Ladle question

[Brad]

I have a question for you ladle casters.
Do you pour with the spout against the sprue plate or let the lead fall a bit? How long do you keep pouring into a cavity after it is full? How much of a sprue do you leave?

I'm using a #2 Rowell and find it helps if I let the lead fall an inch or so into the mould. I also like to start pouring before the stream is going into a cavity. I like to pour for a second or two after cavity is full, time depends on mould, and pour a smallish sprue.
I let the sprue just barely set the. Cut it, let mould sit for a 5 count, then dump bullets. This isn't set in stone as the mould temp determines everything. I keep an eye on how the bullets look after dropping from the mould and adjust times where needed.

 

[Rick]

I don't hold the ladle against the sprue plate. First I use a Rowell too and there is no spout such as on the RCBS ladle and I don't think it's needed. I pour until the alloy starts flowing over the side of the mold & move on to the next cavity and next cavity with the alloy still flowing over the sprue plate, then sweep back pouring across all the cavities. It guarantees all bases are filled out and keeps the sprue plate itself properly heated.

I don't do any sort of count, I watch the sprue puddle and when it freezes over I open the sprue plate with a gloved hand. It's easy enough to keep an eye on mold & sprue temps & either pause or speed up to keep temps uniform. I also don't get a very thick sprue puddle because the sprue plate is hot enough and excess spills off the side. If you are getting a thick sprue puddle the plate isn't hot enough causing both the puddle and the bullet bases to freeze early.

 

[Brad]

Like you I pour lots of lead over the plate. I start pouring before I get to cavity one and let the excess from each successive cavity flow back over the ones already filled. The sprue puddle tends to be very shallow due to the heat in the plate. I figure that if I have lots of lead stickng to the mould or the plate then I'm not hot enough.
I tend to wait after opening the plate because I find it reduces the risk of tearng bands and on the MP hollow point moulds I find it releases bullets from the cavities easier that way.

Amazing how each mould has specific needs. Much of this is based on observation and finding what the mould wants.

 

[Bret4207]

Both. I use a Lyman and a Rowell, the smallest one, and a ho'made ladle. The Lyman requires the most variation depending on what the mould wants. I have a 358156 that requires a drop and several others that like spout to sprue plate contact and even more that don't care one way or the other. In most cases I run extra over the sprue plate every cast, but not always. If the mould retains heat well, like with my brass Yankee, a tiny sprue puddle is adequate. Most of my Lee's like an generous sprue puddle.

 

[waco]

I have a couple of ladles. One is an RCBS and the other a Lyman. I have never used them. Is there any advantage to using a ladle as opposed to a bottom pour? Just more traditional maybe? I thought I heard once some guys like ladle pouring a bigger bullet. A 45-70 perhaps. I should buy a small Lee pot and give it a try. My new three cavity 45-70 mold is on the way from Tom.

 

[358156hp]

My results with a ladle have been greater weight consistency, and better fillout in some moulds. I really don't have a straight answer for Brads question because I use both styles of pouring, however I don't use a large ladle like Brad and Rick do. I use an older RCBS ladle. Some of my moulds have seemed to prefer a little bit of initial alloy pressure by spout contact, and some don't. My loosey-goosey H&G 68 is a perfect example. It will fin like crazy if I pressure cast in any manner. I do use the same basic technique mentioned above of allowing the ladle to drain over the sprue holes after filling the cavities. I feel it keeps the base of the bullet molten longer, allowing more air to escape before the sprue freezes. I suspect this contributes greatly to weight consistency, but will never be able to prove it. I would use my Rowell ladle for casting, but it's not left-hand friendly at all, so it only gets used for pouring ingots.

 

[fiver]

when I learned to cast the ladle was the only option I had available.
I quickly learned the twist to fill method and it still produces some very, very good boolits.
I have also learned which of my molds will take a pressure pour and which ones do just fine from the bottom pour.
I have a 1 cavity 8mm/32win ideal mold that will pour boolits almost within the .01 range over a run when I pressure pour from my 10lb lee if I keep the pot topped off..
my rcbs 22 mold will fin in every vent line if I try to put any pressure on it, I have to slow down the fill rate from the 20 lb lee to nearly a dribble and keep a good sprue puddle to make good sharp boolits with it.

 

[358156hp]

I have to agree with you. It's pretty much like working with the guns. If the mould doesn't like what you're doing with it, it will certainly let you know in no uncertain terms. I just picked up a new prima donna last week. It will submit, it just needs to accept this fact. My 4 cavity SAECO was quite the challenge at first. It turns out that it demands at least slight pressure casting, until it get to its optimal temperature. Then it starts whiskering. When the whiskers start, I need to back off the pressure casting, and after a little bit it will start dropping bullets like a hailstorm. If it gets hot, all I have to do is cool the sprue plate on a wet microfiber covered car wash sponge between casts. Honestly, I need more moulds like this one. I do feel the ladle helps me figure these situations out quicker because it requires me to pay strict attention to everything I see. Maybe that's the secret to the whole thing.

 

[Bret4207]

I have a couple of ladles. One is an RCBS and the other a Lyman. I have never used them. Is there any advantage to using a ladle as opposed to a bottom pour? Just more traditional maybe? I thought I heard once some guys like ladle pouring a bigger bullet. A 45-70 perhaps. I should buy a small Lee pot and give it a try. My new three cavity 45-70 mold is on the way from Tom.

I started out with ladles back in the late 70's. A BP was just a dream back then. Now I've got a couple SAECO pots and I'm still pretty much a ladle guy. A ladle is just more versatile, lots faster and prone to way less quirks and quarks than a BP for me. Maybe if I had a great big BP it would be different, but trying to line up the holes is a giant sized pain for me.

 

[358156hp]

I can't bottom pour worth a lick.

 

[Brad]

I spent almost 30 years using a bottom pour then a couple guys here convinced me a ladle was the way to go. They were right. Quality went up and speed didn't suffer a bit.
What I need now is a 40 pound ladle only pot.

 

[fiver]

well your in luck, magma makes such a critter.
all you need is the blank spout cover and to unbolt the rod assembly.
you would have to spend an hour putting a stand together for the pot and bolting it down, but you could also make another stand and swap the pot back and forth, put the rod assembly back in, and use it for both operations.

 

[freebullet]

It's much slower than a bottom pour for me so far. The additional hand movements make keeping a rhythm going necessary or production rate drops. It's simply more work with your hands than bottom pouring.

 

[Dale53]

I started out ladle pouring, like most, but as soon as I learned to cast LOTS of bullets I went bottom pour. I shot BPCR Silhouette for about 15 years and learned to bottom pour the large bullets, too (well over 500 gr. 45's) as well as my pistol bullets. I get MUCH more production that allowed me to spend more time on the range instead of in my shop.

I shot a good bit of Schuetzen bench rest and learned to cast REALLY good bullets in a decent time frame - all bottom pour.

Now, due to vision problems I am limited to pistol and revolver but pour match grade bullets using multi-cavity moulds. My targets reflect really GOOD bullets.

FWIW
Dale53

 

[RicinYakima]

I started casting bullets in 1962 for the Civil War Centennial with a ladle and Dixie mould. When I started Bullseye pistol shooting in 1971 I went with the Lee bottom pour. But benchrest cast bullet rifle shooting brought me back to ladle, just for the production rate. Only perfect bullets could count, so ladle pouring gives me about 95% useable bullets, but bottom pouring only about 85%.

 

[Rick]

That's been pretty much my experience, I get a higher percentage of keepers when ladle casting. Even if it's a bit slower the higher rate of keepers more than makes up for it. Also proper fluxing, not just fluxing but proper fluxing is more critical when bottom pouring to make sure there is nothing in the alloy near the bottom that will go out the spout.

 

[Duckiller]

I have never cast a boolit with a ladle! I have a small ladle that I got at a gun show several years ago. Every time I try to use it the lead freezes up in the bowl of the ladle. Not sure what temp my lead is at but it works well with bottom pour into Ideal/Lyman and Lee moulds. Some are frosted and some are shiny. Most boolits are 0.310 t0 0.458. Do some that are 0.257 and 7mm. Before I quit casting I would like to cast a few boolits with a ladle. Any suggestion as to what I may be doing wrong will be greatly appreciated. No big rush on suggestions. I don't intend to quit any time soon, just have a good supply of boolits. Thank you for suggestions.

 

[fiver]

heat in the ladle.
I have cast with my alloy at 625-f using a ladle.
I just had to be patient and wait for everything to come up to temp before getting started.

 

[Brad]

Soon as the lead in the pot melts I dump in the ladle. This lets it heat as the lead gets the extra 50 to 100 degrees in needs to really flow well. Take out the lable, flux well, then put still hot ladle back in for a few minutes to let everything get to the right temp.

A PID opened my eyes to what happens when a cool ladle is dumped into the pot. Mine shows a 30 degree or more drop in temp on my RCBS 20 pounder. Granted, that is a 2 Rowell ladle.

 

[35 shooter]

I started casting for handguns in the 70's, but only started casting for centerfire rifles a couple of years ago. In all that time i had bottom poured with a 10 lb. lee pot i bought in the 70's.
Somehow i had wound up with a lyman ladle along the line and about 3 months ago gave it a try.
After 3 or 4 pours i took to it like a duck to water lol.

Seemed i had best results holding the ladle about a 1/2" above the mould for best fill out along with a geneous sprue. I was very surprised how well it went for my first time with a ladle. Actually it's kind of addictive, though it was a bit of an adventure trying to do it with the small lee bottom pour pot.
By the time the pot was half empty, the pour spout got in the way big time!
Definitly has me thinking of getting a bigger pot for ladling.