Ruger No. 1 350 Legend ?

[Tomme boy]

It appears WRA has finally settled on .357 as bullet diameter

The bullets were never 0.357" and still are not. The whole cartridge and the way it was made was on purpose. They could have used the 357-8 bullets but that is a two problem issue. If you use the bullets for a 357 then they will be two fragile and will blow apart. If you use the 358 bullets then it is the opposite. You might as well shoot a fmj as they won't expand. So what they had to do was expand the base to give the case a little taper to help extract in all types of firearms. So that means using a 9mm bullet made to work at the velocities that the cartridge works in.

This is not the first time they have tried this. 350 wsl is the first run at this. And this ammo is usually the only ammo that has been available for the last year at stores. I have picked up more of this brass over the last year than the previous year it has been available. I usually find a few pieces every time I go to the range.

 

[SWISS SHOOTER]

I believe the converse to be objectively true as well. If either HAS and advantage, it's minimal enough to be inconsequential and personal preference will tip the scales one way for one shooter and the other way for another shooter.

You asked "Whatcha think?" Most times, you don't even have to ask and people will tell you what they think, but you did ask.

I've stated what I think. I wouldn't do it myself and I stated reasons why I'd do something else BALLISTICALLY EQUAL.

I was as careful as I could be to not sound as if I were disparaging your idea by telling you what I think, but maybe I failed at that.

Build it and be happy.

Thanks. No you did not fail. As for the general responses I was a bit disappointed in how so many went so far afield (358 Winchester, 35-30, zero knowledge of the 350 Legend) but that's how open forums work. If the 357 MAX were a well supported cartridge and balistically equal, I would go with it. (from the guy who shoots a 400 Whelen, 41 Swiss and 22-06 !) I haven't even bought the CHP 357 yet so there is no rush. Appreciate your honest and well supported comments.

 

[SWISS SHOOTER]

The bullets were never 0.357" and still are not. The whole cartridge and the way it was made was on purpose. They could have used the 357-8 bullets but that is a two problem issue. If you use the bullets for a 357 then they will be two fragile and will blow apart. If you use the 358 bullets then it is the opposite. You might as well shoot a fmj as they won't expand. So what they had to do was expand the base to give the case a little taper to help extract in all types of firearms. So that means using a 9mm bullet made to work at the velocities that the cartridge works in.

This is not the first time they have tried this. 350 wsl is the first run at this. And this ammo is usually the only ammo that has been available for the last year at stores. I have picked up more of this brass over the last year than the previous year it has been available. I usually find a few pieces every time I go to the range.

Tommy I followed the whole early debate on the allegation of .356 bullets. I never saw it supported by pics of a torn down cartridge and a micometer. So IMHO it was an internet legend unsupported. The current Winchester page on the cartridge says this: "

Straight-Walled Cartridge Specs​

Bullet Diameter: .357 inch
Shell case Length: 1.71 inches

If were it NOT true and so easily tested why would they lie ?

See for yourself. https://winchester.com/350-Legend

 

[Bret4207]

The responses I got did don't meet the test of logic. Simple as that.

Some suggested a 358 Winchester - very nasty in a 6.5 pound rifle.
The MAX has no advantage over a 350 Legend IN A RUGER NO. 1.

Whose logic? If YOU want it for YOUR rifle, why ask anyone else? Where's the logic in that? You seem to want people to tell you you're right. Okay- you are right. I'm done.

 

[SWISS SHOOTER]

Whose logic? If YOU want it for YOUR rifle, why ask anyone else? Where's the logic in that? You seem to want people to tell you you're right. Okay- you are right. I'm done.

Lets try an analogy. I post saying what do you think about about putting a rebuilt Ford 289 in my 65 Cobra. I'm told I need a twin turbo 427 side oiler. Sorry you are stuck in NY we left 22 years ago for WY.

 

[Joshua]

Poor analogy. You are trying to put a Toyota inline six into a Ford Ranger. It will work once you figure it out, but it’s ugly and your neighbor across the street thinks you’re crazy.

 

[Rick]

Play nice gentlemen or don't play at all . . . . Nuf said.

 

[Joshua]

Okey Dokey

 

[Rick]

Okey Dokey

Wasn't referring to you but glad you agree.

 

[SWISS SHOOTER]

Wasn't referring to you but glad you agree.

Likewise me. Thanks.

 

[CWLONGSHOT]

I enjoy both of my 350 Legends. I know exactly what they are and can do.
I have (many of us have) torn then down measured various offerings from various manufacturers. I have chamber casts and I have driven lead balls down the bore to know diameters.

As stated, Winchester seriously, screwed the pooch on this one. See its built as a straight wall restricted caliber. Only some stated dont just say 35 cal... Some actually STIPULATE .357 and larger because they do not want some yaehoo taking there 9mm carbine out for Bambi. Winchester made these as a long 9mm. (9x45) IMHO because they are ignorant to realities of the "game". They banked on the 9mm craze enveloping this with Similarly ignorant open arms.... Sammi saved the day as they offer a small variance. Something like +- .0015 or .002. So Winchester skates by and has secured acceptance in all restricted states.

You dont need mine or ANYONES word for this. Your fully capable to measure your own. (As many of us have)

I/we all respect your wants and desires as we all have them. They dont have to make sence they are desires. But when you mention reasons and "we know" they are true, we try to tell /show you that some Of the bases your using for your reasoning is flawed/not true. Its just us trying to HELP YOU!

I went from love to hate to serious dislike for the lunacy that needlessly went into the making of this caliber, to accepting it Largely based in the fact that I am a accomplished reloader and caster and have full ability to make this into a useable caliber.
As for the Maxi, I bought a 357 Max about 1986/7.( About when it cane out) I have had a few so chambered since. Ill be buried with one of them. Need I explain more how much I like and respect the caliber? I have shot coyotes, pigs & many deer with them. I know bullets from 110-270g and a friend has taken bears with my cast bullets in a Maxi. One was a 270g another a 230g. Both loaded past factory loading and pressures but from rifles fully capabul of handling these loads. I hoped the Legend would simply allow same ballistics in a repeater and largely (with cast bullets) it has.

Im sure you will like and appreciate the legend in your Ruger. It wont beat ya up and should be accurate. Good luck with it!
CW

 

[Ian]

I can think of one more reason for the Legend conversion of a #1: You'd have the only one.

 

[fiver]

ever.


the poor 350 has been beaten down to a flat oil spot around here.
the conclusion of 49 guys is the 358 Max, 2-3 dammit this thing sucks, after trying it,,,, and a couple of I'm gonna make this sucker work if it kills me's.

 

[Tomme boy]

Tommy I followed the whole early debate on the allegation of .356 bullets. I never saw it supported by pics of a torn down cartridge and a micometer. So IMHO it was an internet legend unsupported. The current Winchester page on the cartridge says this: "

Straight-Walled Cartridge Specs​

Bullet Diameter: .357 inch
Shell case Length: 1.71 inches

If were it NOT true and so easily tested why would they lie ?

See for yourself. https://winchester.com/350-Legend

They are not lying. They are just not telling the whole truth. To meet the requirements of some states, they are using the 0.003" variance that SAAMI allows to get around the laws that state a minimum of a 0.357" bullet.

I never saw the 9mm bullet as a hindrance as others as I don't have any investment in any 357 or larger bullets. That is why others hate this so much as they can't use the stuff they already have. Without extra sizing of the bullets they already have anyway.

I will tell you that this cartridge will go from no pressure signs to case head destroying pressures with no warning signs. Primers can still show no signs of pressure and you will be able to put a new primer in the case with finger pressure.

And you have to be careful if you are using starline brass as the web floor is just a hair too low and you can end up with a case that looks like a belted mag. The web of the case sticks outside of the chamber right at the chamfer. The case will flow right around that chamfer.

 

[fiver]

they got around the fish and game by typing the larger 358 diameter on their boxes.
this just gave the users the ignorance plea, and the game wardens got to turn a blind eye because the box said so,,,,, and I ain't got no calipers in my truck.

 

[SWISS SHOOTER]

ever.


the poor 350 has been beaten down to a flat oil spot around here.
the conclusion of 49 guys is the 358 Max, 2-3 dammit this thing sucks, after trying it,,,, and a couple of I'm gonna make this sucker work if it kills me's.

I find it amazing that a cartridge that exceeds the 357 Max in all ways AND provides performance close to the 35 Remington. 350, 180 gr at 2100, 35 200 gr flextip at 2225 from a much longer barrel. Put that 35 Rem in a typical 20" Marlin 336 and try to convince anyone any deer shot within 200 yards would know the difference. Finally, find a 35 Rem in an AR. I'm all done trying to convince anyone. The facts speak for me.

 

[Ian]

I find it amazing that a cartridge that exceeds the 357 Max in all ways

Is this actually true or are you quoting the rather "optimistic" advertising hyperbole? I own neither and don't really care, it just seems that the people who DO own both say they're roughly equivalent right down to loading data and the Legend won't make its advertised numbers without being loaded so much over maximum sane pressure that the brass self-decaps upon ejection.

If it was mine I’d leave it as is. In fact the first rifle I build from scratch will most likely be a rook rifle/single shot carbine in 38 Special or 357 Mag

If I had that No.1 I would have to find a new project to build.

But if I did mess with it, I would go with 358 Win. I like having a minimum of 500 pieces of brass for every rifle I own. I would have no qualms about reforming .308 to make that brass.

I've had the wantsies for a four-pound .30 Badger falling block rifle for some time. Buckets of .38 brass on-hand make that hard to pass up. That will probably be my first scratch-build as well. Agree totally that I'd have to find a new project rifle too and leave that little 357 Maggot just the way it is, in fact I bought a nice JM 336 with intent to make my 7-30 Waters since I was a kid dream rifle, but it has a really nice pipe on it and shoots like a laser so I can't bring myself to mess with it. If I "needed" anything bigger and meaner than my .35 Remington I'd just reach for my Tikka that's chambered in a particularly bad-ass cartridge which is a 35 Whelen necked down to .30-caliber, you may have heard of it. That or grab my Shiloh 1874 Sharps in 45-90 WCF. I live in Texas and as long as it's bigger than a .22 rimfire they let you kill deer with it.

 

[fiver]

i have that same 35 whelen necked down cartridge too, but mine has a more slightly sloped shoulder.
it flat slapped every deer we got this year [between 100 and 200 plus sumthin yards] and the recoil wasn't the least bit objective.

anyway.
it's your money, spend it how you want.
just don't say there wasn't two pages of people sayin they wouldn't spend theirs that way.

 

[John]

I find it amazing that a cartridge that exceeds the 357 Max in all ways AND provides performance close to the 35 Remington. 350, 180 gr at 2100, 35 200 gr flextip at 2225 from a much longer barrel. Put that 35 Rem in a typical 20" Marlin 336 and try to convince anyone any deer shot within 200 yards would know the difference. Finally, find a 35 Rem in an AR. I'm all done trying to convince anyone. The facts speak for me.

Well, I have the max in a 10" contender and a 22" Handi rifle. With 180-220 gr bullets the Max ties or surpasses my 336 Marlin 35 Remington. The Marlin beats it with 250 gr bullets but that is another story. An acquaintance has a 350 Legend in Michigan. He can't get his AR to stabilize anything over 150 grains, and cast has to be pc'd and hard. Surplus 9mm bullets 147 gr JHP or cast sized to .355 shoot well, 125 are even better. If that is useful for you go for it. If you like heavy bullets, keep looking. There really are no flies on the standard 357 loading in a rifle.

 

[SWISS SHOOTER]

I am NOT building the project OKAY ????

And if you think any 10" 357 MAX exceeds the velocity of a 20" 336 35 Remington, I think you need to buy a chronograph.



180 gr

XTP
(HDY)

CCI 450 Mag

1680
(Accurate)

REM

1.595"

2.025"

Powder:

25.5 gr

28.3 gr



Vel.:

1,724

1,884



Press.:



39,500

0.357

180 gr

FN
(Speer)

REM 9½

Leverevolution
(Hodgdon)

REM

1.910"

2.470"

Powder:

40.0 gr

45.0 gr



Vel.:

2,044

2,302



Press.:

26,700

33,900

0.358"

1884 a'int 2302 unless you're loads are beyond published max.