clean it again. That has worked for at least 30 years for cast bullet shooters with rough bores.
L Ross
Well-Known Member
Huh, never heard that before. Hanging out with Ric is a good thing.
Bret4207
At the casting bench in the sky. RIP Bret.
Yeah, but they sure did put the stick to those 9mm loads that were supposed to be 1350fps that were really only 1050 or so!
RBHarter
West Central AR
The only pearls I have , are work the load for groups , use the chrono to find out what you NEED to know , and don't mess with something that's working .
That said sometimes a barrel is improved by "cleaning it up" and sometimes cleaning it up takes a minor defect and turns it into a huge flaw .
That said sometimes a barrel is improved by "cleaning it up" and sometimes cleaning it up takes a minor defect and turns it into a huge flaw .
Bret4207
At the casting bench in the sky. RIP Bret.
Yup. Read that recommendation back on the old Shooters.com board 20 some years back. It works a lot of the time. Same with some guns needing "seasoning" by shooting a mess of ammo through it. 22's are like that a lot. Clean the barrel and it shoots kind of wild. Put 50 rounds through it and it settles down. Some guns NEED to be cleaned though. Milsurps with massive jacket fouling never have shot cast well for me. Get it down to pretty much bare steel and then start shooting. Seems to work most of the time.
L Ross
Well-Known Member
I can't stand all of the little crumbs lying in the bottom of my good .22's barrels. So a .22 cotton patch, soaked in Ed's Red, on a .17 caliber jag and they are gone and the first shot the next time hits the target. Now, my targets are life size prairie dogs shot off hand at 80 yards so I cannot claim no change of impact for a itty bitty tiny X ring at 50 meters.
I have a friend and gunsmith who has a bore scope and he has shown me a pattern of pitting and a touch of throat erosion that corresponds to .22 fouling's position in a bore. He takes a Q-Tip and cuts the cotton swab off, places it in the chamber and "shoots" it through the barrel with compressed air after each use. He also has his photo next to the phrase ANAL in the dictionary. Not a bad thing for a guy who can think in tenths of thousandths.
CZ93X62
Official forum enigma
The chronograph's value as a polygraph for ammomakers cannot be denied. I kinda forgot about that.
CWLONGSHOT
Well-Known Member
Well as I said. Proper use. Most dont read directions. Most dont know ambient light, distance and the caliber ALL can change results allot!
I have been lost testing that MP 297 Ruger Only bullet and Unique Powder. Starting @ 6g... But testing at two different ranges. First loads where from a 10" Contender. (More margin for error) 675fps was avg. the 7.5" BHwk was 635/40fps. Moving to my regular range barely saw 600 fps... As I went to one range on a Tuesday and My range on Wed & Sat I was amazed the difference! I started measuring and setting at 15' things was better but I couldnt control light. My range topped out 1000 fps while the steel range showed more what I expected for recoil in hand 875 fps. Same chrono good new battery.
I have two chronos and have tested both side by side. My cheapo was 129$ new and my fancy was 600$ both read close enough when tested to call good.
CW
I have been lost testing that MP 297 Ruger Only bullet and Unique Powder. Starting @ 6g... But testing at two different ranges. First loads where from a 10" Contender. (More margin for error) 675fps was avg. the 7.5" BHwk was 635/40fps. Moving to my regular range barely saw 600 fps... As I went to one range on a Tuesday and My range on Wed & Sat I was amazed the difference! I started measuring and setting at 15' things was better but I couldnt control light. My range topped out 1000 fps while the steel range showed more what I expected for recoil in hand 875 fps. Same chrono good new battery.
I have two chronos and have tested both side by side. My cheapo was 129$ new and my fancy was 600$ both read close enough when tested to call good.
CW
Rockydoc
Well-Known Member
It counts for me.i'm guessing that minute of deer don't count?
L Ross
Well-Known Member
Which is why I bought the Oehler 35P with the three screen set up. I trust the numbers that result from that unit. The kit also came with diffusers.
Bret4207
At the casting bench in the sky. RIP Bret.
Agree, powder residue can gather moisture and cause issues. I guess we have to define "cleaning". For me, cleaning is going at it with brushes, chemicals and numerous patches to get down to pretty much bare metal. To my mind, thats not the same as giving the bore a shot of Breakfree or fogging oil or even WD40. That's not cleaning, that's corrosion protection and is something different in my opinion.
L Ross
Well-Known Member
The only timeI really deep clean a gun is when I shoot BP through it. The patches have to come out nearly perfectly white before I am satisfied. Also when I buy a used gun I try to deep clean the barrel. I thought Mil Surps were bad until I tried to de-copper an 86 Winchester in .33 w.c.f.
My .22's get a patch of Ed's Red pushed through and call it good. The exterior gets a good wipe down with an old sock soaked in Ballistol, even the stainless, aluminum, wood, and plastic.
When I come in from a cast bullet center fire session I do the same thing, although I usually flip the patch over, run it through a second time, and finish with a dry patch. My Ed's has lanolin in it. The exterior gets the Ballistol sock.
I want to clean the Hi-Power but I also want to see what the barrel looks like after 100-200 rounds of cast through it. I'll clean the barrel over a white paper towel with a bronze brush to see if I get any lead flakes. The first time I shot it with cast about 3/4 years ago, I immediately pulled it down, looked through the barrel, then pushed a patch on a jag and got nothing after about 25 rounds. Sized .357", Ben's Red and BLL.
RicinYakima
High Steppes of Eastern Washington
Yes, I consider this "maintenance" and not cleaning. And that is what I do, one damp patch of Ed's Red and one dry patch. BArrels are cleaned down to bare metal only once, when I first get them to have a base to start with.
Rockydoc
Well-Known Member
The late Onondaga (I don't know if he was on this forum or not but he was on CBA and Boolits) had a bore polishing scheme whereby he recommended using a tight bore snake and TURTLE WAX CHROME POLISH run through the bore a hundred times or so. I have done that to a couple of my barrels. I don't recall if it improved accuracy but it sure made the bore look smoother.
I might do that to this bore, maybe not. I don't consider this bore to be broke. It just has character. It shoots patterns with some loads and shoots "minute of deer neck" with others. I am not through with load development with this gun. I am just about through with my supply of primers with which to do the job.
I might do that to this bore, maybe not. I don't consider this bore to be broke. It just has character. It shoots patterns with some loads and shoots "minute of deer neck" with others. I am not through with load development with this gun. I am just about through with my supply of primers with which to do the job.