Marlin 1895 .45-70

[oscarflytyer]

I'm probably the only guy in the county who does. But, I know of only one other .45-70 shooter and he prefers
IMR 3031.

I started with the Lee 405 HB bullet and Waters' Pet Load of 38.5 gr of I-3031 chrono'd at 1350 fps. Accurate/mild/deer slayer - done...

I DO have 2 of Michael's molds (300 and 350 iirc). Intend to see what might work, but... That HBRN is a deer thumper as long as you put the RN IN the shoulder and NOT in the lungs! Lung shot will kill, but the hide and seek part SUCKS! I always hit them in the shoulder, but a buddy borrowed it and (and I forgot to tell him shoulder shot! - MY fault!) a lung shot with a slow RN and the deer has no clue for awhile it is dead running... and with the RN - blood trail from lung trail S U C K S!

 

[fiver]

I am a firm believer in MEPLAT size, and the slower the bullet travels the bigger the meplat needs to be when hunting.
RN's just kinda work their way through flesh like a worm letting everything roll out and around then come back again with no real permanent bruising of the surrounding area.
a flat nose bulldozes it's way through shoving stuff aside and making a radial wound [bruising] channel that is about 4-5 times it's diameter.
nt only that but the flat point will push the offside skin out further before tearing it's way through and letting the skin spring back [bigger exit hole]
if you got some mush to the front of the bullet WeLLLL [Samantha the witch well here] you get an even larger reward, and a lot shorter walk to the body.

now having said that, if you run your bullets at speeds much over 2000 fps you start looking for a much smaller flat point meplat and as a bonus you can run a bit stronger alloy if you keep the tin down to a realistic level.

 

[BudHyett]

Reloder #7 for medium and high velocity, Unique for light loads in my Marlins and Siamese Mauser.

 

[RBHarter]

The wound described by Fiver has been my experience also .
I shot a cotton tail with a 38 RN 158 it never made a sound just had 2 holes in it and broken hips the next one was a mess with a 358-158 . I doubt that the rib hit going in was a big deal at 875 fps on a cottontail .

45 Colts the variations of the 454424 do lots more damage in the chest cavity of hogs that the 452-255 Lee at 1050 fps MV a study of 6 at 4&2 isn't conclusive nor 1 each rabbits by any means but I'm sold on big flat big hole .

I did do one alloy expansion test in game and a 200 gr 30 cal that turns itself into .600 dia mushroom at 1900 fps makes as much wreckage and an almost identical wound to a Hornady #3033 150 BTSP at 2690 fps ...... You know in case that comes up . The cast was a not quite .07 flat on more or less a spitzer paper patched ..... 1900 was all I could get with alloy and twist and still get pretty mushrooms and 1.5 MOA . 1900 was the minimum threshold for the legal 1000# @100 yd so it was 1900 fps even if 1830 was all it would do in the cold . Never was questioned about it .

 

[CWLONGSHOT]

This is largely because hydro static shock (liquifying organs infront of the bullet with its "wave" dosent occur untill about 2200-2400 fps. About 1800 ish is a lower threshold where there is also a pressure wave.

I agree 100% in meplat size in a hunting bullet under 1800 fps!!!!

Been proven to me ten times over on game animals.

CW

 

[Ian]

This is largely because hydro static shock (liquifying organs infront of the bullet with its "wave" dosent occur untill about 2200-2400 fps. About 1800 ish is a lower threshold where there is also a pressure wave.

Interestingly, 2200 FPS is exactly the point at which cast bullet nose shape starts to become irrelevant, assuming a malleable alloy to begin with. The Lee 312-155 and 160 will mushroom nicely and in a controlled fashion above that speed, as will the MP 311-180 Silhouette solid and any other similar bullets. Below 2200, not so much. I factor that in with muzzle velocity, ballistic coefficient, and hunting distance.

 

[RicinYakima]

It is reported that the British Army doctors began reporting "hydraulic" shock when they changed from black powder .303 ammo to cordite .303 ammo. Abdominal wounds from the Martini 577/450 and black powder .303 just made holes, but the new ammo did something different. The Afghans and Pathans died much faster in the 1890's. FWIW

 

[L Ross]

Interestingly, 2200 FPS is exactly the point at which cast bullet nose shape starts to become irrelevant, assuming a malleable alloy to begin with. The Lee 312-155 and 160 will mushroom nicely and in a controlled fashion above that speed, as will the MP 311-180 Silhouette solid and any other similar bullets. Below 2200, not so much. I factor that in with muzzle velocity, ballistic coefficient, and hunting distance.

Ian, impact velocity or muzzle velocity?

 

[CWLONGSHOT]

Neither, Bullet/ projectile velocity.

 

[Ian]

Impact velocity. With the exception of my .30-30s, I set range limits on my 30-caliber and smaller hunting rigs based on about 2200 fps minimum impact velocity.

This was about 75-80 yards, full run, quartering away at about 1 o'clock, 30-caliber pointy bullet, air-cooled wheelweights plus 1% added tin, estimated impact velocity right at 2400 fps, in behind the right shoulder low (hole clearly visible), through the heart, and blew an honest golf ball sized hole through the sternum:



Here's what 1950 fps looks like at 180 yards, exit hole similar to entrance, ate pretty much right up to the holes: